Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

So the fan & shroud I have isn't up to speed and won't keep the LS cool. Been doing some research online & see lots of hype about the Lincoln Mark VIII fan. Anyone use on an AD?

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

you gotta look at the whole picture of what you have going on there. does the rad have a straight shot at fresh air or is there an a/c condensor, a power steering cooler, a trans cooler and a grille blocking the flow? next in line is the exit area for the flow. you can't move air through an area that doesn't have an exit. if the rad has ability to get fresh air on the front side but then the rear side is nearly blocked off with engine accy directly behind the rad, there is no shroud around the fan to scavenge as much air from the rad as possible or the engine bay is crammed full of engine with no clear pathway for air flow, then those items should also be looked at.
if you can't find the perfect fan set up you may need to make your own. mock up with craft paper, like cardboard, then when you get it right make it out of sheet stock

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Cooling components fan took care of all my problems, it moves a lot of air

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

100% agree. I've used their fan on my last two builds. Its a 2 speed fan too and only kicks on high if needed.

Marc

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

I used a big spal fan on stock 350 and it works fast!! the only issue was amp draw required. Up grade to 100 AMP alt seems to have worked. See specs on page 424 of link below.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

The issue with Spal fans is you have to research the Spal site and find the one that moves the amount of air you need to move. All Spal fans are not created equal even the same diameter.

I haven't heard about the Lincoln MK VIII fan That is one of the things you want to do your own research on as far as CFM and measurements.

Now, I have to ask, does the temperature drop right down where you want it to be as soon as you hit 30-40 mph or so? If it does, you do have a fan/air flow issue, If it doesn't you most likely have a different issue. Unless it is super hot outside or you are pulling a pretty serious load or climbing a long grade the fan normally doesn't have much effect above 40 or 50 and my experience is that even with a suspect radiator the air flow from the truck moving usually comes into play at about 30.

Last, how hot do you feel is "too hot" or not cooling enough? LS engines aren't 235's and they operate at a higher temp than most old engines do. Meaning what temp is normal for that LS in the donor car it started and spent part of it's life in? If the car left the factory with a 205 thermostat as it's standard thermostat and you stuck a 180 in it and get your undies in a knot because it now shows 205/215 on the gauge at a stop light there really isn't an issue.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Agree with MR 48 here.
What temp is it running on the road at speed and at idle?

My 6.0 LS in the 1956 runs at 188 - 195 and I can't get it higher unless 100 degrees outside I am in traffic and idling without the fan on. Because its not packed in with a zillion other things in the engine bay like modern donors have.

Stock in my 3 other LS vehicles of modern era is running around 200 - 210 all the time. 2006 chevy avalanche, 2012 Yukon, 2015 Silverado

Note. the 56 with the LS actually runs better when it gets up to 200 and I am in traffic. Because why. The computer wants it there. unless you have made those adjustments in the parameter in the programing then it will like to be in the range the original donor wanted it in. To cold is just as bad as too hot with the computers. They want all the numbers to line up to what all the settings are for optimal performance (or fuel economy) depending on the programming.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Somewhere i saw a engine vs CFM table. The 350/5.7's were rated as needing 2800 cfm. Not sure where this was found or based upon or ambient weather/accessories. So i chose this:

Spal 30102113 Puller Fan (16In High Performance Race ; Curved Blade; For Use W/ 40Amp Fuse at 13V),

Think i would have been better off with an aluminum 5 core radiator and maybe dual pullers?

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

You know why all the big suvs have dual fans and two speeds. Has nothing to do with cooling that engine under max load pulling down the hwy at 55. It has everything to do with running the AC while sitting still in traffic with no airflow. And a ac grill in front of radiator and an engine bay packed like a sardine can. Understand your needs before you build it.
If you plan on crawling in traffic with ac that’s one thing vs moving it down the hwy vs a nice back road cruise with the windows down and a few friends on a regular basis.

And when they put all those fans and shrouds in it restricts more airflow. At high speed.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

It is a challenge to maximize cooling in a variety of situations. Build plates and shrouds only to restrict freeway speed function.
I used a 16” Spal with an infinite speed controller with the stock shroud on a 91 GMC without issue.
Sometimes experimenting is the best medicine.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Thanks for the replies. I'll be experimenting with a few options. I have a big Derale laying around that I might try. Also considering at the Spal brushless unit.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

I originally ran an older ford Taurus fan. Worked great until it succumbed to old age. Was a 2 speed with shroud. New Spal makes me miss it.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

for what it is worth I have a couple years use on 2 sets of cheap amazon fans and they seem to work fine. 8milelake was the 'brand' but they seem to be gone now. I'd buy from Amazon again based on this experience.

dual 10" is all I could squeeze behind stock AD rad, They cool the 250 fine, but I need to open some flaps in the back of the shroud I made for better low speed cooling on hot days.

Attachment 2359921

A single large fan would have given more fan surface area but would have interfered with water pump on the inline 6.


I have dual 12" in front of LS swap in Sonoma using a 4.3 Blazer rad. Sequential control from ECU, I don't think the 2nd fan has ever turned on. But that swap has only been on the road since last winter, no real hot days yet. No shroud in this instance, fans just hang from rad using some m3 threaded SS rod and nylocs. (don't waste your time with the zip tie things, they won't stay tight)

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

I hung the two speed 17” Derale I had minus the shroud because it was too thick. I wired it to run on high & it definitely moves more air, but it still runs a bit warm. The temp creeped up to about 240. Interestingly enough I think it may be the water pump. When I rev the engine up about 500 rpm it dropped 20 degrees.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

are your crank pulley and water pump pulley from the same donor?

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Yes, I’m using the Holley mid mount system.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Maybe sizing the pulleys a bit differently would help move more coolant at low rpm? Are they different sized than a stock pulley? Some aftermarket setups undersized pulleys to save that small amount of hp it takes to turn the accy. Made more for higher rpm destined use possibly. Not great for lower rpm use.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Talked to the Holley techs this morning. They think its trapped air in the heads. There's a built in steam port in the back of housing to hook up to the steam vents to burp the system. Going to grab some fittings & hoses to see if that helps.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Please post the results.

I see the steam port is drilled in the back of the pump housing inline with the water outlet. That puts it well below the height of the top of heads. Its not immediately obvious to me this will let vapor escape. But Holley must have sold some of these and know how they work. ?

GM went to the trouble & expense of running a hose from steam ports UP to the top of rad. For peace of mind this is what I'd do, either direct to rad or into a tapped rad hose coupler.

steam port on Holley
Attachment 2360929
location relative to heads
Attachment 2360930

It is not just a matter of burping bubbles from coolant at refill but of letting steam out if it ever starts to boil, otherwise the heads just keep getting hotter

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

That makes sense too. I found this just in case it needs to be mounted higher.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

That is exactly what I have used on a couple swaps.

You might be able to confirm the steam venting is your problem just by routing steam port into the rad fill with cap off and running it up to temperature.

I'd also be curious to compare the idle RPM at your waterpump to that of a stock c7 corvette with the same style waterpump, by finding the OEM pulley diameters for c7 crank and pump

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

According to Google, c7 corvette
crank pulley is 8.07"
water pump pulley is 6.33"

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

I looked it over when I got home this evening and see that it’s already tapped to the back of housing. Ordered the adapter for the upper hose to see if that helps.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

I believe the water pump took a dive. I don’t see coolant flowing through the radiator.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Are the heater hoses getting hot as the engine warms? then there is water flow. Flow in the radiator will only start once the thermostat opens

I'd look for a stuck thermostat or obstruction somewhere. A water pump that is failed so hard as to stop pumping would probably have other issues...like a seized pulley and a large puddle. It is possible the pump spit the impeller off the back, just not likely

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

That makes sense & is the easiest fix. I'll start with the thermostat this weekend. Thanks Lee!

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

I think it said on the Holley site that the water neck could be clocked. It might be as simples as the actual thermostat vent hole being at the bottom so there is a bubble in the housing and is no water flow around the thermostat body to heat it up in time

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Crossed the thermostat off the list, it works fine. Tested it this weekend.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

the LS engine coolant flows through the rad and butts against the closed thermostat (until it opens) at the engine coolant intake of the water pump then, when the engine heats up, coolant flows. you wouldn't see flow in the rad until this point. the old small block way was flow through the thermostat from the engine outlet side, not the intake side.
either way, no flow through rad until thermostat opens. flow through heater hose all the time.
check out this link for an in depth look at cooling system, steam lines etc. LS specific
http://www.billavista.com/tech/Artic...ble/index.html

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

That link is quite and education in cooling and especially in LS cooling.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

yup, it is a good read for somebody who is building and is unfamiliar with how the LS system works.
hopefully it will help somebody

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Pull the thermostat. out leave it out
Put the lower hose back on and stick a garden hose in the fill of radiator.
Take off the top fill hose and leave over top of radiator. (tie it off so does not fall into mechanicals)

Fire it up let it run and see how much flow your actually getting thru the system. it should hardly get up to operating temp with the constant flow of cold water in system.

That will tell you a lot. you can even measure gallons per minute in a five gallon bucket.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

Great idea. I like the idea of trying small things first & checking them off before tackling the bigger stuff. I plan on running steam port vents on all four corners & moving the hose from the water neck housing on the pump to the upper radiator hose to see if that make a difference as well. Fingers crossed.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

The saga continues. relocating the steam vent had zero effect. I stumbled onto a Scoggins Dickey video discussing the differences in the thermostat housing and the importance of using the right housing or it could lead to overheating issues. Well...I didn't use the housing that came with the Holley kit because the opening point directly into the fender so I swapped that for a swivel style to improve the angle. I'm wondering if this could be the issue. I can't the one that came with the kit so I ordered a replacement. I'll see if this helps.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

DID you do this?

And can you repeat the temp that its running at under normal driving conditions and what temp its getting to idling with everthing hooked up like normal?

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

can you post an underhood pic of your set up that shows the hoses connected etc? curious how things are laid out under there, size of hoses, if there are sharp elbows etc.
doing the flow test would help give you an idea of flow capacity without the thermostat
normal to have no coolant flow through rad until thermostat opens
do you have a heater or are you running a bypass loop at the water pump end so there is coolant flow through the block when the thermostat is closed? this helps reduce hot spots around cylinder heads and steam production when the thermostat is closed.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

what DSraven said, you need flow through the heater hoses for LS. If you are running a heater does it have a coolant shutoff and is it open? If one of those old thermostatic flow controls maybe confirm it is open or bypass it.

haven't watched that thermostat housing video, but ignorant of that I'm not sure how a housing could have much impact unless it restricted flow or allowed you to get the thermostat in upside down so it did not heat up properly.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

No, got halfway through & realized I didn't have a gasket to seal it off. Picked up so gasket material so I can make a temporary one & will try again this weekend.



No sharp edges or weird angles, everything flows pretty straight. I am running a heater. I do have a bypass hose that I'm going to hook up when I remove the stat this weekend to check flow as mentioned above by HCB 3200.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

since your pulling it to put in a gasket.
Do the flow test with straight water. makes less of a mess and you are not running it long enough to boil over with that cold water it won't over heat.
Run it idling see what flow is and run it about 1500 and see what flow is.

Then drain and hook all up normal and fill with proper fluid mix assuming the flow is normal and has not sent you off in a issue to troubleshoot.

Re: Lincoln Cooling Fan
 

You can also run it with no stat and see what flow you have through the rad, then pull the upper hose and do the flow test into a bucket. Like said above. When done and sorted pull the block drains to dump as much water out as possible.