SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

So I am looking at a C ( actually a JV) 70 with tandem rears and a driven front axle, and well I am kinda looking at doing some mods and stuff and am just wondering if there is any interest or knowledge base here about such a thing ?

I am all ready active in the heavy Haulers area, but the all wheel drive thing is more of a rarity there.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Well, I'm sure that with enough time and money and work you could turn it into a lowered half ton :)

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

A lowered half ton would make decent wheel chocks for this thing.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Yeah, I was just kidding, but it seems to be the thing to cut up 3/4 ton and bigger trucks to make some sort of street rod :banghead:

What year is this beast? I used to have a 1965 C-50 GMC and a 1958 C-60 Chevy. The latter was an old Ma Bell winch truck.

Our VFD has a couple of AMC 6x6 trucks.

I for one am very interested in this sort of thing, but I don't know that I have any useful knowledge to share. Would love to see some pictures :)

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

not sure the exact year, has to be 68 -78, thinking early 70's
6v53 detroit
5 speed with 4 speed aux

https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8870/1...9055986a_z.jpg

and there are a few more pictures in this album
https://www.flickr.com/photos/404389...57653899216189

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

this is a better picture for Size comparison, thats a c50 on the left.

[IMG]https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/296/18...ef450f38_z.jpgJV701 by Greywuuf, on Flickr[/IMG]

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

What does it cost to insure something like that in AK ???

I had to trade off my trucks because it cost more to insure them in CO than they were worth. The other guy had to pay for the low boy to haul them so all I got was an old tractor and a flatbed trailer.

Back in 1979 I was clearing building sites near Wasilla. If I had stayed in AK, I could have used something like that boom truck to yard/load/haul the cut logs. There was a fair market for birch back then for paneling. etc.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

no idea, the guy that owns it now bought it for the boom and bed. I talked to him at the auction and offered to buy the truck, still waiting on the bed to come off, the plan is to single it and make a "toterhome"out of it, simple short popup camper and a flat bed for hauling a couple of sleds and the option of a decent 5th wheel.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Probably way too much truck for that. A C-60 with adequate wheelbase should suffice, since your camper and snow machines would probably weigh much less than the crane and the flatbed (which presumably is designed to carry a heavy load also).

Also, even though heavy all wheel drive trucks are way cool, there really isn't much use for them. Are you really going to take it where you need all wheel drive? We hardly ever engage the front axle on our ex-military 6x6 trucks even for wildland firefighting - but use low range a lot. Then you have to consider recovery options for such a big truck!

When I was in Alaska in the late 1970s I found that there weren't really that many places where my K-20 was all that useful. Most of Alaska seemed to be either a somewhat developed road, or impossible bogs, inpenetrable forests, or glaciers. It wasn't like CO where there was a two track to the top of almost every mountain. A bunch of us did go up and glean some firewood from a fairly recent power line right of way - that was a lot of fun following a bulldozer trail :)

Maybe it's different now or different where you are .....

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

no, not so different, its either road or not ( swamp) but anything other than the road is closed anyway. I have wwII weasels and a SUSV for actual swamp travel, and No I will never come close to the 80,000 GVW that is has now ( thus removing one of the rear axles. but I WANT a Detroit, and if you remember it does snow here ( I am interior not Anchorage bowl ) and though I don't go "4wheeling" with ANY of my street rigs that front end is kind of nice to have in the poorly plowed turn arounds and trailside berms etc. since it is a recreational TOY for me anyway, why not have the "cool" one that makes me happy?

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

also registering it as an RV takes it out of CDL and commmercial insurance...plus saying I want to make a "motorhome" out of it gets it a pass from the wife.
and allows me to drive it occasionally as compared to having an uninsured CDL vehicle that I could never operate.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

OK, I see your point - the engine alone is probably worth it :)

Worst thing down around Anchorage/Mat-Su was the ice which is a lot worse than snow. I drove school bus at Chugiak for a year and never had any trouble even in fairly deep snow even with bias highway tires. Ice was sometimes bad, though.

What kind of rear suspension does the C-70 have? A lot of those HD trucks have the walking beam suspension (either one pair of springs or four rubber pads) so you pretty much have to just find another rear axle/springs to convert to single axle. In fact I've known guys that found it easier to just cut the frame and weld in another rear frame/axle rather than mess with all the brackets.

At least you shouldn't have to lift it :lol:

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

I drove school bus in Glennallen, Valdez for a season or two as well, I am not really concerned about "needing" the 4x4 I just want it ! and yeah unknown on the rear suspension, not my truck and it was a year ago when it was at auction, did not think to look. I HAVE a leaf spring rear, C60 with Air brakes and a WAY short ( 135" WB) frame that might make a good donor for this project, but I still need to keep on this guy and get him to sell me the truck like he promised before I get to serious.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Yeah, I always wanted to build a chassis mount camper on my old 65 GMC after I got done logging with it, but alas it was never to be :(

It got about 10-11 mpg loaded or empty so I figured it wouldn't be too bad with the mere weight of a camper compared to logs.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

and it does not even have the big tires on it yet

these are like 53"

http://www.truckcampermagazine.com/i...ivers-side.jpg

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

That is pretty good actually, I am assuming the '65 had to have a Big 6 in it ?
401/478 ? they were not known for their mileage anyway.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

305 V6 / 4 speed

It really needed more gears for the way I was using it, but much of the time I was on back roads so it was okay. Out on a hill on the highway you couldn't stay in high, and when you dropped a gear you were rpm limited.

I had a semi-truck bolster with home made bunks on it, and a trailer with fixed bunk, hauling 20-25' long logs. I figured I was grossing about 25K including a home made hydraulic loader. It was supposed to be a "starter truck" but I never made enough money to graduate to something bigger.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

My GMC was pretty short but not that short. I dunno exactly - maybe about 150" ??? 135" is about the same as a regular cab long bed pickup.

So that's why I had to use a trailer with it unless I only hauled 12' logs (had it set up that way for a while with an electric winch powered cable loader). It had been a utility truck originally. It would have made a good little dump truck too.

Is your C-60 complete? Not much of a deal to stretch the frame.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

it was complete but broken when I got it, it is now complete and mostly unbroken but disassembled. the dealer new 427 short block is in my garage, heads are rebuilt just need to pick a cam and put it together, also it had a REALLY heavy Spicer 5 speed in it, and the shift tower got broken when it was removed, so I need one piece for that ( spicer 5756b) and I should probably go through the brakes and it could use tires

[IMG]https://c2.staticflickr.com/6/5128/5...cd8170af_z.jpgC60 011 by Greywuuf, on Flickr[/IMG]



[IMG]https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7143/6...dc7365a6_z.jpgLeft by Greywuuf, on Flickr[/IMG]

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

yes it could be stretched, but my goal is NOT to have a toter home, my GOAL is to have a detroit, the toter home was just an easy way to register and justify it. the C-60 came placarded from the factory as 25500 GVW, ( even though it has a 19k rear axle and a 11k front?) so there is no issue driving it as it is.....Ideally it will get a holmes 600 on it.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Do you know what conversion is under this truck yet?

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

you mean as far as Napco or Marmon ? did not see any marking external and I noticed that it called out a front axle on the SPID..... I know we bought a factory 4x4 k5 blazer in '72 I thought maybe this rig was new enough it was not a "conversion" ? or am I misunderstanding the question... or maybe How things were done ?

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

They were always conversions till these newer van cab/ light mediums. I Know the front drive system could be ordered from new through the silver book, but didn't realize it would be listed on the SPID. Such a cool truck. If that's a twin screw it's a 6x6 and if it's not it's a 4x4. You go by the hub count, not tire count. In other words, you see people calling duallies 6x6s and that's wrong, they have 6 tires but they have the same system as a single wheel truck... 4 driven wheels/hubs. Other than Marmon-Herrington and Napco, there was Howe and Coleman. I know it's not Coleman because those had a big old baby moon looking cover on the wheel

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

yeah, well if it does not get sold I will let you all know, I see the guy has a sign out in front of his place now "equipment for sale" if he decides not to remover the bed for something else i will never be able to afford it... so my chances seem to be fading all around.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Well I stopped in and talked to the old man today, we still do not know who converted it, no badging that says and we did not go out in the yard and crawl around it. I was "factory" with a 5 speed Clark and a 4 speed Eaton aux, but he says it has a single trans it it now, either a 9 or a 13 he is not sure since he has only driven it in the yard and only used the low 5. Says it runs very well and we did strike a deal, I just have to figure out how to hold up my end ( gonna sell some stuff ) oh and as a bonus it will come with a second tandem axle truck of the same general size ( again very rough and NO badging even as to a series 70,80 etc) but it has a running 6v53 as well ( that one is not however a 6x6 conversion, just a conventional) and a single ( we presume ) 5 speed. hopefully in a month or so I will know more and can update with photo's etc.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Yeah just read where ALL of this year/series trucks with tandems had hendrickson equalizing beam rears. i am Hoping it is a spring pack and not the rubber blocks. Should know more next week.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

It doesn't really matter if you're going to swap in a single axle as the entire rear suspension would need to be replaced. Like I said before, it would probably be easier to just cut the frame and weld in the entire rear half of the donor truck.

The rubber pads suspensions were commonly used on log trucks. I think that they worked better in off camber situations with tall heavy loads.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

I don't see why, if it all ready has a single spring pack mounted, why could you not remove the beam and u bolt the single axle where the beam pivot used to be ?

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

That single spring is huge and designed to suspend the weight carried by two axles. I don't even know if you could bolt up a single axle in the middle of it - probably not without a lot of complication. I never heard of anybody trying it.

The walking beam set up is probably worth a fair amount to somebody who wants to upgrade their truck.

I worked for a guy that had two trucks at the time: a KW and a Pete. The KW was set up for logging (came from WA one of the big companies: Weyerhauser or GP ...) but the Pete had the proprietary air bag suspension. He made a deal with somebody that had a Hendrikson rear end truck and they literally cut the frames on both and welded them together to the different front halves. He also added a 4 speed brownie so the Pete had the same 13x4 gears as the KW. Some of the hills that had to be climbed with the kind of loads that he hauled, the original 13 speed Pete could not get started again if it had to be stopped for some reason, and you sure didn't wanted to even think about backing a load down those switchbacks!

So when he got done he had two almost identical trucks, both 350 Cummins, 13x4 transmissions, rubber pad walking beam rear end - the only difference was the cabs, KW vs Pete. With the 13x4 the lowest gear was down in the "bulldozer" range :)

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

there are spring shops around... even here in This state..... don't see cutting a frame when you have two perfectly good spring hangers all ready installed....I can see maybe pulling a leaf or two out of it but I dunno going to have to consider my options when i get it paid for and brought home

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Why don't you just save yourself a lot of time and money and keep the twin screw, and just run four singles on the back ???

Pull both wheels from each hub, then install one wheel flipped to the outside on the inner lug nuts. That way they should line up pretty close to the front tires.

I sometimes did that in the winter on my C-50 (only it was just single lug nuts). You get much better traction and it is quick and easy to throw a single tire chain on a single tire if necessary.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

couple of reasons, I am not sure yet, but I don't know if I can get it registered as an RV with twin screw ( have to check into that) and it is cast spoke ( Dayton) wheels (in the back ) so it is not quite so easy as just leaving one off. plus if I do have to buy wheels / tires /hubs....4 is a LOT cheaper than 6 or 10.

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

I know you know this all ready SpecialK... but it is "FABCO" conversion still power steering, rockwell front axle. I will be moving the "spare" truck in the morning, hoping to post pictures of the old screamin Jimmy moving about, still do not have the boom and bed off of the 6x6, but am promised by OCT1
I have seen onother forums where fabco made 3 speed transfer cases. I cant wait untill I can discover a few more of the secretsof this old rig.

and I was mistaken... the front axle is called out, but the one on the SPID is not a powered axle and not the one that is in the rig.

[IMG]https://farm1.staticflickr.com/337/1...d3ce6c3d_c.jpgSPID4 by Greywuuf, on Flickr[/IMG]

Re: SO what do we know about "Big" 4x4 (10x10's)
 

Weird, I got a look at the spare parts truck that comes with the red 6x6 today. It is a standard single axle flatbed. But low and behold it USED to be a 4x4 !https://flic.kr/p/xR4JPy
https://flic.kr/p/xR4JPy