A wacky idea?

[SRD art]

Hey all. I haven't posted much here on my Suburban because my daily driver takes most of my play money. As you can see in the link below I'm into handling, and work for Speedtech Performance, a company that makes handling suspension parts for GM muscle cars and full frames for 67-72 C10s. Unfortunately there aren't any plans in the near future to do bolt on suspension for 73+ trucks, outside of a full chassis which has suspension unique to the frame. Here's a link to my daily driver- Click Here

I've owned my 77 2500 Burby for several years now and it's in need of some attention. I have been thinking of different ways to lower it, likely 6". 8 lug wheels all look too off roady so I want to convert it to 5 and the MB Old School 20x9s are what I've really come to have my eye on. So first off a 5 lug conversion is in order. My steering box is now leaking from the top seal so that's in order too. I also want to replace the "weak" 454 with a wrecking yard 6.0 and 4l80. The truck also handles like a wet noodle. Lots of room for upgrades.

Anybody ever hear of doing a 90's Caprice front frame graft into a square body?

I know that's a wacky idea but there are several advantages-

• Instant 5 lug conversion. 5 on 5 bolt pattern on most wagons and ex cop cars.
• Instant suspension drop without cutting springs or replacing spindles.
• Quicker ratio more responsive steering.
• The factory suspension geometry is based on 70 & up Camaros which is actually pretty decent to begin with.
• 12" brakes.
• Performance sway bars and shocks available.
• I can buy Impala SS geometry corrected upper and lower tubular control arms at employee cost for a really good price.

Best I can tell the Caprice track width would require a spacer to match the truck but I'm ok with that. I'd sure like to know if anybody else has done something this nutty and pulled it off. ...Or if I'm just up in the night and should stick to what works.

Open to ideas/ thoughts...

[J Knight]

Im not familiar with the caprice frame...does it unbolt like a crown vic or do you have to use the front section of the caprice frame?

[tinydb84]

Nice daily! I have seen one Crown Vic set up on here. I think most people either modify the stock set up or go with a complete aftermarket set up. I am guessing for the amount of fab work involved you would be able to modify stock for a similar ride and less cost.

I am interested to see what you come up with.

[DannyO]

If you can get a rolling caprice frame for little to nothing it would be worth it in my opinion. Graft the cross-member section only and use the rear end with stock leafs. You can always run some wide tires to compensate the width difference which shouldn't be much. Just my 2 cents...take it from a crazy guy turning his Burby into a Mega Cab; nothing is impossible if you start with parts that kinda fit together.

[Domer]

The caprice has a 115" wheelbase, which is the same as pre 72 c10s. There is a member on here that put a 65ish body on a caprice frame. called it caprickup i believe. Interesting build. I have a 96 caprice sitting in my driveway that i bought for parts. let me know if you need any measurements.

[Tom]

Can't say I've ever heard of this, but that doesn't mean it can't be done. Alot of work for a 3/4ton suburban though, I'd rather get oem parts to convert to 5lug and then lower it. I would imagine you'd be hard pressed to find caprice springs and shocks that control a 6000lbs+ suburban well.

[71swb4x4]

How much work is it to bolt up a 1/2 ton front cross member? I realize the frame is thicker, but I would think it would be easier to make the 1/2 ton cross member work than make that caprice frame work.

[SRD art]

I would only use the front portion of the Caprice frame. It's a perimeter style frame which means after the engine bay it goes around the floor pan near the rockers rather than straight back like a truck frame. I would graft it in just before it started to curve outward. I saw a guy do this to a G body 80's Cutlass using an all wheel drive front clip from a Colorado or similar truck. He just welded the front portion of the frame to the Cutlass' frame. Not too crazy of a deal.

On the net I found a page that says the Caprices weigh in a little over 4000 lbs. This website had a pdf on Suburban options and claims a curb weight of 4200 for a 1/2 ton and 4700 for a 3/4. If I drop the 454 for an LS I'm losing maybe 300-400 lbs (?) and putting in a C1500 10 bolt instead of the 14 bolt Dana should save some weight too. https://www.gmheritagecenter.com/doc...t-Suburban.pdf

Mostly the measurements on the Caprice I would need is outside of tire to outside of tire. That would give me a realistic width I could compare to my truck. I plan on running probably a 275-40-20, (about 10.5x29"). Wheel offset is at 4.5" of BS I think.

It would be easier, or rather more direct to swap parts to 1/2 ton truck parts but the cost would be a lot more and it'll have terrible geometry, lousy steering and still handle like a wet noodle, only lower to the ground. Imagine autocrossing a Suburban and actually doing fairly well, now that'd be fun to see.

I don't have actual cost numbers but I'll start looking into it to get a good base. If It's just a matter of welding frames together there isn't much crazy mods involved to make it work outside of hooking up the steering.

[Tom]

Originally Posted by SRD art

claims a curb weight of 4200 for a 1/2 ton and 4700 for a 3/4.

Wow thats light. My 98 ex cab is 5100lbs with fuel.

Imagine autocrossing a Suburban and actually doing fairly well, now that'd be fun to see.

That's something I'd pay to see!

[1774btcrew]

A half ton front cross member is a direct bolt in. Roll your 3/4 ton one out and roll the half ton one in. Did it on my crew cab

[71swb4x4]

Read this: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=419251

[mcmlxix]

I really don't think a front clip swap is worth the effort.. Find a craigslist C10 parts truck and swap the front crossmember to get the 1/2 ton front. If you want to box the factory frame that might be worth the extra effort while its torn apart. Find some tubular front control arms that correct suspension geometry. (You work for Speedtech) McGaughys drop spindles and cut some 1 ton springs to desired ride height. A Redhead variable ratio steering box is the next step without going rack and pinion swap. If you don't have a factory front sway bar, back to the junk yard or CL.

If you want to get creative, grab a 67-72 trailing arm rear suspension and ditch the rear leaf springs... NASCAR uses this style rear suspension for a reason. Simple and it works.

Airbags for a smooth ride... Ridetech if you can afford it....

[SRD art]

Thanks for the insight.

Unfortunately new control arms from Speedtech for a factory frame aren't coming anytime soon. What companies out there have corrected geometry control arms? Although I'm heavily involved in the musclecar pro-touring scene, honestly I'm out of the loop on truck parts.

I'll check on that steering box. Are the McGaughys spindles the best value? Originally I was thinking a 3" drop spindle and then cut the 3/4 ton springs to try to get 6". That's when the wacky part of my brain took over...

[bigblock73]

IMO, swapping the Caprice front end on it is a lot of work and waste of time. There are TONS of aftermarket parts available for these trucks, to upgrade the suspension and brakes (not to mention the factory interchangeability of the 1/2 ton stuff). They all pretty much bolt in, and won't kill the value of the truck in doing so. (I would never buy a truck like this with a front clip swap of unknown craftsmanship...but that's just me).

[kalbert]

Agreed... I think it's going to be a lot of work for next to zero return. I think you'll find the geometry of the SLA on the B body isn't going to offer any performance that would be a lot different from the pickup. The geometry of both is pretty generic. Most SLA suspension is. Engineers decades ago figured out what provides a good ride/stability/performance compromise and they are all pretty much the same from a mathematical standpoint. You'll also find the cross member cumbersome to work around vs the pickup one that will accommodate just about any mill you can dream up.

The only thing that could even remotely be considered an advantage might be availability of a faster steering ratio, but for the effort of swapping a whole frame clip you ought to be able to build a mount for just the box, or just get one of the faster ratio boxes aftermarket. Not to mention the amount of time most people spend driving straight vs maneuvering parking lots makes a quick ratio box a pretty tough sell.

Any part available for the B body is going to be available for our trucks and then some. Our trucks are some of the most well supported by the aftermarket you'll find. You can get air bags, coil overs, tube arms, huge bars, you name it, we can get it, and it bolts on.

[mcmlxix]

check out these guys to see if they have anything...

http://michiganmetalworks.com
http://michiganmetalworks.com/uncate...nt-suspension/

[andrewmp6]

Most aftermarket control airs are for air bags,If your willing to change out everything http://pbfab.com/shop/ http://nolimit.net/ and http://www.scottshotrods.com/ all have bolt in ifs kits on coilovers or bags,No limit don't have it listed on his site but the 62-72 one will fit.

[mcmlxix]

http://www.classicperform.com/Store/...TCA-UKS903.htm

Our Totally Tubular™ Control Arm sets are designed to add 5° of caster while providing full wheel travel and minimal friction possible. They are made from thick tubing to eliminate distortion from welding and hard use. The bushings are made from self lubricating non-squeak patented plastic that will out last any rubber or urethane. The billet 4140-alloy steel cross shafts and sleeves are zinc plated for lasting performance. The sleeves have an interlocking design that prevents the hardware from ever working loose. Simple bolt-in installation with no modification required. They work with all factory and replacement power steering systems, and with or without O.E. bump stops. Note: #6372TCA-LA works with double convoluted air bags. When ordering, please specify black or silver. Note: Ball joints are included. Please specify year when ordering. Lower arms only work with end link style sway bar.