Headers?

[Jedipartsguy]

I'm looking to get headers for my 78 k10. I'm trying to do as little modification as possible to the stock down pipes. Do I want shorties or long tube?
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[JRANGER]

^_^ i want this answer too!!

[Jedipartsguy]

I have searched a lot. Still not able to come up with anything.
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[mopar346]

Although not on this body style I have used a number of sets of Hedman Elites with the ceramic coating. They are a little pricey in some peoples few but the fit and durabilty not to mention the look is awesome. I would go long tube if it were me. Heres my son's CJ with them.

[Jedipartsguy]

I think Im gonna go with shorty's they seem to be alot closer to the length of the manifolds. Therefore there will be little or no modification to the down pipes.

[Firebirdjones]

Even with shorties you will be modifying those down pipes,,,the connection alone on a header is completely different than a stock manifold, so that will have to be cut off/welded/fabbed, and probably bent at a different angle. It's difficult to do all this in that area unless you can drop the whole front head pipe down where you can work on it.

It's actually much easier to adapt a long tube, because it's already pointing straight back by the time it reaches the bottom of the truck, and in most cases, simply cutting the head pipe at the header collector and welding on a matching collector is all that's needed. Plus it's under the truck where it's much easier to access and work on.

[Jedipartsguy]

Originally Posted by Firebirdjones

Even with shorties you will be modifying those down pipes,,,the connection alone on a header is completely different than a stock manifold, so that will have to be cut off/welded/fabbed, and probably bent at a different angle. It's difficult to do all this in that area unless you can drop the whole front head pipe down where you can work on it.

It's actually much easier to adapt a long tube, because it's already pointing straight back by the time it reaches the bottom of the truck, and in most cases, simply cutting the head pipe at the header collector and welding on a matching collector is all that's needed. Plus it's under the truck where it's much easier to access and work on.

This is good information thank you.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

If you have duals great if its a stock style setup then don't bother. Headers won't make very much diff with a stock exhaust
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[Jedipartsguy]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

If you have duals great if its a stock style setup then don't bother. Headers won't make very much diff with a stock exhaust
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Do you mean true dual exhaust, yes I have that. With only mufflers on the exhaust I am skeptical that headers will not make much different. For the price headers do enough for me to want them on my truck, and combined with any other modification they will be a good investment. You didn't really answer the question.

[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by Jedipartsguy

Do you mean true dual exhaust, yes I have that. With only mufflers on the exhaust I am skeptical that headers will not make much different. For the price headers do enough for me to want them on my truck, and combined with any other modification they will be a good investment. You didn't really answer the question.

We have to know your setup to answer the question with as much info as possible. For all I know you could have a inline 6 for an engine

And yes block hugger headers on stock exhaust system will hardly change much


So on to useful info
It is a possibility you will need an s bend on the driver side to clear the crossmember and hook up to a long tube header UNLESS you have the double hump crossmember. Mid tube headers are not such an issue and are the best of both worlds in fit/performance/and ground clearance.


I do a lot of exhaust systems myself so its kinda my thing lol
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[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

We have to know your setup to answer the question with as much info as possible. For all I know you could have a inline 6 for an engine

And yes block hugger headers on stock exhaust system will hardly change much


So on to useful info
It is a possibility you will need an s bend on the driver side to clear the crossmember and hook up to a long tube header UNLESS you have the double hump crossmember. Mid tube headers are not such an issue and are the best of both worlds in fit/performance/and ground clearance.


I do a lot of exhaust systems myself so its kinda my thing lol
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Do you need to re read? I'm pretty sure I asked. Also you switched to long tube instead of shorties. Long tubes will always outperform shorties in 90% of all apps
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[Desert1957]

Patriot Headers



Desert

[Jedipartsguy]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

If you have duals great if its a stock style setup then don't bother. Headers won't make very much diff with a stock exhaust
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Again I'd like to point out that you are wrong. I put on flowtech long tubes and man I noticed a huge gain. I got 35s after the headers and I can still pull hills in 3rd that I used to have to be in 2nd for. Way more torque. So for all interested parties long tubes are the way to go.
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[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by Jedipartsguy

Again I'd like to point out that you are wrong. I put on flowtech long tubes and man I noticed a huge gain. I got 35s after the headers and I can still pull hills in 3rd that I used to have to be in 2nd for. Way more torque. So for all interested parties long tubes are the way to go.
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Again if your going to argue the point you should learn to read. Twice now you have come off arrogantly rude.

As it clearly states in what I wrote. STOCK exhaust. LITTLE gain.
CLEARLY your exhaust is not stock. True dual Is not stock like a two into one style most of these trucks come with. And as I stated before. Nobody can help you if your vague on your setup. An btw nobody wants to help you acting the way you are
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[Jedipartsguy]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Again if your going to argue the point you should learn to read. Twice now you have come off arrogantly rude.

As it clearly states in what I wrote. STOCK exhaust. LITTLE gain.
CLEARLY your exhaust is not stock. True dual Is not stock like a two into one style most of these trucks come with. And as I stated before. Nobody can help you if your vague on your setup. An btw nobody wants to help you acting the way you are
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Seems like you weren't helping at all before I started calling you out. Your negative know it all attitude pissed me off. You assume because I'm asking a question I don't know anything about the subject. If you needed more info on the setup ask!
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[wraprail]

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

If you have duals great if its a stock style setup then don't bother. Headers won't make very much diff with a stock exhaust
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So it's fair to say by "stock style setup" and "stock exhaust" you are referring to "two into one style most of these trucks come with" as you stated below.

I am asking cuz I have Doug Thorley Tri-Y (300Y) headers, 2 1/2 Flowmaster cats in a 2 into 1 stock style setup (single muffler single tail pipe) and the power gains were very noticeable. Without any other changes the "seat of the pants" feeling was incredible for just a set of $40 wrecking yard headers and "stock style" exhaust.

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

We have to know your setup to answer the question with as much info as possible. For all I know you could have a inline 6 for an engine

And yes block hugger headers on stock exhaust system will hardly change much


So on to useful info
It is a possibility you will need an s bend on the driver side to clear the crossmember and hook up to a long tube header UNLESS you have the double hump crossmember. Mid tube headers are not such an issue and are the best of both worlds in fit/performance/and ground clearance.


I do a lot of exhaust systems myself so its kinda my thing lol
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I would point out that "block hugger" headers are NOT the same as "shorty style" headers.
Block hugger headers are used mostly in street rods where clearance is very tight and small engine compartments do not allow for a long tube or shorty style header. Block hugger headers would be the least desirable style for performance and flow.
While Block Hugger headers would be an improvement over stock exhaust manifolds I would agree with you that they would not be much of an improvement.
Shorty Style headers are a different story.
Shorty Style headers are much like long tubes but allow for more ground clearance on lowered vehicles. They can be equal length tubes and therefor tuned for max performance.
Two very different styles of headers.
Even with a totally stock exhaust, adding headers (even the block huggers you like) would improve exhaust flow (and performance) over stock cast iron exhaust manifolds in most cases.
Since exhaust is kinda your thing I figured you would want to know the difference between these two different designs.
There is some good info on exhaust tuning theory and design at Sideways Technologies as well as other web site if you want to learn more.

Originally Posted by INSIDIOUS '86

Again if your going to argue the point you should learn to read. Twice now you have come off arrogantly rude.

As it clearly states in what I wrote. STOCK exhaust. LITTLE gain.
CLEARLY your exhaust is not stock. True dual Is not stock like a two into one style most of these trucks come with. And as I stated before. Nobody can help you if your vague on your setup. An btw nobody wants to help you acting the way you are
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[cal30_sniper]

Long tubes. They will be way easier to adapt to your current dual exhaust system. Exhaust scavenging of any header will be far superior than the factory manifolds, but some designs are better than others for this.

I'm a huge fan of the Doug-Thorley Tri-y design. It's a great setup for a truck engine that isn't really ever going to see 6000rpms. Excellent mid-range design. The fit and finish on them is superb, and they have plenty of clearance all the way around even in a 454 engine bay.

I've tried the el-cheapo designs on my '90 R1500 5.7L. Don't waste your time. Get a good, heavy gauge header, with the thickest flanges you can find. Then buy dead-soft aluminum gaskets and locking header bolts. I used Stage 8s on mine. I tightened them up the day I put them on, and haven't touched them since. That was 7000 miles ago.

As far as power goes, after doing the Doug-Thorleys, Edelbrock Performer 2-O intake, and dual 2.5" exhaust with an H-pipe, I had to richen the jetting on the Quadrajet 40% at part throttle and 60% at WOT just to get it back to stoich. That's a lot of extra airflow, which equals a lot of extra power.



-cal30sniper

[KQQL IT]

Agreed. Thorleys 3/8's flange and thick tubing are worth every pennie.
Jedi the clipsters header from patriot will fit. The dougs D 310 fit reqlly well. Dont hang below the rail even had clearance for angled plugs..
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[INSIDIOUS '86]

I've seen your exhaust wrap rail. Yours is stock style but far from stock considering its hot a true y pipe and mandrel bends with an aftermarket muffler. Block hugger headers are just as you say but If one was to put shorties on a stock exhaust gains are hardly worth the pain it is to install and fab them to work.

I think the worst part of the stock exhaust is owed to the "y" pipe which is little more than a hole in the side of a pipe with the other welded over it. Long tube headers have more low end than shorties and tri y have an even greater effect than long tubes.
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[wraprail]

I had an exhaust done by a "muffler shop" one time that was like you describe (a hole blown into the side of one pipe with a torch with the other pipe welded over the hole at a 90 degree angle) not very good for performance.
One thing about the Doug's Headers, 3/8 thick flanges and 14 gauge material makes for a quality dam near leak free exhaust. Best $40 I ever spent (at pic-a-part) lol
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[INSIDIOUS '86]

Originally Posted by wraprail

I had an exhaust done by a "muffler shop" one time that was like you describe (a hole blown into the side of one pipe with a torch with the other pipe welded over the hole at a 90 degree angle) not very good for performance.
One thing about the Doug's Headers, 3/8 thick flanges and 14 gauge material makes for a quality dam near leak free exhaust. Best $40 I ever spent (at pic-a-part) lol
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Damn good deal. If you ever have problems with warped headers of any brand look at remflex gaskets. They rock!
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[wraprail]

Thanks for the tip on Remflex. Looks like a great product