Towing a gooseneck trailer with a C-10

[texnician01]

Hello everyone, have a couple questions. I have a 69 2wd, lwb, c-10 with 327, sm465, 3.73 rearend and HD rear springs. I also have an antique pulling tractor that I am needing to tow occasionally. Maybe 200 mi once a month not a daily haul. I am looking at a 20 foot deckover gooseneck rated at 14,000 lbs. My tractor would be a MAX 9000 lbs. I know that GM rated the 12 bolt up to something like 6800 GVWR in the later heavy half trucks. and the outer axle bearings are used in many 3/4 and 1 ton semi floating applications too. I am looking at putting on some small airbags just to adjust ride height if needed.

First, anyone have a gooseneck hitch they are currently using how is it installed, no one makes a bolt in hitch for these because of the crossmember over the rear axle (coil springs) that the shocks bolt to. I am currently planning to fabricate a hitch cutting the middle out of the crossmember and using a giant piece of C-channel, with some large angle or 3" C-channel extending out to the framerails.

Second, anyone have any info on what the 12 bolt will handle? I currently have drums all around but will be looking for a set of 3/4 lower a arms soon for disks up front and maybe HD rear brakes. Trailer will also have brakes on both axles. Any info on what the max weight rating was on the 12 bolt from any year?

I know the axle will handle more than the 5000 gvw on the factory plate. my grandfather had a 67 with a 12 bolt, he worked heavy equipment, that truck hauled 1500lbs of cargo every single day of it's life. On many occasions much more than that. I have hauled 4000lbs of gravel in my truck, i worried about it a bit but it made it. That was totally an accident by the way, never doing that again. Have the scale slip to prove it somewhere. I figure I might be able to load the tractor and have the trailer carry most of that weight but I figure I may have 1500 lbs to 2000 lbs max on my truck. I have a truck to use it, this is not a garage queen, but don't want to get crazy with it either. Let me know if anyone has any suggestions. By the way, "get a 3/4 ton" is not an option.

Thanks, have a good day.

[One Chevy Scotty]

It's just my opinion, but I would try a smaller trailer. I have a similar trailer, and it weighs in at 7700 empty weight. I think that if you had a bumper pull type trailer (weighs less) you would be better off, and I don't believe that the overall weight is going to kill your rear end, but it sure isn't going to do your brakes any good, or the tires for that matter. Your safety and that of the motoring public are at stake, and an overloaded truck/trailer combination can be a really bad situation (take it from someone who has learned the hard way and lived).

Best luck with whatever you decide to do.

[texnician01]

I agree safety is a large concern of mine, hence the reason for the upgraded brakes, My buddy has a trailer very similar to what I am looking at and his only weighs about 5000 lbs. I know there are many variables and am just trying to get all the ducks in a row to make a decision. I thought about bumper hitch but my experience has been they don't pull as nice and distribute the weight unevenly resulting in less control with this weight. That is still an option though.

Thanks for the reply.

Nathan

[jdstx]

Here is a hitch option. Fifth wheel rails are universal and relatively flat with no hitch attached. About $100. The gooseneck plate was around $125.

[capev86]

front disc brakes (i suggest quality ceramic pads) and trailer brakes and you should be good . there is no need to change the control arms to upgrade the brakes. if the trailer brakes work properly, then the truck brakes shouldn't have a problem, especially with front disc. as for trailer weight......how long is the trailer and what is the weight with the tractor on it? hd option springs are the same as 3/4 ton springs. you could always swap them out for 3/4 ton HD springs to fight sag if that is a problem. unless this is the type of trailer you haul behind big dump trucks, then your truck should be able to handle it on occasional excursions.

[Sublvr72]

It might be a bit much for a half ton. I'm sure it might be able to tow it but you need to worry about safely being able to stop the load.

[Schwinn68]

I would think that with the airbags the truck should handle the load. I would definitely look into getting some good disc brakes for the truck. You'll also want to make sure the wiring is in good condition as you will be putting a lot of added stress on it running trailer and a good brake controller. They used these trucks for this same type of stuff when they came out so I don't see why you can't do the same. Post up some pics when you get that rig all loaded up! I love old iron.

['72customdeluxe]

Way too much weight, what about brakes?

[tomtuna1978]

if it were me ..... id try and get the biggest front disc brakes i could find, convert it to a hydrobooster, and find a full floater rear diff out of a newer truck with disc brakes and put it in .... then id tow the crap out of it

[Pickupmanx2]

Just my opinion, but I think you are getting too much trailer, and that is going to up your GVW, what is the length of your tractor,,, maybe a shorter bumper pull, or a shorter Goose er, but, these old trucks are workers, and I would just suggest GOOD trailer brakes and a good controller!

['72customdeluxe]

You can have whatever heavy duty parts you want and it won't break. The problem is it's a short (for modern standards) wheelbase truck that weighs less than 4000 pounds. The trailer will towing you... You wouldn't put a huge trailer behind a Colorado just because it had a Dana 60 and a reinforced frame..

[neba]

so your asking if you can tow a 9000 lb tractor with a 1/2 ton pickup thats 40 years old? are you serious?

[capev86]

what are you talking about too short a wheelbase? he said it was a long bed, so handling won't be a problem. people pull trailers far heavier than the tow vehicle all the time. if he has hd springs in the back and the trailer is under 10,000 pounds, a properly equipped 1/2 ton truck should have no problem on minor trips provided that 327 has enough low end torque to do the job (not likely). he also said the trailer has its own brake system, so again you don't have to worry about the trailer overloading the truck. like any other heavy towing job, you just have to give plenty of room for stopping and take it easy on corners 'cause trailers like to keep going straight. just put the standard disc brakes on the front with some ceramic pads and it would be ok. for a lot of heavy towing just buying a 3/4 or 1 ton truck would be better. the rear drums are bigger and the whole chassis is more rugged including the beefy track bar.

[C-10 simplex]

i know you said "get a 3/4 ton" is not an option, but that's really the only right way to do it. i'm not a towing expert, but i've tried towing heavy with a car that wasn't up to the task a few times---it just doesn't work safely. It just doesn't feel right.


If you must use your 1/2 ton, then perhaps consider a tag-a-long trailer and this:

https://www.shogunindustries.com/cgi...fftowintro.htm

If the trailer brakes are good, then it's now a matter of pullling the weight, not supporting it on the frame. Maybe the 12 bolt could handle the weight, but why take the chance?


a) Lightweight campers, atv/motorcycle, very small boat trailers and the like are ok, but i dont think 1/2 ton trucks can really tow anything with any weight on it. 3/4 and 1 ton is the only way to do it right with the possible exception of the item i listed above.

['72customdeluxe]

Originally Posted by capev86

what are you talking about too short a wheelbase? he said it was a long bed, so handling won't be a problem. people pull trailers far heavier than the tow vehicle all the time. if he has hd springs in the back and the trailer is under 10,000 pounds, a properly equipped 1/2 ton truck should have no problem on minor trips provided that 327 has enough low end torque to do the job (not likely). he also said the trailer has its own brake system, so again you don't have to worry about the trailer overloading the truck. like any other heavy towing job, you just have to give plenty of room for stopping and take it easy on corners 'cause trailers like to keep going straight. just put the standard disc brakes on the front with some ceramic pads and it would be ok. for a lot of heavy towing just buying a 3/4 or 1 ton truck would be better. the rear drums are bigger and the whole chassis is more rugged including the beefy track bar.

rc/sb ford these days is 128" wheelbase. I said relatively, compared to modern vehicles rated to tow less than he wants even with way more motor, weight, brakes, leafs which are way better for hauling, front and rear sway bars, a frame not made of wet pasta etc..

[soulman67]

For brakes you would just need to get a trailer brake control. A 20ft. gooseneck trailer should come equiped with atleast one braking axel. So braking wouldn't be a problem. You could just weld in some 6in. chanel iron on the frame about 2in. in front of the center point of the rear axel cut a hole in it for the gooseneck ball.

Back when these trucks where new you would see a lot of 1/2 ton trucks pulling 16ft and 20ft cattle trailers. People pull 5th wheel campers with 1/2 tons.

[texnician01]

Well, lots of excellent points on both sides of the fence. I have no doubt that I can pull it with no problem, and yes the trailer has brakes on both axles. I want to change lower A arms to 3/4 to to convert to disks using all GM parts, keeping my 6 Bolts. As far as size of the trailer, it is a little larger than I would have to have but I want to be able to use it for other things also like if we had a car to haul somewhere a short trailer to fit my tractor would not work for that. As far as wiring is concerned, I am making an isolator so the trailer lights will not be drawing on my truck system, power will come straight from the battery and the truck light system will only be used as a switching signal with no load. For a brake controller I am looking at one of the proportional controllers that works on inertia, seem to be the top of the line today. Going to be a year or two before I can get all of this done, and want to have the truck all ready to go before I even look at a trailer. Oh and I forgot sway bars front and rear as well. We'll see by the time I get the tractor all ready to go I may even have a bigger truck but I doubt it.

So the general consensus seems to be that the axle will handle the weight. Anyone have any numbers of what the GVW was in the Heavy Half trucks in the later years I was thinking I saw somewhere that they went as high as 7200lbs using a 12 or 10 bolt. Those had HD rear brakes and Disks up front.

Thanks again for the replies.

Nathan

[dwaite72lnghrn]

It's your truck, But I would not do it with a half ton truck. You are confusing GAWR with GVWR and not considering GCVWR. Start with the rear axle what kind is it? They had a 3300lb and a 3500lb rear axle. 3/4 ton had a 5200lb and a 5500lb axle.
A 14000 lb trailer will be putting about 3800lb on the hitch point and is approaching the max weight a '09 hd3500 with a 9000lb rear duramax can haul. I think to expect a 40 year old truck to do it is asking too much. JUST MY OPINION.

[cleanfreak]

I have been towing trailers for 26 years ( that math makes me feel old!) with 1/2 ton and 3/4 ton chevy's. Beat the trucks till they were dead three times over. I would get rid of a 1/2 ton truck when REAR tire wear showed me the housing was bent. 14000 pound trailer should put approx. 1400 pounds on the hitch if loaded correctly , if you are not doing it every day , that should not kill the 12 bolt. Have you checked the laws in your state for how much you can legally put behind your truck? Just my 2 cents also.

[monte0185]

I havent seen this mentioned so ill add my .02 cents worth. I have been doing this along time as well and its not that the truck is not capable of doing it, its a safety issue if something goes wrong. Now with that being said the single biggest point of failure on a 12 bolt rear end is the c clips that hold in the axles. With that much weight and older bearings whenever you turn a corner its putting all the stress on those clips one is gonna break eventually. Once the clip breaks there goes your axle out of the housing driving down a road. Not a pretty site!!! This was the reason for the 3/4 ton design of axles that bolt directly to the hub. Now they make a kit to change this in a 12 bolt IIRC.

Hope everything goes well and stay safe.

[Richard H.]

I assure you will be a cop magnet when you are out. I pull my ferd 861 tractor and bush hog with my 18' deck over behind my F 250.
Thats 8 lug wheels with 10 ply tires @ 80lbs psi. I'm just legal... you are not,sorry.

[neba]

i agree, its not a question of can you get it down the road. its can do it safely and legally. you also may want to check into DOT regulations as well as insurance

[Zoomin]

Is your route downhill both ways? I can't imagine a 327 being able to get out of its own way pulling that.

How about renting a rig that's up to the task?