Stepped control arms
 

I've got one of my control arms stepped 1-1/2". This is my first attempt at real fabrication and modification. I don't think this sucker is ever going to come apart. I used 1/4" steel plate for all the gussets and pieces. Everything went very smoothly and I'm confident that I did a good job. Now I just have to make the other one match, paint them, press in new ball joints, and I can put the front of my '64 back together and see how she sits with the 1-1/2" LCAs and 3" springs.

Oh and if you're wondering why I didn't just use drop spindles its because I'm an 18 year old kid with a tiny budget that can't afford a disk brake swap, let alone new spindles. But I do, however, have a welder and a nice workshop(thanks dad) and a lot of ambition! ;)

Re: Stepped control arms
 

Here it is next to the stock one that I need to step for the other side.

Re: Stepped control arms
 

heres a little helper for yea if you check your local hot rod shop or dirt track place where the guys go to build roll cages you can get corner pieces pre fabbed for the corners for stupid cheap and just weld them in..but it lo good..can't wait to see them in the truck

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That's a good tip! Oh well, it didn't take too long with a cut-off wheel on an old circular saw.

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Let us know the outcome!

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Definitely. It might be a week or two though.

Re: Stepped control arms
 

Awesome! Glad to see ambitious young builders jump in the mix. Be sure to let the old man check the integrity of your welds. They look good from here, but it's best to have someone with a trained eye look things over.

Also keep in mind that you have lowered the scrub line considerably. You didn't mention what size wheels you plan to run, but this could be in issue with a small diameter rim is a flat occurs.

Keep the progress pics coming.

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I've gotten the green light from my dad(he didn't like the idea of cutting them up and welding them back together, but now that he sees them he says they look stronger than before) and several others. I'm taking a welding course at school and it has definitely taught me a lot and I have way more confidence now.

And the scrub line issue is why I only stepped them 1-1/2"(well, that and bumpsteer concerns). I'll be running 15" wheels but it should be fine. If I'm not mistaken(I very well could be), I'll have 1" more clearance, as far as scrub line is concerned, than if I had used 2-1/2" drop spindles. Correct?

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Here's the end result. Painted and fresh ball joints installed. :metal:

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looks good

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looks great i always wanted to do a set of these
but to also shorten them 1.5" to compensate for
camber for the lowered stance with the dropped
coils! any insights?

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Thats cool. When I was 18 I could barely check my oil. Stay w/it and you could be the next Trepanier.

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does someone know if this works for the 66-72 models too???? I'm going to air ride and was going to cup the bags but if this gets me lower than What the heck I'm going to be welding up the lower A arm anyway.....just worried about cross memeber drag , bump steer and camber adjustment??? any input?? thanx Jeff

Re: Stepped control arms
 

Yes it should work on the 66-72 since its the same suspension. Yes your gonna have an issue w/ crossmember drag, but you will no matter what since its the lowest point on the frame, aside from exhaust and such. No idea on bumpsteer or camber adjustment. Honestly I would instead since your gonna do bags to begin with, build your own cup mounts and do them w/ 8" I think it was pipe so that the bag is set down inside the LCA and not on top of a cup mount. Then once you lay frame, your gonna have an issue and will need to solve that by either zing the frame or going w/ a dropmember from porterbuilt.

Looks good on the work you did. I like the idea of doing all your own fabrication especially at your age. It looks like its gonna be a fun project.

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Looking good good luck with it

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Yeah after I got started I realized I should have taken a few more measurements to account for the camber. Oh well, live and learn. I think it will be alright. This truck won't be a daily driver or anything so I'm not too worried about some extra tire wear, hopefully the rears will still wear faster than the fronts, if you know what I mean. :burnout:

I've got heim rod ends coming in the mail so I can alleviate any bumpsteer issues by attaching the tie rods underneath the steering arm.

And thanks for all the kind words guys! Its good to get compliments from people that know their stuff. :metal:

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maybe i'll do a set and see how they work out let you know.....

Re: Stepped control arms
 

I had bought a set of dropped A arms from So Low way back in the day (before dropped spindles in '67-'72 year trucks). I think they were 2" drop and worked fine.

The only issue I had was without any bump stops, I came thru a dip to fast and bottomed the arms out. This caused the upper arms to over rotate the ball joint and killed one of my new upper ball joints.

Make sure you put some type of bump stop to keep from bottoming the lower arm.

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I just did this mod on my 69. You only have to shorten the arms only about 1/4" not 1-1/2" that would move the arm into the upper spring pocket and bind both of the ball joints. You generally lose that distance in the cut anyway.

As faw as the bumpstops go I am using the new foam style (they have more absorption for the hits and allow a little more give) I will be mounting the to the upper coil towers.

Your work looks great! Keep on truckin'

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excuse me for being a newbie to this but the 1/4" you loose from te cut you gain back with the thickness of the plate????...could you put a cut in the bottom of the upper A ram near the ball joint and bend it closed (bend the ball joint mount down) to stop the bind?? and do the same when you cut the bottom??

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(.....could you put a cut in the bottom of the upper A ram near the ball joint and bend it closed (bend the ball joint mount down) to stop the bind?? and do the same when you cut the bottom??.......)

Heres how i did my LCA's.

http://i447.photobucket.com/albums/q...wright1/12.jpg
I ended up making new UCA's

Re: Stepped control arms
 

thats exactly what I'm taking about!!!!

How did it work out??????

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the thing is when your body is 6" off the ground your tires sitting on tilt
and to correct this you must shim out the UCA alot...(about 1"
off the cross member on mine) and its still 1-1 1/2" off of being perpendicular to the ground? so to correct that you'd have to take some
out of the LCA..... if im wrong please correct me!!!!!
dont want to work with no working results-

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It worked good. At ride height, my LCA's are parralel to the ground. As far as having to shim the UCA's out, I don't think you would need to shim them out much. I could be wrong though. Look through my build thread.

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thanx I will look into it I think it makes sence to make a quick cut and weld the hard part is figuring out how much??

Re: Stepped control arms
 

ok guys looking for some insight?? I bagged the front of my truck with less than desireable results :( (not low enough) so it looks like back to the cutting and welding I think I will start with stepping the the lower A arm..so heres the question how much (15" wheels) I was thinking 1 1/2" I want to make it so there is some adjustment in my camber so should I take some out ( how much??) of the lower control arm...I also plan on making the cut in the top to elimnate some of the ball joint bind....and.... If that doesn't get it low enough I want to build in the lower cup for the air bag ( but I want to check scrubline with the stepped arms first)

Help outI would like to do this in one pass if I can

thanx
Jeff

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I stepped mine 1 1/2 inches and removed about 1/4 from it's length. the camber is pretty close but I am WAYYYYYYY below scrubline.

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^^ That's not good news. What springs are you using, and what part of the LCA is below the scrub line? I still haven't bolted mine up yet, I'm too anal about cleaning and painting stuff that its taking forever. The passenger side is almost together though.

I'm curious, are there scrub line issues when using 15" wheels and 2-1/2" drop-spindles? If not, why would stepped LCAs have issues?

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Well I got the passenger side bolted together today(except for the tie-rods, gotta order some inner tie-rod ends). Everything looks great and I took some measurements and it doesn't seem like I'll have any scrub line issues, but we'll have to wait and see how it looks weighted down. Here are some pics of my set-up. :metal:

3" drop springs, 1-1/2" step, and flipped outer rod end

Re: Stepped control arms
 

tagging this post to see results for future reference.

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did you flip left to right on your tie rod ends(steering arms) ?? I see you have a hine joint on there?? I havn't gotten quite that far but I know the tapered stock tie rod could use some sort of adjustment on the up and down direction??? love the bump stop I dea I may steal that from yea!!!

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I didn't switch the steering arms, they are in the original places. I never thought about switching them, and when you mentioned it it made me feel like an idiot for a second thinking i wouldn't have needed to go to the trouble and expense of the heim rod ends.... but then I realized that if you swap sides and flip the steering arms that would put the outer tie rod end really really low, almost scrub line low, and that would be way over-compensating and wouldn't help the bump-steer issue you're trying to fix.

So what I did is used heim rod ends to mount the tie rod on the underside of the steering arm, as opposed to the top side. I drilled out the taper in the steering arm to 37/64" so I could tap it 5/8"-18. For the hardware and rod ends this is my shopping list:
- 2ea. QA1 XM-10 5/8" CrMo rod ends, with LEFT hand 5/8"-18 thread
- 2ea. 303 Stainless Steel 5/8" safety washers
- 4ea. 303 Stainless Steel 5/8" misalignment spacers
- 2ea. 5/8"-18 x 3-1/2" Grade 9 bolts
- 2ea. 5/8" SAE Thru-Hard washers
- 2ea. 5/8"-18 aircraft grade(grade 8) locknuts

But keep in mind this is for '64 C-10, I don't know what thread the tie-rod ends are on other trucks. so if you're gonna do what I did do some measuring and make sure you get the right stuff. ;)

And the bumpstops where like $8.50 a pair from Summit. Part number ENS-9-9103R. ;)

Here's pics, the red line is the original tie-rod location, and the green is what it will be with the flipped tie-rod ends.

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First off.........the control arms look really nice, well done!!!

next
What exactly does the term "scrubline" mean if someone doesnt mind explaining it.

Re: Stepped control arms
 

I wouldn't recommend running the rod ends on the bottom side of the steering arm, due to the increased bumpsteer you will experience. You may also experience some diminished steering radius.

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scrub line= when there is no tires on your wheels ( like you got a flat) with the air bags dumped nothing drags....scrubline = the lowerest part of your truck basicly


I'm not a ig fan of hide joints...I used them alot in hot roda apps and never like the end results...they all seem to rattle

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thanks hottrucks.............thats the idea I had in mind for what it meant.

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In the pictures the suspension is completely extended, when it is resting at ride height I expect the angles of the tie rods to be much better than if I had left them up top. But we'll see once its at ride height and if I decided I want them up top and I can just move the heims.

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If you got heim joints that are "rattling" then you got worn out heim joints.

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^ What he said. And the bolt I used is shouldered all the way until about half way through the final spacer before the steering arm, so my heims aren't on the threaded portion bolt. The threads would be a smaller diameter, which would make it sloppy. That's also why I threaded the steering arm, if I had just through-bolted it there would have been a lot more slop. These rod ends are also Teflon coated and Kevlar sealed, so they shouldn't rattle.

I flipped them because I basically moved the steering arm up 1.5" with the stepped arm, so with the heims underneath the tie rod stays where it was originally. With the heated springs that I took out of the truck the tie rods were already at pretty steep angles. I have no idea about how much drop that was, but this will probably be the same or more.

The picture isn't a good one for showing how everything will be at ride height.

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You also should probably cross drill that shoulder bolt and either cotter pin or safety wire it.