problems starting for the first time

[blackmopar]

whats up guys - im trying to start my engine for the first time since installed - backfiring bad from the carb - nothing else

had a shop do the motor work, so pretty sure the dizzy aint in 180 - could it be too advanced? I go counterclockwise to retard, right? Had them install a hei over oe diz n points

anything else it could be? i checked firing order 18436572 (sbc 350)

Gas is about a year old (when the truck was last on the road) but its starting my lawn mower just fine dont ask me how i figured that out

need some input - im being stupid about something here

[Rich 5150 69]

use your timming light, with the key on (engine not running) and your #1 cylinder lined up on the mark 8 degrees before top dead center, rotate the dizzy until the light fires, stop, lock down the dizzy you`ll be right on he timming mark, disconect your timming light then try, if not correct something else is wrong.

[blackmopar]

rich, no light and no idea how to line #1 at -8tdc

guess i need to figure both of those out first - thanks for the qick response

[onequickchevy]

It is very easy for even an accomplished builder to put a dizzy in 180 out. Its easy to pull it up just enough for the gears to un mesh, turn the rotor 180 and set it back in. If you have fuel and fire I bet thats your problem.

[blackmopar]

man you might be right - i got fuel and fire - ive turned counterclockwise until it wont backfire anymore (just spin with starter) and then ever so slightly until it backfires again - dont seem like its got anything else? Im not real comfortable with pulling out the dizzy and rotating - anybody wanna do a 'for idiots' walk through?

[TopFuel1966]

Try this first........Make sure you don't have a couple of plug wires crossed. If that checks ok bring #1 up on 0 degrees TDC. To make sure you're on the compression stroke remove the #1 spark plug and put your thumb over the hole. You'll feel pressure against your thumb when approaching TDC on the compression stroke. When you have that set remove the distributor cap and make sure the rotor points towards the #1 plug wire connection on the cap. If it points towards #6 you're 180 degrees out. If you can stop the popping thru the carb by retarding the distributor you may be just 1 tooth off which is easy to have happen if you don't compensate for the helical cut drive gears when you drop the shaft into the hole. Good luck.

[blackmopar]

Originally Posted by TopFuel1966

Try this first........Make sure you don't have a couple of plug wires crossed. If that checks ok bring #1 up on 0 degrees TDC. To make sure you're on the compression stroke remove the #1 spark plug and put your thumb over the hole. You'll feel pressure against your thumb when approaching TDC on the compression stroke. When you have that set remove the distributor cap and make sure the rotor points towards the #1 plug wire connection on the cap. If it points towards #6 you're 180 degrees out. If you can stop the popping thru the carb by retarding the distributor you may be just 1 tooth off which is easy to have happen if you don't compensate for the helical cut drive gears when you drop the shaft into the hole. Good luck.

Top,
thats good stuff - will try when i get home tomorrow afternoon - when you say i might be 1 tooth off what do you mean? if im at tdc on #1cyl the rotor would point at #2 or #8 instead? How would I fix that? Still pull it up until the gears dont mesh and spin?

[onequickchevy]

I had a buddy back a long time ago that would drop in the distributor and wherever the rotor pointed, that would be # 1. He would then carry around clockwise with the firing order 18436572. His stuff always ran good. A tooth off will usually run, just very poorly. Input on the valves is vey good, if a machine shop built the engine, I would check with them and make sure that they pre set the lash.

[blackmopar]

Originally Posted by onequickchevy

I had a buddy back a long time ago that would drop in the distributor and wherever the rotor pointed, that would be # 1. He would then carry around clockwise with the firing order 18436572. His stuff always ran good. A tooth off will usually run, just very poorly. Input on the valves is vey good, if a machine shop built the engine, I would check with them and make sure that they pre set the lash.

ive heard of that firing order trick before - ill check with the shop - just a local garage - I had them install cam/springs and dizzy about 9 mos ago - as usual i was thinking id have all else buttoned up in short order (now almost a year ago) they were supposed to hand back a turnkey

Im planning to start this evening with getting #1 to tdc and checking rotorposition and go from there - hoping its just the 180 trick and go, we'll see!

[TopFuel1966]

Originally Posted by blackmopar

Top,
thats good stuff - will try when i get home tomorrow afternoon - when you say i might be 1 tooth off what do you mean? if im at tdc on #1cyl the rotor would point at #2 or #8 instead? How would I fix that? Still pull it up until the gears dont mesh and spin?

Exactly......When you line the rotor up to drop in on #1 you need to back the rotor up a little towards #2. That way when the dist. gear is fully engaged with the cam gear the rotor will point to #1 instead of towards #8. You also might need to turn the oil pump shaft slightly so that when the gears are fully engaged the dist housing will drop completely down with the hold -down flange flush against the block surface.

[markeb01]

You might also want to check and make sure the valves were/are adjusted. The first time I ever put an engine back together I forgot to set the valve lash at all. Cranked four batteries dead, then my uncle stopped by and pointed out the obvious.

[blackmopar]

ok so im pretty sure im 180 - i had the OL bump the starter while i felt for #1 compression - everytime I had compression on #1 the rotor was pointing towards the firewall (#6ish) not towards the PS pump (#1) - time to pull the dizzy up and rotate, right? I should go counterclockwise when I rotate, correct? and the oil pump shaft should be in the right position assuming its really 180 at this point??

[onequickchevy]

Loosen the clamp, slide it back, pick up the dizzy enough to allow the rotor to spin and turn it clockwise ( really doesn't matter, but to me its easier). Dont try to point it at one, just a bit before. When it drops in the rotor will spin to point correctly as it drops in. Oil pump rod should be fine. Let us know when it goes vroom for the first time.

[TopFuel1966]

Originally Posted by blackmopar

ok so im pretty sure im 180 - i had the OL bump the starter while i felt for #1 compression - everytime I had compression on #1 the rotor was pointing towards the firewall (#6ish) not towards the PS pump (#1) - time to pull the dizzy up and rotate, right? I should go counterclockwise when I rotate, correct? and the oil pump shaft should be in the right position assuming its really 180 at this point??

Correct...........it shouldn't matter which way you go to get towards #1. When you lift up on the dist you will notice that the rotor will turn ccw slightly. That's because the gears are cut on a bias. Then when you are ready to drop her in at #1 you need to turn the rotor ccw the same amount so that the dist gear will engage the cam gear correctly and the rotor will then point to #1 plug connector. If you line the rotor straight up on #1 and drop it in it will engage the cam gear one tooth off towards #8.

[blackmopar]

thanks guys it got too late and cold (im a socal puzzy now I guess) last night so Ill do tonight - Im not 100% sure I got it stopped on tdc#1 - tried to time it to tell the wife to stop crankin just before I felt compression but may have spun slightly past - If your standing in front of the motor the rotor is literally pointing at 12oclock - Im thinking I should literally just 180 and try - good thinking? Or should I spin it back around to just before #1tdc and then try and manually wrench the crank/balancer bolt to bring #1 up?
Sorry for the elementary questions guys - I cant afford to screw things up here.

[70inline6]

Spin motor to #1 TDC
Align rotor button to point to plug wire tower that leads to #1 spark plug
Snug dist slightly
Start motor
Adjust timing to spec
Tighten dist bolt

[Bugeyev8]

hook up a remote starter if working on this alone and bump it over with your thumb over the #1 plug hole, when it pops stop and line it up to tdc on the crank, this is TDC compression # 1, pull the cap and see where the rotor points, rotor should actually point towards the #1 cylinder towards the drivers side corner of the truck, the position on the cap on the rh on the front two positions when standing in fromt of the truck, the coil should be more or less paralell to the firewall when it time and with the distributor installed correclty...good luck

[blackmopar]

thanks bugeye - im there - bumped it and im just slightly past #1 tdc - and the rotor is pointing to 12oclock position (if I had been able to stop it at TDC, then the rotor would be at 11oclock) if standing in front of truck so I know I need to flip it - my concern is do I actually HAVE to be exactly as #1tdc to do this? if so Ill manually spin the motor back a bit - but I think if I understand right thats not critical if im just literally 180

[Bugeyev8]

I would get the thing right on TDC just back the engine up and then make sure that the oil pump shaft is fully seated, you may have to turn the engine a bit to make sure the dist is seated all the way

if you say this engine is rebuilt, I would drive the oil pump while the dist is out and pre oil it before firing it up, you can get a pre oiler shaft to attach to a drill at most auto parts stores

Good Luck, Brian

Originally Posted by blackmopar

thanks bugeye - im there - bumped it and im just slightly past #1 tdc - and the rotor is pointing to 12oclock position (if I had been able to stop it at TDC, then the rotor would be at 11oclock) if standing in front of truck so I know I need to flip it - my concern is do I actually HAVE to be exactly as #1tdc to do this? if so Ill manually spin the motor back a bit - but I think if I understand right thats not critical if im just literally 180

[Turkey]

Call the guys at the local shop and tell them you have a case of beer in your garage. At least one will stop by on their way home from work and help.