429 Cadillac motor....should I?

[Ft.ValloniaStreaker]

I'm ready to pull the trigger on a 64-67 era 429 (I think). It came out of a hearse so it shouldn't have to many miles on it. Its turns over and has antifreeze still in it. Anything these motors were known for I should be aware of? I have been looking for something out of the ordinary for my 67 this should do the trick....but if these are junk please let me know, $300 ain't much but money is money you know.

[MARKDTN]

I don't know much about Caddy motors, but I do know I would not do this swap. That said, I would ask the following:

Pull a valve cover and see how bad it is sludged up. You are talking almost 50 year old motor. Hearse is low and slow, not necessarily a good thing. Is it complete with accessories? Brackets can get spendy if not included. Are you just going to find a BOP pattern (probably TH400) transmission or is one included? How long has it been sitting/how was it stored? Antifreeze is good, but may still have a rod knocking. Exhaust routing may be an issue, I don't know how the 60s Caddy manifolds are configured.

If I can't hear it run, it sounds like a core to me. If you have to buy it without hearing it run and have to give the $300 I would probably pull the pan and look for loose rods and see what the cylinders look like. The original owner may have taken great care of it, but I have seen Hearses in demo derbies and such. The guy between the funeral home and you may have run it hard.

[1972RedNeck]

Originally Posted by MARKDTN

I don't know much about Caddy motors, but I do know I would not do this swap.

I do know a bit about Caddy motors, and I wouldn't do the swap. I would get a 472 or more preferably, a 500 (same bore, 500 has more stroke = more torque). I helped put a 472 in '70 highboy (yes, a Ford). The only problem with it was that it smoked two "built" 700R4's, one high performance clutch disc, and two TH400's. It also ate multiple flex plates.

[68c10airstream]

Tranny parts from the best i've ever heard is from " A and REDS" out of kansas city if my memory is correct from about 8 years ago. A vast array of parts for american anything in the last 40-50 years i was told with great prices.

[MARKDTN]

Especially after seeing the motor, I still would not do the swap. Looks like it has been stored outside. That transmission if it doesn't work will be hard to find parts for.

If you must do a caddy swap, go find a whole car with a 472 or 500 and be able to drive it. I am a roll-the-dice kind of guy too, but the older I get, the less I like to take chances on stuff like this. On the motor you have, pull the valve covers and the oil pan and look for damage. Then you can decide where to go next. You likely won't know if the transmission is good until you get it installed and have already spent $100 shortening and balancing the driveshaft. Even if you use the motor, I would strongly recommend finding a BOP pattern TH400 so you at least have a common transmission.

[low&slow]

I say do it. I have a 500 caddy in my 69 c10. It's a fairly easy swap. No big mods needed. Didn't even have problems with the firewall. Cost me about $80 for the mounts for the motor. Had to combine a late 70's motor mount to the original caddy mount, but all worked out well. Ordered a trans adaptor from summit and bolted my th400 to it. I didn't even have to move the trans cross member either. Stock drive line went right in. Well actually its about a 1/2 inch too short, but still gets the job done and the truck roasting tires for now.

All in all, I spent about $500 getting the motor/trans in and the truck drivable. That's even including the cost of the motor, little parts here and their (motor mounts ect.), and having a holley 750 double pump rebuilt and jetted to an 850. Luckily for me though, I found an aluminum intake for very cheap rather than spending $400+ on a new aluminum one.

[Longhorn 70]

I like the old Caddy motors. They ran well and had TONS of torque. You may have issues mating the tranny to it if you don't have an auto. If you do have an auto, a piece of 1/8" steel makes a great adaptor plate.

I am still redoing a BB Olds to put back in my truck. It not only looked different, it ran different in there. It got a lot of interest. It also suprised a lot of people when they'd try and pull on me with a mild small block.

There is lots of room under our hoods.

I don't have any real good pics of it but............

[cool68]

Cad motor is a "dare to be different" install. will get the open hood Wow factor. but, for all of the work/expense involved what will you really gain when hood is closed? aftermarket Olds/Caddy valve covers that bolt to small block Chevy motors are available.

[Longhorn 70]

Originally Posted by cool68

Cad motor is a "dare to be different" install. will get the open hood Wow factor. but, for all of the work/expense involved what will you really gain when hood is closed? aftermarket Olds/Caddy valve covers that bolt to small block Chevy motors are available.

You do get a smooth powerful engine. The Olds I used was 385HP and 425 lb/ft of torque STOCK. I have a friend that had a 71 Longhorn with a 402 in it. He had a flat with no spare and I offered my truck so he could take his tire to be replaced. His first question to me was "how do you keep from spinning the tires in that thing?".



as far as the valve covers......Blasphemy!

[WIDESIDE72]

The caddy is a great torque motor but it is not a direct swap. I looked into it in the past as i had a line on a 500. Search the forum for "caddy swap" or similar

[cdowns]

the whole thing is having the accessory brackets for that unit // other than that mountig a turbo 400 is pretty easy as well as mounts if you have a welder and scrap metal is a light duty job and easy to do in an afternoon

you have a ton of room to mount any engine of choice

lots of torque and quite a few options as far as dress up and daily driver performance upgrades r readily available


i say if you fell comfortable about makin things happen go for it

[Eddie H.]

I have seen several of these trucks with the Cadillac swap. It is not a direct bolt in, but not all that difficult either. I know you need a rear sump oil pan from an Eldorado, and a transmission with the BOP bolt pattern.
This website has a lot of good info on these engines:
http://www.500cid.com/

[67 chevelle]

id sell it to a caddy person and get an ls motor

[Eddie H.]

Originally Posted by 67 chevelle

id sell it to a caddy person and get an ls motor

Agreed, an LS swap is a good option for a reliable powerful engine.

But if he wants to do something out of the ordinary, the Caddy might be the way to go.

LS swaps are so common now, when I see one at a car show, I don't even bother to stop and look at them anymore.

[Coley]

Originally Posted by Eddie H.

LS swaps are so common now, when I see one at a car show, I don't even bother to stop and look at them anymore.

...fully agree!!
The LS motors are complete 'yawners' at a show'n shine. You might as well just go tour the new car/truck dealerships with the hoods up on trucks there, even tho' they are good motors.
My take is that the Cadillac motor is much more in keeping with the classic hobby, look and vibe....ie: much cooler....just like these classic trucks.

My two bits.
Coley

[zeldman]

Originally Posted by Coley

...fully agree!! The LS motors are complete 'yawners'

I completely agree. If I wanted something dependable and reliable I would buy a new Suburu. If that Caddy engine is salvagable then do it.!!

[Ft.ValloniaStreaker]

An LS is just of no interest to me at all......and to some this maybe a nasty waste of time and money.But I picked up the motor, transmission, alternator, pwr steering pump and the yoke for $250. Now I know these items may be in need of repair but at least I have them and won't have to hunt them down. I'm going to pull the carb and rebuild it, pull the pan and take a look around inside. Buy plugs and wires then cross my fingers and see what happens! Yes I'm being VERY optimistic, but as you can see I don't have a lot to lose.

[Fitz]

Originally Posted by Ft.ValloniaStreaker

An LS is just of no interest to me at all......and to some this maybe a nasty waste of time and money.But I picked up the motor, transmission, alternator, pwr steering pump and the yoke for $250. Now I know these items may be in need of repair but at least I have them and won't have to hunt them down. I'm going to pull the carb and rebuild it, pull the pan and take a look around inside. Buy plugs and wires then cross my fingers and see what happens! Yes I'm being VERY optimistic, but as you can see I don't have a lot to lose.

You will need all winter to bring that around BUT if you finish, it will be really cool! Not everyone would try this swap but I would! That trans is likely to need a rebuild and parts for it are going to be hard to find and expensive...but if you can bring yourself to use a TH350 or a TH 400 here is a company that has the adapters you will need to get starter, flex plate and trans mated to that motor:
http://www.wilcap.com/cad.html
These guys are 1950's style hot rodders who have stuffed cads into everything except a soapbox derby racer so if you hit a wall, call them and keep us posted on progress.

[Bigdav160]

What kind of trans is that? A Jetaway?

[Ft.ValloniaStreaker]

I wish I could tell you, I'm sure that we'll be well educated before this thread dies. Somebody will take one look at that photo and be able to tell me a hundred things I don't know. I know sbc's but this is all new to me,and I've got all winter.

[Ft.ValloniaStreaker]

I was surprised to see that the mounts were on the very front of the motor. But I think the challenge will be fun and if I fail a small block will bolt right back in.

[Lifetime Project 72]

Keeping an eye on this swap! Nothing can beat the wow factor of an old Caddy engine,especially with the hood open at a show and the Cadillac script on the valve covers,and great gobs of torque!!
Chris

[69GMCLonghorn]

I had a '67 Caddy with a 429. It was an OK motor, no real complaints but not a screamer. I always thought that if you could make it breathe better via intake and exhaust, it would have performed a lot better. I just remember the Quadra-puke on it seemed well matched when it was wide open. On the primaries, it was a dog. With an open element air cleaner, I'd stomp on it and when the 4's opened up, I had power right to 120 MPH.

Have fun with that build and keep us posted on progress, successes and issues.

[Fatherof3]

The Caddy will solve two of the things I hate about SBC's: the plugs being below the exhaust ports and the distributor being at the back.

Tune ups will be a breeze!

The two center cylinders sharing a single exhaust port could be a downer and another reason for a 472/500. The three tube headers they make for them look a little silly on a big V8

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by Fatherof3

The Caddy will solve two of the things I hate about SBC's: the plugs being below the exhaust ports and the distributor being at the back.

Tune ups will be a breeze!...

Distributor at the front is not always a good thing. If the radiator leaks, guess where the fan blows coolant? It's even worse with points than if you have HEI. Also you have to be more careful that your plug wires dont get into the fan.