Where did you buy your GM Crate V8?

[MotoPhotog]

As title says, I'm trying to weigh options between cost/power/work load.

I'm looking for your opinion on cost saving 350. Goal is street driven truck that "wakes up" when you're looking to step on it. Always loved the lumpy cam sound. My 70 c10 already has edelbrock rpm intake, ceramic headers, 2" exhaust all the way back. Makes my 307 sound as good as its going to sound

That said, I'd like to not get 5mpg like my 427 chevelle was, but I don't need 14mpg like I'm getting now.

Jegs $1459 base crate 350 -

How many of you guys have bought this engine, put in a different cam before installation, good intake, carb, and ran headers/exhaust through for it? Struggling with the "start with new" vs, buying one built for a little less.
I think the base model with things above would be about 275horse. Discussion for thought on this? It would be for a "driver" that like anyone in this group, I want the engine to be snappy when you want it to wake up. Neighbor suggested if you buy this crate motor to also replace rockers/lifters with roller set. While engine is on the stand. Ideas/discussion?

I'd love to be done and self installed by $2,000.

[30 a truck]

Caught mine on sale at Jegs, $1198.00. Got the stuff you mentioned on it. Never fired it up yet.

[MotoPhotog]

Originally Posted by 30 a truck

Caught mine on sale at Jegs, $1198.00. Got the stuff you mentioned on it. Never fired it up yet.

DAMN! Now THAT is a sale!

[CC69Rat]

If you go this route, go ahead and step up to the 350/290hp. I have heard the 260hp version out of the crate is pretty rough on gas.. and other reasons, cam, heads, etc.. and it's not a whole lot more. I have heard that with a little hotter cam, ZZ4 I believe it was, .. the 290hp long block out of the crate with a good intake, headers, normal stuff you could be in the 400hp range pretty easily.

I had one of the 290hp crate motors in a 69 Camaro. It just had an RPM intake, headers, 650 Holley. It sounded really good and was quite impressive. Now, this has been 10yrs ago, BUT, I will say I found out the hard way about the warranty. The GM warranty coverage is only good if the engine is installed my an ASE certified mechanic at a GM certified installation facility. About 1000 miles in, my 290hp engine started smoking out the passenger side exhaust. .. oil smoke. The more I drove it, the worse it got. I'm not talking about a 500 mile trip, just 5-10 miles around town. as it turns out, the engines (at that time) had had an issue in QC. Someone at the plant in Mexico put the wrong valve seals in a BUNCH of them. They were for a 4.3l v6. so, we had to replace the valve seals, once that was done it was back to normal of course. Just saying, the attention to detail on the builds may or may not be the best ? .. but overall, it's a nice engine for the money. If I recall the cam was around 222, and it hit a surprising lick.

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/070...vy-350-engine/

[El Dorado Jim]

Originally Posted by CC69Rat

If you go this route, go ahead and step up to the 350/290hp. I have heard the 260hp version out of the crate is pretty rough on gas.. and other reasons, cam, heads, etc.. and it's not a whole lot more. I have heard that with a little hotter cam, ZZ4 I believe it was, .. the 290hp long block out of the crate with a good intake, headers, normal stuff you could be in the 400hp range pretty easily.

I had one of the 290hp crate motors in a 69 Camaro. It just had an RPM intake, headers, 650 Holley. It sounded really good and was quite impressive. Now, this has been 10yrs ago, BUT, I will say I found out the hard way about the warranty. The GM warranty coverage is only good if the engine is installed my an ASE certified mechanic at a GM certified installation facility. About 1000 miles in, my 290hp engine started smoking out the passenger side exhaust. .. oil smoke. The more I drove it, the worse it got. I'm not talking about a 500 mile trip, just 5-10 miles around town. as it turns out, the engines (at that time) had had an issue in QC. Someone at the plant in Mexico put the wrong valve seals in a BUNCH of them. They were for a 4.3l v6. so, we had to replace the valve seals, once that was done it was back to normal of course. Just saying, the attention to detail on the builds may or may not be the best ? .. but overall, it's a nice engine for the money. If I recall the cam was around 222, and it hit a surprising lick.

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/070...vy-350-engine/

the warranty is good for who ever installs the engine, maybe not years ago, I put a 260 hp in my suburban about ten years ago, warranty is excellent, however,if you change anything internal, like the cam, this voids any warranty.....

[Mmorgan32]

When I had my nova I got a 350 from a company called west coast engines. You basically tell them what you want and the put together a combo for you I payed $2800 and got about 400 hp my nova hauled ass. I'm my truck the previous owner put in a 290 hp from summit it has a mild cam, edelbrock intake and carb. Not the fastest thing I've owned but it drives great and sounds awesome

[Vintage Windmills]

Roller cam and rockers/lifters would put you well over 2000 I think. Would be nice though.

I bought the base engine through Jegs, think it was $1250 or so on sale. Haven't touched it yet though Still sitting bagged in its crate.

[MotoPhotog]

Dang Chad. Very nice info there. Thank you. You're the second person this morning to recommend the "350/290hp" Now i'll just need to look for it!

Link anyone?

[CC69Rat]

Call this number - (256) 597-3469 Ask for Lynn Welden. He is a great friend of mine, he owns Chevy World Parts in Bryant AL. Tell him Chad Coley sent you.

Give him a shot at getting you one, I'm 100% sure he has a source for the 290hp version and he may be able to save you some $ over Summit / Jegs.

Good luck with it man, do the 290hp you wont be disappointed just be aware of the little clause in the warranty with GMPP. I didn't know until I had the valve seal issues.

[Coley]

Be careful...very careful on that 290hp option.
A few guys got caught up in the 290 vs 260 number (because guys are about numbers) and chose it for their (heavier) trucks and were disappointed that it did not produce much torque down low....which is most of your driving.
As a result it was a bit of a dog 'off the line'....when you got to 4000+ rpm it started to perform a little better but again...that isn't where most guys notice the power most of the time.
I think it is a good option for a lighter car.
(Somewhere in the 290hp information I believe it says that it is not recommended for heavier vehicles, etc.)
The best option might be to buy the 195/260hp crate engine, install it as is and as per the recommended factory/crate specs and run it for a couple of months to ensure it is up to snuff. (ie: no warranty problems or issues)
Then if your confidence is high that it isn't a 'warranty' victim motor....upgrade the cam and lifters....or the cam lifters and heads.
At least you know you are dealing with a new, strong, correct bottom end/short block....although your warranty will no longer count. (not that it would matter much under the conditions)
My two bits.
Coley

[MotoPhotog]

Originally Posted by Coley

Be careful...very careful on that 290hp option.
A few guys got caught up in the 290 vs 260 number (because guys are about numbers) and chose it for their (heavier) trucks and were disappointed that it did not produce much torque down low....which is most of your driving.
As a result it was a bit of a dog 'off the line'....when you got to 4000+ rpm it started to perform a little better but again...that isn't where most guys notice the power most of the time.
I think it is a good option for a lighter car.
(Somewhere in the 290hp information I believe it says that it is not recommended for heavier vehicles, etc.)
The best option might be to buy the 195/260hp crate engine, install it as is and as per the recommended factory/crate specs and run it for a couple of months to ensure it is up to snuff. (ie: no warranty problems or issues)
Then if your confidence is high that it isn't a 'warranty' victim motor....upgrade the cam and lifters....or the cam lifters and heads.
At least you know you are dealing with a new, strong, correct bottom end/short block....although your warranty will no longer count. (not that it would matter much under the conditions)
My two bits.
Coley

You guys are very helpful. And I'm "all ears". I'm a motorcycle guy who loves his c10. I'll raise my hand immediately and tell you "I don't know a lot" about working on old cars/trucks. I just really enjoy my c10. We live in a small town, so I do, do a lot of small town driving. Lots of stops, lots of 40-50mph cruising. Not a lot of sitting, not a lot of +60mph driving.

And you're completely correct about the crate vs. buying one someone you don't know, built. Someone had stated the issue with the 195/260hp engine is the pistons/low compression said "it'll always be a dog" wasn't very confidence inspiring.

But agreed. Looking for peppy "driver". Not looking to race by any means.

[Coley]

Well, the best conversation to have right about now is....what your maximum budget is and what your skills are.
These are probably the biggest players in what sort of power/torque expectation you will be looking at.
I always see a boatload of new and near/new motors for sale that been heavily built...and the guy ran himself into the ground spending money for performance that he probably couldn't afford and probably wasn't really going to use...and now has to sell to dig himself out.
It unfortunately happens all the time.
A lot of guys on the site here have installed that 195/260hp engine and with a few bolt-on mods (intake/carb/headers/hei) seem to be pleasantly surprised by it.
Its not a dragstrip stormer but any new engine usually outperforms its worn replacement given its new compression, etc.
Perhaps consider 're-camming' that Jegs crate engine...BUT....first talk with the cam experts before you buy anything.
A heavier vehicle (any truck) needs some unique considerations in its cam and configuration to develop power/torque down low....which is that nice powerful feeling that spins the tires....lol.
Is a cam change a swap that you are mechanically comfortable with?
Coley

[CC69Rat]

In no way argumentative ^^ but he has a good point. The 290hp will be a bit different in the rpm range, but if you're swapping the cam, maybe add a 2800 stall (?) It never ends..

[davepl]

I think I spent a bunch of time on this in a previous thread, so search is probably a good thing, but there are a couple variants of this engine, I believe, with different cams. We decided (in the earlier threads) that the higher HP units have cams not sell suited to the heads and intake, but if you buy the lower HP units they're great torque motors for the street.

Swap cam and intake, and of course heads, it's a great performance platform. Even with the supplied heads it's OK if you keep all the parts operating in the same RPM range.

[MotoPhotog]

Well after talking to a bunch of c10 owners on the facebook side of this things "Northwest C10s" I think im going to go with this 350/290hp package. I'll have the headers/exhaust/intake/carb ready to go. Guy on there said his dyno'd at 330hp. I'd be plenty happy with that number.


http://www.jegs.com/i/Chevrolet-Perf...5609#reviewTab

[engineer_gregh]

Can you use your fuel pump from the old engine? Is there is a provision for a mechanical fuel pump on the new crate motors.

[drewbert41]

My friend has one of the 290s in his 66 and loves it. When he steps on it you get thrown back so I dunno about the whole low rpm argument. He has headers, intake, HEI, and carb upgrades though. He has Porter mufflers on it that make it sound "lumpy". I will probably go this route someday and leave the heads and cam alone.

[DBK81]

I've got a ZZ4 355hp, and if I could do it all over again, I'd do it the same, I know they don't make the ZZ4 anymore but there is still probably some out there to be had.

[ptc]

You guys crack me up talking about engines that are 'dogs' and other 'crate' engines "throwing you back" by a 290hp mouse motor that kids used to build in auto shop 3 decades ago and now whole motor plants cant get them right in the factory???? Really thats a sad state of affairs.....

It sounds like you (OP) are not really impressed by large HP numbers and that is good because the under $2000 long blocks dont offer too much of that. and they certainly dont offer anything really considered to be REAL PERFORMANCE from a GM built Mexican Crate engine....

The first order of business in motor building is what are you gonna do with it? You want to do burnouts in front of a high school? well you dont need a 3000hp Donovan Hemi for that.... just change out the ring and pinion to about a 5.43 ratio behind a 4-banger and you'll be leaving your rubber everywhere..... Thats all about TORQUE....

Torque my friend is what THROWS you back in your seat and not hp at all. You dont need much engine to have alot of torque if you have a granny first gear or very high rear end gear ratio. If you dont have that then you have to figure out where that torque range is going to be in your motor build.... that is decided upon by many parts, but your cam plays a large part of that and the heads do too....

Check out this build, note the components used and then reconsider your "crate engine build"....

http://www.superchevy.com/how-to/148...-engine-build/

[MotoPhotog]

Originally Posted by ptc

You guys crack me up talking about engines that are 'dogs' and other 'crate' engines "throwing you back" by a 290hp mouse motor that kids used to build in auto shop 3 decades ago and now whole motor plants cant get them right in the factory???? Really thats a sad state of affairs.....

It sounds like you (OP) are not really impressed by large HP numbers and that is good because the under $2000 long blocks dont offer too much of that. and they certainly dont offer anything really considered to be REAL PERFORMANCE from a GM built Mexican Crate engine....

The first order of business in motor building is what are you gonna do with it? You want to do burnouts in front of a high school? well you dont need a 3000hp Donovan Hemi for that.... just change out the ring and pinion to about a 5.43 ratio behind a 4-banger and you'll be leaving your rubber everywhere..... Thats all about TORQUE....

You're pretty fired up.

I'm pretty sure, if you read, you'd see I stated literally what I'd be using it for, and at what typical speeds.

I also said I had a fully built 427 Chevelle that was a true shaker. It got MAYBE 4mpg. No. Thanks. Never wanted to drive it.

I'm also at a point in my life where dependability/reliability overrides the need for burnouts and 4mpg.

Plan is for the crate, swap over some items from my current engine, and enjoy it!

[Classic Bowties]

Originally Posted by Coley

One thing about engine options that is worth considering in the 'locally built' vs the 'crate engine' choice is the made in the U.S.A angle.
This matters to some people.
The crate engines are mexican made for the better part...so that money doesn't hang around mostly and explains the wow/cost factor that everyone enjoys during the purchase which comes as a result of low cost labor.
If you contact and contract a local (quality) engine shop to build you a motor you are keeping money around locally and putting/keeping Americans at work.
You are going to have to pay more....that is a fact....but everyone defends that.....at least they defend it....when it come to their own employment but that's usually on a different day..lol.
Changing the behavior pattern of finding the cheapest (or 'most economical') off shore or out of country purchase option seems to be a going trend tho'.
One approach would be to find the crate engine you prefer and take the ad/info into a local (quality) engine builder and ask how close he could come to that pricing for that result. You might be surprised at how willing he would me to maybe work with you a little bit on it at least if the 'buy America' option/angle matters.
It never hurts to ask...and some good food for thought.
either way.
All Good
Coley

Said well and helpful post in MotoPhotog's thread. Mel

Originally Posted by ptc

You guys crack me up talking about engines that are 'dogs' and other 'crate' engines "throwing you back" by a 290hp mouse motor that kids used to build in auto shop 3 decades ago and now whole motor plants cant get them right in the factory???? Really thats a sad state of affairs.....

It sounds like you (OP) are not really impressed by large HP numbers and that is good because the under $2000 long blocks dont offer too much of that. and they certainly dont offer anything really considered to be REAL PERFORMANCE from a GM built Mexican Crate engine....

The first order of business in motor building is what are you gonna do with it? You want to do burnouts in front of a high school? well you dont need a 3000hp Donovan Hemi for that.... just change out the ring and pinion to about a 5.43 ratio behind a 4-banger and you'll be leaving your rubber everywhere..... Thats all about TORQUE....

Torque my friend is what THROWS you back in your seat and not hp at all. You dont need much engine to have alot of torque if you have a granny first gear or very high rear end gear ratio. If you dont have that then you have to figure out where that torque range is going to be in your motor build.... that is decided upon by many parts, but your cam plays a large part of that and the heads do too....

Check out this build, note the components used and then reconsider your "crate engine build"....

This one, not so much... No one was needing/asking for information on how to do a burnout in front of the high school.

[jmader]

Originally Posted by DBK81

I've got a ZZ4 355hp, and if I could do it all over again, I'd do it the same, I know they don't make the ZZ4 anymore but there is still probably some out there to be had.

You can still buy the ZZ4 short block from Jegs. Or at least you could last fall. I bought one for my airboat

[drewbert41]

There are a lot of mixed reviews about the two cheapest crate engines so far. GM 260 & 290

That said do any of you recommend any other crate engines for our trucks?

[Nitis]

Good read here.

I'm liking west cost engines so far cause you can get exactly what you want

Does anyone have a good source for rebuilt shortblocks?

[Mmorgan32]

Originally Posted by Nitis

Good read here.

I'm liking west cost engines so far cause you can get exactly what you want

Does anyone have a good source for rebuilt shortblocks?

Call west coast. I loved that engine I bent a rod 6 months after I bought it and sent them a pic and they sent me all new stronger ones that were better for my cam for free ( I cheaped out on them in the first place). Really good warranty