1974 C20 Soon to become a project...

[Super_Dave]

I just closed a deal on a 1974 C20 Custom Deluxe. It appears to be all original, with a nice running 350 4bbl and TH Automatic.

Only cancer is the typical battery tray/core support/inner fender lip and the inner rockers and inner kick panels (1" up from the floorboards) Exterior is really, straight... with the only exception being the bowed tailgate and a couple of dings and scrapes. Could use a good wash and detailing.

The chrome bumper has a small wow in the top, the rear lower corner by the back bumper has a shallow ding and the same side of the bed has the worst dent on the belt-line, but really fairly small.

The engine bay only needs some good cleaning and maybe the flat black parts repainted. The clear coat is nearly gone on the body, except on parts of both doors.

Plans call for:

1. An ECE Front Spindle conversion to C10, so I can keep all the C20 HD parts.
2. 1" Drop coils in the front to get it at 3.5" if the 2.5" doesn't look like enough.
3. Dutchman rear axles punched for C10 pattern so I can keep all the rest of the C20 HD parts.
4. Swap in a newer Tilt Column with wiper delay.
5. Flip kit in the rear and maybe a c-notch if needed to get me 4"-5". Toss the HD leaves.
6. Appropriate wheel and tire combination to achieve the look I want. (probably the hardest decision to make on the project.)
7. Rhino Liner on the bed only.. not the wheel tubs.
8. 1.25" sway bar in the back.
9. R/R the bumpers.
10. Crimson Red and White paint - base coat clear coat... jury is out on keeping the trim and badges... might just go with two tone and striping.
11. Black leather and Gray Tweed upholstery and gray wool carpet.
12. Swap the 350 with my other motor: A 1970 350 010 high nickle content 030 over with lots of goodies.
13. Updated gauge cluster and stereo-speakers.

I have some researching to do before I start collecting parts and setting aside the funds. I will start a specific thread once all the fun begins.

[Super_Dave]

In the photos, you can see the bowed tailgate when it's open. The trunnion needs attention as well... so most likely will be looking for a replacement tailgate that doesn't need bodywork, and redo the trunnions. You can also see the only real body work that needs to be done in three of the photos.

The aftermarket wheels will be finding a new home at some point.

I will do a complete once over on the front suspension at my brothers shop; replacing what needs replacing when we do the drop spindles.

The steering is an OEM variable Ratio unit, but I might be sending it to Tennessee for a quick ration conversion.

All the mechanicals work like they did from the factory.

The replacement motor can be seen below as well... currently residing in a 1974 International... The current resident in the C20 will take up residence in the International and be stored for my daughter to drive when she is old enough. We will be blending a 1974 Step Side and Fleetside IH into one pickup for her... and save the parts for any "repairs" she might need done!

[walkerb]

Nice soild truck! I agree the rims are hideous

[CHIZZLER]

Looks like a nice solid truck.

[Super_Dave]

Yeah, I've crawled all over it and it's in really great shape. I was concerned about the typical cancer spots, but someone kept the crud from collecting on this one, because it needs hardly anything in the way of body work. The inside is dry as a bone... no moisture whatsoever, no moldy smell.

I almost pulled the trigger on a Seattle C10 but it was manual everything, steering, transmission, breaks... and I wanted to keep the 350/TH400 package... so I passed.

I couldn't find any C10 candidates that weren't over priced basket cases, so I started considering C20's. I have a '79 chassis blasted and primed, with a 12B rear, but with the ECE C10 conversion and how nice this truck is, I'm going to save the '79 and do a graft onto the '74 International for my daughter. That way she will have all Chevy running gear and a 350/TH400 combo.

[slotard]

Details on the quick steering?

[Super_Dave]

Originally Posted by slotard

Details on the quick steering?

My bad... Chip Woyner is in Branson Missouri, not Tennessee. This is what I will be doing to my C20 and my daughters '74 IH when the time comes.

Essentially, I will go from 4+ turns lock to lock, to 2.5 to 3 turns. Once the suspension is tightened up (ball joints, etc where needed), the improvement will be huge. The price beats a $1200 or more R&P setup for someone on a budget.

http://www.powersteering.com/

[Low Elco]

Originally Posted by Super_Dave

My bad... Chip Woyner is in Branson Missouri, not Tennessee. This is what I will be doing to my C20 and my daughters '74 IH when the time comes.

Essentially, I will go from 4+ turns lock to lock, to 2.5 to 3 turns. Once the suspension is tightened up (ball joints, etc where needed), the improvement will be huge. The price beats a $1200 or more R&P setup for someone on a budget.

http://www.powersteering.com/

Chip's work is the bomb!

[Super_Dave]

Progress has been made on the Speedhut Gauge Install.

The Speedhut gauges are a tad smaller OD than the poor NVU gauges. Had I not modified the dash bezel for the NVU gauges, I might have been able to retain the OEM inner silver ring. I might try it on another bezel in the future.

Given the size difference in the OD of the gauges, I modified the dash bezel gauge openings by grinding away the inner lip I left for holding the inner trim ring I was going to use. I was not happy with how the ring edges fit inside the openings, as well. So, I decided to mount them from behind.

After the inner lip as ground away, we hand sanded the inner profile through three grits. Before final finishing of the dash bezel, we will sand one more time.

I filled the back of the Dash Bezel, surrounding the four system gauges, with 5 Minute Epoxy. After setting up for several hours, we sanded the epoxy, and the gauge housings, level with the dash bezel outer perimeter.

The we started laser cutting acrylic holders for the system gauges; making minor adjustments along the way. The goal was to provide enough flexibility to install gauge pairs and allow 360° holder movement to center the gauges in their respective holes.

We also had to make a half circle relief cut to clear the bezel mounting boss. The decision was made to do the relief cut on both the top and bottom gauge holder, making for a more universal fit and eliminate accidentally putting one holder in the wrong location. Once you start epoxying in the holders, you can just go back and redo it.

It took about an hour to test fit and re-cut until we had a fit that was acceptable. In the photos, we have the holders held in place temporarily with double stick tape. The edges are not perfectly lined up but will be in final assembly.

Once mocked up, you can see the gauges fit well and look great. The top of the gauge bezels are flush with the top of the dash bezel, which is the look we were after. We did get some minor sanding scratches on the dash bezel, which look worse that then are, and refinishing the dash bezel will take care of the marks.

We are ready for the final gauge holder processing. We will cut them from .125" Acrylic, and paint the backs with gloss black. The black will show through the clear front, making it look like black acrylic. Once the paint is dry on the back, we will cover the back of the gauge holders with vinyl to protect the paint from scratching off.

Then we will install the gauges and epoxy each holder to the back of the dash bezel. This is where filling the back of the dash comes into play. We needed something for the holders to lay against and the gauge housings were too thin to accommodate any holding technique, let alone provide any adjustment, so filling the voids with epoxy gave a much larger surface for the holders to lay against. We are toying around with laser cutting holes for small screws in the holders and screwing the holders to the epoxy filled back. It would give more options in the case we ever wanted to replace the holders due to damage, or color changes... etc.

Excuse the blurry photos... not sure what happened there. We did try using expandable foam around the two center gauge holes, but in the end, once the outer hard surface was removed, the foam was way too soft to be of any use. So, you can see the dams we are installing, to hold the epoxy around the ribs that are lower that the gauge housings. Once the epoxy hardens, we will repeat the same process from the system gauges and create and install an acrylic gauge holder for the Speedometer and Tachometer. From there, we will refinish the dash bezel and call it good to go.

[Super_Dave]

All the epoxy work is done on the back of the dash bezel. We laser cut the speedometer and tachometer gauge holder as one unit from .125" acrylic.

Over the past few days, we tried, unsuccessfully, to put a satin black finish coat on the dash. Where we had issues, was the convoluted, beveled curve of the gauge holes, which wrap back on top of them selves in two place. Getting good coverage on the hole perimeters, always left too much material on the outer face of the bezel, making the texture all but disappear.

After three failed attempts, and stripping the bezel three times, I decided to dip the bezel with either Black Carbon Fiber Hydrographics. The bezel will be delivered in the morning and ready to install by July 6th.

In preparation for the dipping, we installed the gauges into the acrylic holders, center the clusters into their respective holes and tacked them down with hot glue all around the edges of the holders. The Carbon Fiber graphics will wrap around the entire front surface, including the faces of the acrylic holders that will be exposed around the gauges. Should have a seamless look from end to end and top to bottom.

Once the dipping is done, we may add a layer of fiberglass cloth or some type of additional reinforcement.

[old Rusty C10]

nice truck

[Gregski]

she's nice, real nice

[Super_Dave]

Gregski,

Been following your build. Good stuff.
My SIL still lives in the Sacratomato area. My little brother passed suddenly last April. She is thinking about moving Northward, but can't come to grips with leaving the Cali weather. Can't say I blame her.

[whitedog76]

I've always loved the 70's trucks, much more than the 80's versions.

Don't do anything silly like changing the front sheet metal.

Why swap out the axle and change to 1/2 ton? I personally love the heavy duty 8 luggers.

[Super_Dave]

Whitedog76,

I wanted a C10 that I could lower in a mild fashion but there are no quality C10's around my area. The ones that are available, cost 2-3 times what I paid for this C20 and they still need a lot of bodywork. So I opted for this C20, figuring I can swap in C10 stuff with the money I saved on body work buying a high quality C20.

If I could achieve the look I want with aftermarket and stock C20 running gear, I would consider it, but the aftermarket manufacturers cater almost exclusively to C10's.

[Ziegelsteinfaust]

Dont forget you could use C30 drop spindles if you get the calipers.

Also consider looking for a 14SF. It is like a overgrown 10 bolt, and can be adapted to the 5x5 pattern easier then a 14FF. Plus it worth a couple mpg when geared due to dramatic weight loss.

I prefer the C20 since breaks are much better, and today's tires are big enough to do what ever you would want.

[Super_Dave]

Ziegelsteinfaust:

Thanks for the options. This modification, will be the most time-consuming implementation wise.

I don't really need a lot of weight handling capability, as I will use it mostly for cruising transportation and hauling occasional sheet goods for the shop.

I have a 1979 12B in hand already, along with the complete front frame clip, so I will most likely go that route and swap all the parts over. The 14B FF rear differential is in extremely good shape and will have to find a home with someone who really needs/wants that level of robustness.

[Country705]

Love the truck...I can't wait to read about your progress!

[Super_Dave]

Country705,

Thanks. I look at it as I bought a C10 in really nice ALMOST rust free shape, with C20 running gear, for a price that most C10 pickups with major issues sell for.

My business took a big hit last June and it looks like there will be slim pickings for another year, so I opted for a nice running pickup that only needs bolt on upgrades as funds allow and will save the paint and interior for last. The cost of the drop kits, brakes, wheels and tires will cost me about 50% of the total build.

With the shape of this C20, I will be saving big money on body and paint. I have a friend who has done body work for several decades, who will do what little work I need done for cash, saving me a lot. I will most likely be staying with the factory Crimson Red and no side stripe, so I don't have to paint the firewall or interior cab... and shaving the trim and badges as well. I will do the Raptor Bed Liner myself.

I will redo the all the interior upholstery, including the dash, (except the seat), sound deadening, insulation and carpet myself.

When funds allow, I will be adding the flush fit windshield, rear window and maybe one-piece door glass from One Piece Products. This will be followed with electric door locks and windows. Selling my wife's 1998 Explorer XLT and the 14B FF axle will add a few funds to the mix as well.

Once I have the money set aside to start the engine/suspension swap, I will start an actual build thread. Until then, I am researching, asking questions and planning the best options to achieve the end result I am looking for.

[y5mgisi]

Looks good!

[Super_Dave]

I have been gradually going over the the '74 to see what all needs to be done. In doing so, I have a couple of questions:

1. The drivers door will not stay open. I am not familiar with these doors, as previous trucks I have had use a synthetic wedge type material mounted to the hinge surface to hold the door open.

The passenger side works well, but I cannot seem to isolate what actually creates the tension when the door is open, so I can compare to the driver side. Repro hinges are available for $20+ but if I can fix the OEM, that would be preferable.

The hinge pins are fine in both doors and and absolutely no door sag.

2. I have to actually keep hold of the door handles when closing the doors, as they want to pop right back out. They stay semi-latched, but want to pop out to that partial open position unless you give it a firm close and keep pressure against the door handle to keep it from jumping back. Something needs adjusting... just not sure what it is. It's almost like an atmospheric pressure sort of feeling... I know weird description, but going with what it feels like.

[y5mgisi]

What holds the door open is the "S" looking spring on the hinge shown here. The two serrated roller looking deals roll on the spring and hold it in place.



For being hard to close, check and make sure there is a bushing on the door striker still.

[Oregoon]

Greetings from SE Portland. I work in Tualatin, and for some reason, your truck looks familiar.

I spent months hunting for a new project/driver. While a Squarebody was on the list, my main criteria was an inline six, 3OTT, and a longbed. I looked at everything from flathead Dodge to '50s Fords when I found my C15 for a screaming deal.

Seems like prices are all over the map around here lately. While we don't salt our roads, we do have a lot of rain, so rust still happens... I saw ratty swiss-cheese 60's GMs going for absurd amounts, and a beautiful Studebaker that the guy was just about giving away...

Anyway, glad to see you found what you were after! I love the 3/4 ton trucks, though I understand your desire to change it to 5-lug.

[Super_Dave]

Oregoon...

I live about 5 minutes from Tualatin. The PO of this truck is from Tigard... Washington Square area.

The main selling point for me was the condition of the sheet metal and it being a really dry truck. A bonus was a nice running OEM 350 and TH400, so I have a backup engine/trans that my son and I want to do some serious work on when time and funds allow. Haven't had a screaming motor since my '69 Z28 302 M22 4 Speed...

[Oregoon]

Originally Posted by Super_Dave

Oregoon...

I live about 5 minutes from Tualatin. The PO of this truck is from Tigard... Washington Square area.

The main selling point for me was the condition of the sheet metal and it being a really dry truck. A bonus was a nice running OEM 350 and TH400, so I have a backup engine/trans that my son and I want to do some serious work on when time and funds allow. Haven't had a screaming motor since my '69 Z28 302 M22 4 Speed...

I must've seen it. My mom lives off off Greenburg, and I have a bunch of friends around Progress and Metzger (I grew up in Aloha, Beaverton, Hillsboro, etc).

Looks like a really straight find! Congrats!