Cab swap in CA CHP rant

[leftybass209]

So it's no secret that i'm adamant about doing things legally to avoid issues down the road. I've posted numerous times on cab swap threads about doing these things the right way.

So much for the right way in my case.....

My truck was made an SPCNS, special construction vehicle. It's a 71 cab on a 69 frame. The CHP said it has to be an SPCNS. I didn't think that was right, and looked into the matter further. Going to the DMV was a waste of time because they say, and I quote " Officer XXXX is the authority on these matters, we agree with whatever he said".

I showed them and the officer the DMV regulation that states " A specially constructed vehicle does not include a vehicle which has been repaired or restored to its original design by replacing parts of modified from it's original design, [...] which is still recognizable as the original make".

It goes on to give an example that says, " Vehicles that are modified by a body change only, when the Certificate of Title held by the owner shows the correct make, is not registered as a SPCNS".

Even after reading this, the CHP officer says, " I don't concern myself with little details like that, the fact is the years don't match up, it's an SPCNS. I'm not trying to screw you, I want to make this right, but it has to be right".

I called every CHP office within 3 hours of here. Nobody will rewrite the paperwork, even though over half agreed that following the DMV regulation is the proper way to take care of the issue. I've also called some officials in the DMV regarding the issue, and neither has any jurisdictional control over the issue with one another, so it's at a stand still.

Therefore, i'm greatly sorry to anyone whom I've replied to in regards to taking care of cab swaps the right way. There is no right way apparently, and now i'm in the search for anything with a clean registered title to finish my truck.

Rant over, Merry Christmas

[midnight rambler]

peoples republic of california

[jeffahart]

Lefty,
How did the CHP get involved. Seems like you could have just registered it at DMV. Seems like a "like part" for a "like part" is nothing more than a replacement and repair part. Seems like you could just say, "I did some bodywork on the cab and reinstalled". When it comes to dancing around the dog $hit here in California..... I go this route... unless of course I think my insurance will use any issue as cause to not payout an accident claim, (and my insurance company is the bottom line when it comes to vehicles and construction). Else.... follow advise from the three wise monkeys! Never touched that tag!

[leftybass209]

...

[leftybass209]

Originally Posted by jeffahart

Lefty,
How did the CHP get involved.

The truck came from Texas, and an out of state vehicle needs to be inspected. I couldn't and wouldn't lie during the inspection because the cab was a different color/vin/ and all of that. The vin tag itself is also a different size and location between 69 and 71.

[jeffahart]

Oh, I see you bought it like that from Texas. I was thinking you did a cab replacement(which to me is a body part). What a hassle. Just for the record, I don't lie either, just try to do what's reasonable and prudent and move on. I guess the sad part is you will get no help to untangle the issue from the people you pay taxes to. Sorry to hear!

Merry Christmas to you also!

[slikside]

Originally Posted by leftybass209

So it's no secret that i'm adamant about doing things legally to avoid issues down the road. I've posted numerous times on cab swap threads about doing these things the right way.

So much for the right way in my case.....

My truck was made an SPCNS, special construction vehicle. It's a 71 cab on a 69 frame. The CHP said it has to be an SPCNS. I didn't think that was right, and looked into the matter further. Going to the DMV was a waste of time because they say, and I quote " Officer XXXX is the authority on these matters, we agree with whatever he said".

I showed them and the officer the DMV regulation that states " A specially constructed vehicle does not include a vehicle which has been repaired or restored to its original design by replacing parts of modified from it's original design, [...] which is still recognizable as the original make".

It goes on to give an example that says, " Vehicles that are modified by a body change only, when the Certificate of Title held by the owner shows the correct make, is not registered as a SPCNS".

Even after reading this, the CHP officer says, " I don't concern myself with little details like that, the fact is the years don't match up, it's an SPCNS. I'm not trying to screw you, I want to make this right, but it has to be right".

I called every CHP office within 3 hours of here. Nobody will rewrite the paperwork, even though over half agreed that following the DMV regulation is the proper way to take care of the issue. I've also called some officials in the DMV regarding the issue, and neither has any jurisdictional control over the issue with one another, so it's at a stand still.

Therefore, i'm greatly sorry to anyone whom I've replied to in regards to taking care of cab swaps the right way. There is no right way apparently, and now i'm in the search for anything with a clean registered title to finish my truck.

Rant over, Merry Christmas

Even when you're right...

Originally Posted by midnight rambler

peoples republic of california

...you're still wrong! Nailed it, rambler.

The bureaucrats in CA "are not happy, until you're not happy".

[sawman]

in ca laws are strict,too many people stealing stuff and selling parts cabs frames ect that are stolen,reg a few trucks/cars that dmv did a full search on the vin numbers frame and cab and motors,read in the local paper
last year a guy put a ton of money in a Harley he purchased motor frame separetly went in to reg it motor came up stolen,bike was seized right then,he lost over 23000 restoring it,just be honest when reg them what happens happen,

[73737373]

File complaint w/the CA Attorney General regarding the misinterpretation of the rules.

[kwmech]

PM'd you some info

[midniteblues]

So how does it feel to be a outlaw with a illegal truck...you rebel lol



Sorry I just had to.
I wouldn't wanna be in your shoes. Ca. Suxs.
It's not very merry here either but good luck.

[Spartan]

Does the designation involve higher fees. That would be my guess as to why they registered it in a different class. The CHP is a money making organization.
The DMV won't override the officer out of professional courtesy regardless of the rules. Sounds to me your CHP guy is actually not an authority in the field just an authority.

It's no just CA. Other states are following suit. Simple fact of the matter is unless you have money to burn implementing the vehicle code over the officers "opinion" will be a process. If you have money to burn get a legal professional specializing in such cases.

Of course this is all just my opinion. I was done with CA long ago. However I wish we had prop 13 in OR so my taxes wouldn't go up on my land 3% every year for the rest of my life. Makes a fixed income worth less the longer you live in the home you paid for. That's a rant for another day.

Happy holidays.

[tcrist]

Ok then, If you take a 2006 Corvette and put a different frame under it they will change the registration to a SPCN. If that is the case, you can do the swap, change it to a SPCN, do an SB100 on it and never have to smog it again, EVER!!!.

According to what was described that the CHP officer said, you should be able to.

[special-K]

So it all boils down to no matter how you go about it, just hope you never get pulled over by Major Dick of your jurisdiction's police force. They don't create the laws, they enforce them, and the final word should be up to the administration that wrote the regulation/law...the DMV. Major Dick is obviously misinterpreting the law. The written word of the law is the final word.

[sawman]

its best just do what it takes to make it legal,you do not want to get caught with 2 different years numbers,best just do it right `1 time and your done,good luck and happy holidays

[joeydurango]

I bought a truck out of state and had to have the Colorado State Patrol inspect it. Cab and frame VINs matched, but the cab had been swapped and the plate had obviously been removed and reinstalled. I ended up having to get an "assigned VIN" which was a whole new legal ID, new State Patrol-installed VIN plate, etc. No fun. But it did work out in the end.

[leddzepp]

Which title are you trying to register it under (I assume you have either the title to the 69 frame or the 71 cab?)

[cmo71]

Ahh, any excuse to take shots at the Gub'ment or the Po'...

I see a lot of folks saying "Major Dick" is wrong. Let us look at the actual DMV rule that the OP is referring to:

7.030 Specially Constructed Vehicles (CVC §§580 and 4153)
A specially constructed vehicle (SPCNS) is a vehicle built for private use, not for resale, and not constructed by a licensed manufacturer or remanufacturer.
•Specially constructed vehicles may be built from a kit, new or used parts, a combination of new and used parts, or from a vehicle reported as dismantled, as required by CVC §§5500 or 11520 which, when reconstructed, does not resemble the original make and model of the vehicle that was dismantled.
•A specially constructed vehicle does not include a vehicle which has been repaired or restored to its original design by replacing parts or modified from its original design, but not completely assembled from parts, which is still recognizable as the original make. ◦Example #1-A Volkswagen modified with a conversion kit to give the appearance of having the grill of a Rolls Royce is not registered as a specially constructed vehicle, because it still resembles and would be recognized as a Volkswagen.
This also applies to a Volkswagen modified with a "Baja Kit" in which the fenders, engine compartment lid, and possibly the front end, are modified, but leave the vehicle still recognizable as a Volkswagen.
◦Example #2-A motorcycle, such as a Harley Davidson, modified only with extended forks but still recognizable as a Harley Davidson is not registered as a SPCNS.
However, if a motorcycle is constructed entirely from parts, even if they are Harley Davidson parts, the vehicle cannot be registered as a Harley Davidson since it was not constructed by a manufacturer or remanufacturer; it must be registered as a SPCNS.
◦Example #3-Vehicles that are modified by a body change only, when the Certificate of Title held by the owner shows the correct make, is not registered as a SPCNS.

By virtue of pairing frames and bodies from different years to "construct" a vehicle, the previous owner created a special construction vehicle as far as California is concerned. A '69 truck is a '69 truck because Chevrolet made the frame and body (or "cab" in this example) for the '69 model year. Anything else is NOT a '69 truck. You mentioned in a previous post that the cab was a different color. None of your posts give a lot of detail on how your truck is actually built, but assuming the engine is from a different vehicle, other panels are different colors, how is the officer to discern that it's simply a "body swap" as opposed to a VIN swap of nefarious intent?

I admire you for wanting to do the right thing, but by bringing a vehicular Frankenstein into California, you're looking for more trouble than anyone needs to put up with. Do yourself a favor and find matching years of one or the other parts and get it registered the way you want it registered.

[leftybass209]

I appreciate the words about the issue. I did have a smog exemption form (sb100) but it states directly on that form (a re-wording of the SPCNS reg) that if the vehicle resembles a manufactured vehicle, it will not be granted smog exemption and will have to conform to 2015 smog and safety regulations- for all intents and purposes impossible.

The CA Smog referee also agreed this was handled incorrectly, and said once the paperwork is started it's practically impossible to have it changed and leaves the project dead in the water.

The CHP officer said, "if you find a 1969 cab, I might use the frame VIN so it can be registered as a 69." Key word- might. I questioned him on this and he said basically the VIN numbers have to match identically minus the unique last few, and have a documented paper trail. I told him that it's really expensive to do that on a, "might" statement, and he did little more than agree.

To clarify, the 71 cab was purchased here in CA. The truck has already passed NCIB, NCIC, nothing is stolen, and the CHP officer had no suspicion that it may have been, or that I had been trying to pull the wool over his eyes in any part of the process.

I've found a couple 1969 trucks that I'm going to look at. Fortunately the VIN doesn't identify different wheelbases.

Thanks again for the words everyone.

[Bob B.]

So, does your cab still have the VIN plate from the truck it come from, and your title shows the chassis VIN?

[leftybass209]

Yes, the 71 cab still has the 71 VIN. The 69 frame still has its respective VIN stampings.The cab now also has a CA blue VIN also attached to it. The CHP officer told me to remove the old VIN and discard it myself or scrapbook it, anything but let it turn up on another vehicle. When I originally called the Sacramento CHP (before the swap) they said the new VIN would reflect the frame VIN, which prompted me to go ahead with the swap in the first place. New requirements from the DMV say only the CHP officer in the vicinity of a given DMV office do the verifications, which forced me to stay in my area.

[leddzepp]

Wow...my head is spinning.

If you buy an out of state truck, bring a weight certificate (easily obtained), a hand written bill of sale is fine, and bring the title that matches the vin plate on the cab (vin plate must not be altered and have original rosette rivets, they DO look at that) and as long as the SPID is present with the matching vin you will walk away with a registered truck. If the DMV cannot verify the vin number on the plate with another "documented" vin number on a factory placed sticker (ie the SPID), they will send you to the CHP and they will find another VIN somewhere on the truck. They put it on a rack and comb the frame and cab until they find one.

[Bob B.]

That's a tough one. Wish I had a better way out for you, but it sounds like you are at the mercy of that Chippy.

[leddzepp]

Smog exemption? Huh? Regardless of it being a 69 or 71 it IS exempt I am cornfused as well. I guess that comes into play when the vehicle is "special construction"? This is a good learning experience for sure. One of the biggest reasons I am into these trucks is that they are smog exempt here, and I have never once had an issue with that, no matter if the truck originated here or was brought in out of state.

Time to hit the reset button as you suggested in your first post.

[leftybass209]

When a vehicle is titled SPCNS it no longer is associated with whatever year it resembles, but rather, the year it was registered. In this case I now own a 2015 C10 so to speak. Oddly enough, this is in stark contrast to getting the smog exemption papers, in which they ask if you'd like to be smog exempt by either what year the body resembles, or by the engine. If the body is chosen, say, a 1976, it must have cats, egr, smog pump.... etc. While they don't actually check tail pipe emissions, every two years they inspect the vehicle for its equipment to be in place. If chosen by the motor, and you have an LS for example, all modern emissions equipment must be present. Naturally most people choose to go by the motor if it's a SBC, which usually gets backdated to 1960, and requires a closed pcv system only. This was all told to me by the CA BAR referee.