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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Nice plates. Some U.S. states allow "year of manufacture" original plates to be run.
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Now you gotta put a 383 in it :lol:
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
From what I saw/paid-attention-to, it seemed to fit fine, though none of the holes truly lined up. The two sides, from the same supplier, were not symmetrical.
It's fitment is going to relate to the outer rocker fitment, so it's important to get them both right, and make whatever changes you have to. You need to go into this knowing that they aren't going to fit; you kinda have to accept that. I bought the full-length ones, because I didn't to have to deal with a seam in the middle, as so many others had to do. I've also seen the one-piece inner rockers not fit either (too long or too short). I also may have totally overlooked a fitment issue because of my inexperience. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
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I was trying to get all this done and in prime and paint before cold air hit... LOL ya, that is not happening, BUT I did by a Mini-Split Heat Pump for the shop so i can do away with propane heater. So know i am a bit more relaxed and not in such a hurry, i want to take my time. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Cab corners are welded.
Like an idiot, I decided that I should oxy-acetylene weld these in. My reasoning, is that gas welding leaves the most malleable weld, (theoretically) distorts less as you heat the metal up more gradually, and cool it down more gradually. In theory, it is quicker, as you do not need to stack a bunch of beads together, but you can give'er in one pass (once tacked, of course), and you don't have to grind the welds down, and there's a whole lot less shrinkage since there's a whole lot less bead to contract. At least that's the theory. The reality was really more of a slow-paced but-whuppin. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...e1-672x317.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...2s-672x378.jpg They ain't gorgeous, but they are solid, and they actually ended up fitting relatively well. And yes - there was less shrinkage/distortion. MIG is so much easier, and while it may be more work, MIG feels more productive. It also took quite some time to stretch/shrink parts of the cab wall. That was un-fun. Also filled two antenna holes (shortwave? two way? CB?) that had been caulked and plated many moons ago. And filled the fuel filler hole. I bent the flange into the opening and planished it flat, then cut a patch from some e-coated offcuts, and gas welded that in. The gas welding certainly is WAY more malleable than MIG. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...2s-672x378.jpg These'll be good enough for a skim of filler. It ain't gonna be master metal craftsmanship. Not yet, anyway. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
I'm glad you can keep working on the truck through all of the challenges of starting a new school year.
Also, big thanks for the real world pros and cons on OA welding...I've often wondered if I should learn how to do it. I think I'll stick with MIG for my purposes. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
OA welding is definitely a skill to develop. I have done a lot of OA welding, brazing, and even aluminum welding with it. I also have a TIG, which is directly relatable to OA with the addition of a foot pedal to control your heat.
OA takes some discipline to learn, and a keep eye to watch where your heat is going. As fare as bodywork goes, I would recommend MIG if you have limited OA experience. It's just easier in many ways. I think I'm just taking this on because it's "a better way to go." Masterable skill. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Inner and outer door bottoms arrived yesterday, but household repairs and maintenance happened today. There's always tomorrow. Ordered from Bill's Truck Shop in Ontario this time.
Surprisingly: 3 months faster delivery. I might order from them again. (grin) |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Tentatively fitted the driveshaft to see how I need to modify the top of the X, so I can modify the cab to fit.
Fuel lines showed up. -8 for fuel feed (yeas, that's half-inch fuel line!), and -6 for return. PTFE to last longer, stink less, and be E85 friendly. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...8s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
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I did buy the AN fitting install tool from Summit - Koul Tool. Crazy the cost but if it helps with the build of the fittings im in. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Filled the last rust repair on the cab. Thus endeth cab rust repair.
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...5s-672x378.jpg Started in on the door bottoms. Measured, cut, fit, and blasted as far as I could reach on the inside. Ran out of daylight. With the door bottom removed, I could get a dolly in to planish the door-swung-too-far door crease. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
It took HOURS blasting the door, but it felt good; I could see progress. Once I started double-sifting the used crushed glass (sifted it into a bucket, then sifted back into the machine), I had almost zero clogs. Machine works well.
Door bottom is tacked, and two coats of epoxy primer rolled inside. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...6s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...8s-672x378.jpg Also formed some actual drains since the replacement bottoms came with zip. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...7s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Repaired torn, bent, and fatigue-cracked West Coast Mirror holes, fitted the bottom door skin, then sprayed epoxy primer on everything in anticipation of final welding some time this week. Before closing it up, I'm going to run some Eastwood Internal Frame Coating through the cavities in the door.
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...9s-672x378.jpg The stand is my "Exhaust Pipe Stands" for doing exhaust, which double as the kids' Badminton net stands. In cleaning my spray gun, I broke the mounting bolt for the air flow adjusting screw. Turns out it's 5/16-UNF, with a 4.5x0.75mm thread inside. I machined a new one out of a bolt, but I need to get that tap as I don't have one. Should be able to fix it just fine. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
I tacked the inner bottom with MIG, but chose to finish weld in Oxy-Acetylene. Much better than my cab-corner experience, but I should not have tacked with MIG, I should have tacked with gas; the MIG tacks were much harder, and did not melt in nicely when I did the oxy-acet pass. The end result, though, was minimal distortion for sure, but I made the cut just below the strengthening rib so the rib could act as rigidity (and because the reproduction panel's rib was drunk).
Also, I'll share a couple of tools I made. First up, is my Hammer Hammer. Initially about 18" of 3/4" solid round, to help my planish the fuel filler hole patch, when I couldn't get a hammer in there. I used it as a hammer, and I used it as a dolly. Dealing with one of the West Coast Mirror holes, I cut about 1" off the end and welded it 90° to fit inside the window opening, and I hit it with a hammer to push metal out, and I used it as a dolly to hammer metal in. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...1s-672x378.jpg And then I made this one, to pull part of the window felt flange that I buggered fixing the aforementioned hole. This hammer-smacking-flange-putter-back-inator is just 1" flat bar. I welded a tang from a file so I can beat it with a hammer, to pull the wee flange back into place. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...0s-672x378.jpg The tang came from this tool I made, a slapping file, which does a grand job of persuading metal into perfection. Or perfect enough for a skim of filler in my case. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...2s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Nice, its always good to be able to make the "tool" that no one else makes are wants way to much money for it...
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Also fabricated my own door-panel-hammer. Local prices are $75 for one, but I have a stack of old hammers, some 5/8" steel bar, and a welder....
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
All those custom tools sure make everything easier. I haven't had to make my own tools yet, but I'm sure as I get farther along in the rust repair, I'll need to do something similar
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Installed the bottom door skin today, and spent pretty much forever trying to planish the weld.
All my four letter words had five syllables. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Grrrr.
I assumed the lower skin would fit right. It didn't. It isn't "curved" in the middle of the door, it's only curved at the flange. This resulted in a 3/8" valley below the weld. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...4s-672x378.jpg Before all you pro's point out the importance of planishing the weld, do know that this was gas welded, planished, and the weld is f-l-a-t. The center of the patch has no 'body" to it - it's just doing what it was bent to do. Straight at the weld: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...5s-672x378.jpg Then what - should I have English Wheeled it? I can't get right up to the flange with the wheel. Not impressed. May have to by full door skins. 3/8" gap half-way down the panel: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...9s-672x378.jpg Bottom is decent enough: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...0s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Dadgum, that's unfortunate
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
So I finally taught myself the French Wheel and made this:
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...1s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
That looks good from here. How does a French wheel compare to an English wheel?
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
It's not welded in yet, and I still have to make the flanges, but the bottom IS shaped into the correct curve all the way through. I'll try my hand at the flanges tomorrow. Or screw it up entirely.
A French Wheel looks just like an English Wheel, except you use a lot of French when you're working it. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
I must say that having the ability to create your own panel is pretty dang cool.
I know you have your door with you, but if there's any area of the flange that you need an extra reference for, I can snap a pic of my door |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Thanks, but I still have the unmolested other door, as well as the soon-to-be-not-used other patch.
What I need to figure out, is how to create the front and back flanges without destroying the panel shape. I can't put it in the brake, but I might be able to use the tipping wheel on the bead roller. I picked up the English Wheel from the local classifieds a couple years ago - one of the last of the tools I wanted for my shop. Some guy was selling it and a solvent tank for $250. The Wheel is an $825 wheel today. Not stupendously high quality wheel, but it works. I picked up a foot/shrinker/stretcher/stand a while back too - definitely worth its weight. I had been asking for a particular tool store's gift cards as gifts for years, and finally had enough to buy it. I think it was on sale at the time for about $325, it's now $530. You can do a simple vice or bench mount shrinker/stretcher and just change the jaws as needed, but I sure like having the two together operable by foot pedals - very convenient. All these tools I've collected over years and years, always on sale, and usually with gift cards. Many I've purchased used, and I have made many tools too (hydraulic press, tubing bender, finger brake...). |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Problem-Solver you are.
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Few of my tools are new.
But despite that, I maintain that, including myself, having all the gear and no idea, will still deliver zero. Your work, I keep following, so much value in the learning here. Thanks |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
The flanges got formed with the tipping wheel on the bead roller, then tweaked with a..... um..... it's a piece of 1/2" round bar with a 5/8" deep slot cut into it - I use it to fold sheet metal over, like a hem sort of. I don't know what they're called.
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...2s-672x378.jpg Tipping the flange also took the curve out of the ends of the panel, but the Shrinker brought it back. I marked 1" increments on the edges of the skin so I could know where to shrink it more "7/8/9" is easy to remember. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...5s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...7s-672x378.jpg I fiddled with the gap to make it as tight as possible so as to get a good weld in there. Zero gap = minimal distortion. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg So, if my wee tap came in so I can fix my HVLP Touch-Up gun, I should have some epoxy primer on the inside, ready for welding next weekend. Which is where I was at the start of -this- weekend. Woo hoo. - Cut the skin, plus about 1" extra for flanges - English Wheel some curve into the panel - Tipping Wheel on the Bead Roller to make the flanges - Shrink the flanges to put the curve back in. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
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Great job sir! I enjoy watching your progress and strive to be as polished as you are one day. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
New skin and new exposed inner frame is epoxy primered on the inside. Ready for welding on the weekend.
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
I picked up another half-sheet of 18ga this morning as I didn't have enough to do the passenger door with what I had.
Also stripped the passenger door down to bare. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
The door is now skinned. It didn't go the way I had planned, but it's on and it looks decent.
I intended to oxy-acetylene weld the skin, and to practice, I cut a piece of scrap 12" long in half, tacked it, planished it, and welded it together. Then cut it in half again in another spot, did it again. And again. I felt confident. But oxy-acetylene had other ideas. I tried and tried to make it submit, and finally - I snapped (Lose it. Heater. Smoker. Flurry to the solar plexus. The torch tip goes for it. I gave him so many lefts he was begging for a right.Uppercut. Jab. Roundhouse kick to the face. He's lying there in a puddle of his own excrement. I says "How's that?"), and MIG welded the skin on. It worked out fine. I do not have the metalworking skills to work the metal into perfection. And the more I try, the less patience I have for it. I -am- however, plenty good at filler. At any rate, here's the skin, installed: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...8s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...5s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...1s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...9s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...6s-672x378.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Good work Champ...
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Passenger door had a mild crease along its full width, which is going to be hard to hammer out (though not impossible). The bottom of the door seems much more solid than the driver's door, but it's ALWAYS a better idea to pull the skin off and just re-skin it. How else are you going to be able to deal with this rust? Rust between the frame and skin becomes bubbles after its painted.
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...1s-672x378.jpg https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...0s-672x378.jpg Some dry days are in the forecast, so I should be able to get it all blasted. Then make another skin. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Got the inside sandblasted today. Some rust holes in the door bottom showed up, no biggie. Next dry day is Saturday. Hope to get it all done then.
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
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Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Spent some time at a local hot rod shop to see all their autobody stuff, and chat with the guys and the owner. Cool experience.
They had a late 40's Chevy truck that the truck owner had cut the cab to lengthen it a few inches, and then discovered he was in over his head, and brought it to them to fix. It wasn't properly braced, so it's a ton of work. They had a sweet 510 - I asked if there was enough metal in it to weld to, and they said nope - they had close to $50,000 metal fabrication in it. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...3s-672x378.jpg A neat 50's Apache that had the right corner of the cab stoved in 20 years ago, finally getting repaired. Damage was really extensive, and messed up everything up to the front clip as well. They showed me the super expensive aftermarket door that needed a port-a-power through the window to correct the shape enough for even the glass to fit. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...2s-378x672.jpg A sweet '56 Nomad getting re-done, because the paint and bodywork done by another shop wasn't good enough for the car owner. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...4s-672x378.jpg A gorgeous mall-rated 60's Blazer, lifted, huge rims, chrome everything, gorgeous interior, gorgeous paint, mural on the tailgate, not at ALL my style, but I can appreciate the work that went into it - you'd never drive it; it gets trailered everywhere. A wack of other cool rides as well. It inspired me to spend some time correcting the door gaps on my '61. https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...5s-378x672.jpg |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Serviced the shop furnace today, it's supposed to be the coldest October day in 100 years here. La Nina or something. Also ran the lawnmower out of gas, and moved the Jerry Can over to the snow blower. Reminds me, I need to change the oil on that. Also fixed a leaky fitting on the air compressor lines.
Filled the West Coast Mirror holes on the passenger door: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...7s-672x378.jpg Prepped the next door skin for wheeling: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...6s-672x378.jpg And gathered a plan on where to cut the door bottom out: https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...8s-672x378.jpg Six inches of snow yesterday, so I'm not going to do any more blasting for a while. |
Re: SkinnyG's '61 Apache
Passenger door skin formed and fitted. I felt good about my progress, so that was a good place to stop for the day.
https://www.gwellwood.com/wordpress/...0s-672x378.jpg |
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