Re: Eliminate draft tube options
Stick your compressor air line into that hole and see what sprays out the other openings in block, coolant or oil.
It could get messy ;) |
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A couple of mysteries solved.
1) the bolt on the side that I was asking about goes into the coolant side of things, not the oil galleries. With the water pump already off, blowing air resulting in a hollow sound and air escaping through the large opening for the water pump. 2) a week or two ago I was asking about replacing the oil line in the lifter/push rod side of the engine. I used Mr. Google on the interwebs to find a company that sells a NOS oil line replacement kit. The photo below is the old line at the top and the box and the kit on the lower half of the photo. The new kits uses compression fitting versus the flared ones on the engine. The next step is to ensure that the thread pitch on the two connecting fitting are the same, they look to be. Attachment 2326153 |
Re: Eliminate draft tube options
I thought that block plug was gonna be a coolant hole.
Not trying to be picking at your new purchase but the rocker oil line could have been replaced easily with a length of brake line. Maybe even easier to bend to fit. Since you have the new on though, go for it. I recommend you straighten the line out before you start. |
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yep, good point. for a lurker hiding in the weeds though......
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Back in the 70's a buddy of mine built his own engine stand to hold up the 426 Hemi out of his Roadrunner. He drilled the bolt pattern of the bellhousing mounting surface of the block on a piece of 1/2 inch steel plate that was big enough to cover the back of the engine and then welded a piece of heavy structural pipe to it to stick in the stand. He had a cut out for the crank. Rather crude looking but he was the best welder in town and it was strong.
If you were to take a piece of 1/2 inch plate ( I don't think 3/8 is strong enough). you could cut out the inside of the pattern of the back and drill the holes in the right spots to bolt it to the block and then drill 4 holes on the corners of the plate to bolt to the arms on the stand. That would probably take going to the scrap yard that sells remnant pieces rather than the steel yard. |
Re: Eliminate draft tube options
a lot of engine stands place the pivot point, where the tube is that goes into the actual stand, fairly close to the crankshaft. that may be ok for a V8 or a small inline but these engines are tall and heavy. that means there is a lot of weight above the crank so the engine always wants to rotate that heavy top section towards the bottom or try to topple the stand over. most of the el cheapo deluxe engine stands are not that wide at their base, really, so I recommend to be carefull with your design and ensure you have a little help when you rotate the engine on the stand, it can easily get away on you and you could end up with the engine on the floor, or worse , it could grab you on the way down. maybe working on it while on the hydraulic table wouldn't be a bad thing after all. if placing it on a stand try to get the pivot point as close to the balance point on the engine as possible. remember that when the head goes back on it will get even heavier and top heavy.
I'm sure you have thought of all this stuff but I can say from experience that the last 235 I had on a stand I realized how stinkin heavy those old inliners are. my engine stand is incorporated into a leg on the corner of my heavy steel workbench and has a slip in "foot tube" to help take the weight of the engine. I have had many engines on that stand but that 235, wow, it fought the weight of the workbench like a seesaw. i had to add some bracing and work more carefully for sure. |
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any updates on the engine, engine stand, work in progress?
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The engine is out and I've been cleaning it up a bit. I'm about ready to remove the valve train, pull the push rods and lifters out, so that I can pull the cam shaft to get to the front timing plate. I want to media blast the timing plate to clean it up before painting it with high temp engine paint. I thought about getting it powder coated, but don't think it would hold up with the engine heat. In the meantime, I called my engine builder new friend and he managed to contact Covid while in the ER with his wife around the New Year. She is recovering slowly and given his age, so is he. When we spoke, he asked me to give him two weeks to get back on his feet. I'm going to check in on him this coming week. I've also been using this time to re-do some of my original tasks (wiring harness and brake lines) since while removing the engine, I realized I may have over complicated a few things. So I'm cleaning those items up. As it turns out Santa decided to deliver me a late Christmas present. He heard that I like Chevy's and decided maybe the 1953 truck needed a modern garage-mate. Funny thing about Santa, he still made me pay for the gift. LOL Attachment 2329784 |
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dammmm, you must been a really good boy!
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sooo-eeet!
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I'm just checking in for the first time, just clicking on the last page. Is the Corvette the one with the road draft tube issue? :lol:
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haha, if it was me i would be driving so fast I would have to keep both hands on the wheel and wouldn't be able to reach the window switch to close the window. it would be drafty. haha
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Ok, I have a bit of a short update and then, as usual, a question. I've removed the valve train, then removed and kept track of the position of both the push rods and lifters. They all look relatively pristine, given that the previous owner had the engine completely rebuilt before he ever got to run it......fast forward fifteen years and I've run it for maybe a total of ten hours, if that. My questions is now that the push rods and lifter have been removed how do I remove the cam shaft? Attachment 2330059 Attachment 2330060 |
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two retaining bolts you can get to through those holes?
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I'll give that a try in the morning. Thank you. |
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first, ensure the fuel pump is out or the cam will be held back by the fuel pump drive
second, ensure the lifters are all out so they don't interfere third, check the timing marks so you know how they line up fourth, turn the engine over so the holes in the cam gear line up with the bolts that hold the cam thrust plate onto the block. the thrust plate is on the cam before the gear is pressed on, along with a small spacer so the cam gear bottoms out on the spacer before it bottoms out on the cam gear and makes zero tolerance fifth, remove the bolts that retain the thrust plate 6th, carefully pull the cam out while supporting it so as not to mark the cam bearings |
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First - not using a mechanical pump, I have an under bed tank with an in-tank pump Second - lifters and push rods out and in numbered slots in original order Third - timing marks lined up and marked with a white oil paint pen Fourth - I will line up the bolt heads tomorrow, although from memory I think at least one of them is already lined up Fifth - will do this in the morning Sixth - I've never done it myself, but have watched multiple cams removed (on all my car TV shows of course) Thanks to both you and Lee for pointing out the obvious (but not to me). |
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when you have it all apart and clean I recommend using a long strip of course sandpaper, like the ones used for autobody work, on a hard flat surface, like a strip of 3/4" plywood, to clean the gasket surfaces. a roloc disc is used by a lot of guys but if you aren't careful they can easily remove material from the block and, especially on a head gasket surface, can make for a possible head gasket leak. I have a strip of plywood cut a little shorter than the sandpaper, so the paper can be bent around the ends of the plywood and staped on. I use 80 grit paper for gasket surfaces but I run the paper over a sharp edge of something first, before I use it on a surface, to remove the "high spots" of grit so as not to groove the actual gasket surface. to get the surface ready first, like to clean off any hard to remove old gasket that could be remaining, I use an old 1 1/2" wood chisel with a clean sharp edge and no burrs on the edge.
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The not so good news (so far) is that one of the flush screws that hold the timing plate is being resistant. The two on the right came out without much fuss. The one on the left is still in. I've soaked it from inside the opening to the crank with PB Blaster and hope that over night is loosens up. It is the last thing holding the timing plate on. Attachment 2330290 |
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heat the screw head with a torch, like the hotest torch you have or can borrow-oxy/acetylene would be great, so it heats the screw head fast but not the surrounding area and then leave it until the whole area is cold. then get a large flat screwdriver blade with no handle, just the blade part, and place that in the slot in the screw head. the alternative is a large flat screwdriver that you can plut a wrench on the shank or an adjustable wrench on the flart blade.hold that with a vice grip or the wrench if applicable and then hammer it a few times. don't smash it, just hammer it a few times. after a couple of hits put some torque on the bit with the vice grips or wrench and hit it again with the hammer as you try to turn it. it may have been locktited in place or installed with an impact screwdriver because the engine builder wouldn't want it to come out by itself and cause disaster. if that doesn't work try heating it again and use the same method asap while it's still hot. worse case scenario drill or grind the head off carefully. I have had some luck with welding a nut onto things like that but it is not easy to get a good weld when down inside a small nut bore
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I'd try one of these old school impact drivers, had good luck with them and screws:
https://www.amazon.com/CRAFTSMAN-Imp...dp/B07R96M9VW/ twist as hard as you can then wack it with a hammer If that fails and heating is required, I'd focus on the edge of the plate near the screw head to expand the hole around the head, or general heat of the block as close to the screw as I could. By the time you reach for the drill you know your havin fun |
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i think I know the style of impact screwdriver you are talking about LG, I have 2 of them and they work well. i couldn't get the link to work. I think the screws are too close to the crank gear to fit the socket that holds the srew driver bit, unless the crank is out I suppose. thats why I mentioned to use a screwdriver and a vice grip, same theory. I have had good luck with the method I mentioned, even on really big bolts found in the heavy duty equipment world and especially on bolts that were loctited in place. of course if there is room to heat the block in the area then that works well too but I hate to use spot heat on cast iron because sometimes the iron can crack around the heated area due to uneven heating.
one thing I wonder about is whether the crank can be removed with the plate still on. if so, check and see if there are dowels holding the plate as well, for lining the plate up in a certain spot. if not, and there is only a single screw holding it, possibly the plate could be rotated slightly and that may also start to turn the screw head. not sure whats on the backside of the plate so dunno if that would work. I have found that heating the head of the screw/bolt and allowing to cool seems to work most of the time. I think the theory is that the screw expands fastee than the block and then shrinks a little smallee than it was before. like welding sheet metal and seeing how it shrinks when it cools. that seems to break loose any rust or loctite. then striking it several times helps even more and using torque while striking will usually do the job. worth a try if you don't have an impact screwdriver try this link for an impact screwdriver https://www.amazon.com/TEKTON-2905-8.../dp/B000NPPATS |
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Here is a better view of the cracked crank shaft end cap.
Attachment 2330448 And a before and after picture of the timing plate after some cleaning. Attachment 2330449. Attachment 2330450 |
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This thread is more of a build thread now that is lots and lots of tangents. The title is a bit misleading. I would change the title to something more as to what this thread has morphed into. That way when others are searching it matches to all the other goodness in the thread
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Re: Draft tube, oil leak, cracked end cap, pulled engine
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The short version of this long thread is that I wanted to eliminate the draft tube. Then installed a PVC fitting in the draft tube block opening. Began running the engine, saw oil spilling out (not drips) and began tracing the leak. The end result, is pulled engine, removed valve train, push rods, lifters, cam shaft (with bolts holing the thrust plate), then removed timing plate to reveal the full damage to the end cap. I will amend the title, but at this point it would be hard to find a title that addresses all of the issues covered so far. Thanks. |
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ah, c'mon, how did you get those screws out? lol.
dont amwndthe title as you will lose those who have been following. good to see it's apart |
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sorry, I meant to say dont amend the title because you may lose some who have been following because they remember the title. if you do amend the title just put the name of the new title thread , and a link to it, at the last post in this thread so guys can find it easily
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It really hurts to see that cap. It's unfortunate but... buying a used engine is always a gamble. This teardown will give you a chance to confirm the rest of the engine is in great condition and you will have peace of mind that is reassembled to your standards.
Nice job cleaning the timing plate. I would probably think about replacing the well used countersunk screws in the timing plate with Allen head screws if they are available. Following up on the comment about Roloc discs, it's probably a bad idea to clean any internal engine parts with abrasive discs. The abrasive material erodes and ends up all over inside the engine. Better to use a bristle disc. https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51IIQlQakpL.jpg |
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when I do an engine tear down I usually clean all the gasket surfaces on the block and head(s) and run a tap through all the threaded holes and then clean it all thoroughly. if it is getting dunked I still do all the mating surfaces first even though they may need or get a touch up after dunking. I try to use hot water when doing the final rinse, because it dries faster, and then I use a light oil like wd40 sprayed on the bare metal so it doesn't rust right away. when drying off after this I use compressed air and start with the blind holes to blow everything out, then oil galleries and cylinder bores and finally the large surfaces. then a wrap in plastic or a garbage bag to cover things up so they don't collect dust while waiting for assembly. this way all the grindings, rag lint, etc etc is washed away. dish soap works well on the cylinders to clean after a honing. oven cleaner works well on the cast parts as long as there is no aluminum or bearings in the area and then plan to wash it all well after.
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The cleaning was done with a Vapor Hone that I have access to (120 psi air, water and zinc oxide) it does a nice job. The same facility also just added a powder coating oven, so some of the small part (no engine block ones) will get a nice coat of powder. Thanks for the link on the disc, I'll order one tonight. |
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Spoke with my engine builder buddy this evening. He's recovering from Covid and is about to get back on things for me. We discussed several alternatives and I expect to get my engine to him in the next two weeks. In the meantime, I'm busy cleaning up my wiring, brake lines and generally cleaning the engine block. |
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I've noticed in working on this engine that many of the gasket surfaces (not the oil pan) that the previous owner used a blue silicon type gasket sealer. I've not seen anything like this before and wonder if that is something that I should look into. Right now, I use either the "Right Stuff" and/ore Permatex RTV type sealer. But the blue silicon material seems to seal better and frankly has been easier to remove.
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Re: Eliminate draft tube options
While you have it apart you might as well check ring gaps too.
Boosted motors need a slightly tighter gap. |
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