Crossbred, 454 into an '85 Ram

[383Ram]

Well, now that i fell comfortable here, i'll dispaly my project. Why am i doing this---well, because i can, it'll pI$$ some people off, and i have always wanted to tinker with other "cheaper" engines. So with that, the victim became our '85 Ram. Out came the second 360 that had let me down and a new beginning was had.

The goal for this build, brutal low and midrange torque, stay somewhat in a budget, and drive the wheels off the thing anywhere at anytime, and on 89 or cheaper octane.

Here is the truck as pictured last year, i dont plan to change anything here.



Back last Nov '08, i approched my machinest about building a Chevy motor for my truck. We decided at that time to do a 383 because of the price and big block stuff around here isnt cheap--usually. So with that, in went a 305 while i gathered parts. It fit like a glove after i made mounts and it all bolted in---even the headers went in from the top.

Mounts and isolators---all bolt in stuff, even used existing holes in the truck.



305 mocked up in truck, the fit is great!



Well, as most of my projects go, they snowball. I picked up a set of reconditioned peanut port big block heads for $40 when a guy switched to Edelbrocks. And then i thought and sought about looking for a motor to put them on. So fast foward to a couple weaks ago, i find a whole 454 from a early 70's truck, realativly cheap.



After some research, i find out it will simply bolt in place of the small block, same mounts, same isolators, no moving anything---how easy could this be---i wondered. After the engine was disassembled (another long story initself being it was locked up), everything was taken to work and degreased with out huge steam pressure washer, and other smaller parts were dunked for a day in our huge cleaning tank. Then, it was time to see if it fit.

Putting an engine in---even an empty block and heads like i did, is an act in fustration if your doing it by yourself like i did. But i managed to get it done. It fits, i slid the stock exhaust manifolds on and its tighter, but still good. Things i took note of, headers are going to be tight, the fan is going to have to be changed to a regular fan with a short spacer, or change everything to a short waterpump setup. It all just barely fits with a long pump but i do have some interference on the fan blade tips and radiator bottom tank. I want tall valve covers, but i am going to have to notch the drivers side for brake booster clearance also.



So this is where i am at now, im a little out of money at the moment, if i can unload the 383 stuff, i can continue on a bit.

I also at this point failed to mention, that the trans is a New Process 833 overdrive--3 speed with fourth being overdrive--found mostly in chrysler products, but some GM trucks from the early 80's have them too which is where mine came from. It has ratios very close to a 700r4, which are not really ideal, but a big block should have plenty of torque to pull through the wide spreads. I have a TH350 i could rebuild if i need too and also have the trans mount setup to run a regular style non overdrive 833 four speed--which is a chrysler trans, and i have an adapter plate to use on the GM bellhousing. So i have plenty of choices in the transmission department.

[Palf70Step]

Interesting Build. Can't wait to see how this turns out.

[68C15]

any chance you can throw in some Ford stuff?

if you decide to go with the TH350 I may be interested in the NP a833. it would be perfect behind my 472 caddy.

[383Ram]

Originally Posted by 68C15

any chance you can throw in some Ford stuff?

if you decide to go with the TH350 I may be interested in the NP a833. it would be perfect behind my 472 caddy.

A little sarcasm perhaps, LOL. Probably no Ford stuff, i have a stock 1920 model T pickup in the garage, thats enough Ford technology for me.

As far as the trans, the TH350 is a back up, i dont plan on selling the 833, its nice having it all just bolt together.

A 472 Caddy? Any pics? That sounds cool. I thought about that swap too, but things like that are even harder to find around here than a BB Chevy for decent prices.

[jb1016]

Originally Posted by 68C15

any chance you can throw in some Ford stuff?

Yeah, it needs a 9" rear to be a true three-way abomination. Just kidding -- awesome project, and a sharp-looking truck.

[383Ram]

Originally Posted by jb1016

Yeah, it needs a 9" rear to be a true three-way abomination. Just kidding -- awesome project, and a sharp-looking truck.

Yea maybe so, then i can run some AMC badges on it.

Actually, if i can do what i want to, i am going to sell the GM truck MY6 833 overdrive trans and bellhousing, and put a Chrysler 833 overdrive trans in with an adapter plate on a Lakewood GM bellhousing. I already have a thinner adapter plate i can use as the template from another project, it just needs to be thicker to act as a spacer on this one. Thus the only thing GM would be the engine at that point. I just need to find where i planted that money tree......

[383Ram]

This power steering pump is kicking my A$$ trying to get it lined up. I think i have it now, but in my opinion, i think i am better off making my own top bracket. I probably should have just gotton the right pump, but man anything big block is like buying something for a corvette---expensive. Plus i am unsure if the stock Dodge line would work in the original pump anyhow. I guess the next step is to get some 3/16" plate and make my own upper bracket.

[383Ram]

I finally procured some 3/16 steel and had time to carve my own upper bracket. Now i can use my Saginaw Metric pump on this engine. I still may have some line up issues, but they are ALOT better now. Here is the pic of the stock bracket on top and mine on the bottom. They look similar, but on mine, one leg is set back behind the bracket and one is foward of it, where the stock bracket has both going foward---i had to use alot of shims on the stock one.

[68C15]

there's a few guys here with big caddy's in their trucks. LonghornMan is the most known and he has a web page on how to do it. I got my 68 472 for free and if I hadn't bought the boat I would have got another from a salvage yard for $150. some guys say they can get up to 22 MPG with the swap.
I am putting one in my 67 stepper project and may even put one in my work truck. I would like to go overdrive but my 700R4 is a little questionable as to it's ability to handle over 5oo ftlbs of torque. besides I do my builds the same way guys did back in the 50's, mix and match with used parts from whatever I can find while fabricating it all together. you should look at my 68 work truck. it's chock full of different stuff.

[383Ram]

Where can i view your truck at?

Up to 22MPG!? is this just due to the massive torque? This is the premiss of my build, big torque, whatever HP it makes secondary, and hope for some decent milage with the OD trans. If i could get it to do 13-15 around town and 18-19 or so on the highway, i would smile from ear to ear.

I had concerns that the big engine was going to suck gas big time---to the point i was thinking i may forget the 496 crank and just keep it a 454. Now i am on the fence again. Decisions, decisions---appearently you can get mileage out of a big motor according to what your saying.

So from what little searches i did so far, it seems these guys are running stock intakes also. At first i was dead set on a performer RPM, but the more i have put thought into the entire combo, i think a regular performer would suit me better as its suited for idle to 5000 where the rpm is 1500 to 6000. I dont plan to turn this thing much past 5000 at all. I want all the torque i can possibly make down low. Most driving is done idle to 3500.

[jgh64pkup]

subscribed this is an awesome build

[msgross]

cool build, will the weight of the 454 require new front springs?

[383Ram]

Thanks guys.

No new front springs needed here, Dodge didnt seem to get into all that stuff like GM did. My current springs were torched to lower it about 2" sometime in its life, i have some 2" drop spindles and i need to get new springs to make it right.

Be patient, unfortunatly this is going to be a slow post due to finances and the crappy economy, which makes me afraid to spend anything---not to mention i never know whats going to happen at work, but i should be alright there.

I have some tall valve covers coming--i fully expect to have to notch the drivers side for booster clearance. I also have to see if the headers i have are going to fit too. I just need to finish up some side work, and clean the garage to get the truck back inside.

[383Ram]

I am not a fan of chrome--well i am if used sparingly in the right application. Do you know how hard it is to find things like budget priced valve covers that are not chrome for a chevy? Well, you could buy aluminum stuff i guess, but its usually got a hefty price tag.

And lets face it, Tall valve covers go a long way on the visual impact of making an engine look bigger---and to me, anything but a tall valve cover on a BB chevy (unless its a resto) just doesn't look right. And i like the look of how big this engine looks stuffed in the engine bay.

So, with those thoughts i searched my parts friend, Ebay. I found these particular ones, stamped steel and painted (will strip later), and new too---$29 shipped to my door. I like the look of them, with the slightly raised area like a small block has (this is a good area for logos and such)

I assumed right off the bat before i even got them that the drivers side was going to interfere with the brake booster---well, i was wrong---sort of. While i had no trouble getting them on over the stock rockers that are still on the mock up heads, and just missing the brake booster, there is going to be an issue when the gaskets go in--i only have about a 1/4" gap. So you have to figure, with a head gasket on and valve cover gasket on, its going to be real tight or just flat out hit.

So, the solution is going to be either notch the valve cover (initially when i bought them that was my first thought), go to manual brakes, or see if i can find a smaller booster---which is a available, but a little harder to find. Thinking about this more, if i can find a smaller booster, i think this is how i will go---although the manual brakes would be just as easy. More to come........

[jgh64pkup]

what are your plans for the engine performance wise

[383Ram]

Same as before with the small block--lots and gobs of torque. Small docile cam, performer intake, my freshened peanutport heads i pickup cheap. It'll be around 9 to 1 on the compression ratio, so it will be able to drive anywhere, any time. Just a good solid dependable motor--with a ton of torque.

Now---if i win the lottery, a 496 kit will be in order. But right now i just would like to drive it again---something that probably wont happen for awhile.

I am trying to base it off these guys with the Caddy swaps, But with more readily available chevy parts. Caddy parts availability and price aren't the greatest around here, and parts are more available at local stores for the chevy. I just want to be able to go anywhere and not be stuck or stranded while having to wait for that odd Caddy part to come in---i guess i am just paranoid a little, LOL.

[rod86]

looks like a sweet build, i like them old dodge trucks.

[383Ram]

Last night i picked up a used Edelbrock performer intake for my 454 from a local Craigslist ad. It was already beadblasted and someone did put heli-coils in the wider Holley flange---which is fine with me as they are stronger---and it looks like they actually put them in right too. Soooo for less than half of a new one, i picked it up--$75

I decided to sneak out to the garage before work and slap it on to the mock up motor, i noted that compared to the stock truck intake, it sits about 2 1/4" taller. I also noted as i had heard on the net the ports are closer to the peanut ports rather than the large ovals. I dont know for sure yet if they are indeed the same as the peanuts, but they are certianly closer to that side of things---just in case anyone was wondering.

So here are a few pics, hopefully next up is the install of the right side header, i just havent had time since my last posting to do so.

[jgh64pkup]

looks good are you going to paint it chrysler orange
thats what color mine is i thin k it looks better than chevrolet orange

[383Ram]

Originally Posted by jgh64pkup

looks good are you going to paint it chrysler orange
thats what color mine is i thin k it looks better than chevrolet orange

You know, i have been racking my brains out trying to figure out what to paint it. I would kinda like to keep it all color corridnated with green and tan theme going on. But, the 305 pictured in the first post was painted tan using Cummins engine paint. I have to say its not very good as i got lots of rust and stains coming back through it. So no go with that. Then, while i am still youngish--36, i am getting much lazier---meaning light colors require lots of maintence to keep clean.

So i am desperatly looking for ideas. I never painted using body colored paints, and the best i could do there is out of a spray can---because i thought about doing green like the truck. Black would be a choice too---orange is still a thought--but again a lighter high maintence color and doesnt really go.

So what would you guys do and what items would you paint what colors? (i.e. would you paint the intake natural aluminum or engine color? valve covers? etc...)

[jgh64pkup]

i would say black and green
you can use body color paint spray it just like you would a car
primer base and clear
just make sure its clean and wipe it down with prep all

[68C15]

I kinda like the simple easy stealthy semi-gloss black.

[383Ram]

I think gloss black with body color valve covers, and cast aluminum painted intake (so it keeps that fresh out of the box intake look) is what i am going to do. But one issue i have to solve is the clearence between the drivers cover and brake booster.

Also, untill i can sell my 383 stroker parts, i am basically on hold as far as buying some more parts. I still have plenty to do in the mean time, but as far as it running anytime soon, its just not going to happen.

[383Ram]

Well, it took me a bit to get to this, but the right header is now installed. It was not anywhere near as easy as the left side. After starting with some similar cuts on the top of the frame rail as i had done to the left side, and it still did not drop in--Uh-Oh.

Well, i spent the better part of an hour messing with it only to discover the only way it was going to fit was to cut the top of the rail to half its width. My feeling is that even without any reinforcement it would be fine, but once i pull the mock up engine out, i will box the frame in anyhow. It still needs to be trimmed up nicer, but its in, now onto whatever part needs to be done next....

[jgh64pkup]

have you ever put headers on a 98-02 chevrolet f-body (camaro-transam)
i did it for the first time yesterday and it sucked