Painless or Ron francis - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

**Nima** · 11-25-2004, 11:10 AM

Happy thanksgiving to all:
I am getting close to order my new wiring harness and I guess I narrowed it to these two brands. Which one do you prefer or think is better? Ron Francis seems to be 30 t0 40% more expensive. Thanks.
Nima

Russell · 11-25-2004, 11:13 AM

Painless will be perfect for you, I have yet to hear anyone say anything negative about them

ChevyDude · 11-25-2004, 11:13 AM

M&H....if you want it to look Identicle to the stock GM harness.

68LSS1 · 11-25-2004, 11:41 AM

Ron Francis. But Ron Francis can put the connector you will need for later model GM columns or the aftermarket ones. They can put the connector on it for the alternator that you will be using (one wire, integral regulator, etc). Got a HEI distributor? They can put that connector on. Personally, I'd go with the M & H over the Painless if your running a stock set up.

*Randy70C-10* · 11-25-2004, 11:50 AM

I've installed three Painless kits so far and love'm. They are very easy, trouble free, and fairly inexpensive.

**Nima** · 11-25-2004, 12:22 PM

I don't have HEI yet but that's gona changed at the same time I do rewiring (I hope it is not too complicated to do them at the same time!). Also, under the hood is not all original and I don't mind upgrading or new looks, therefore stock look is not that important for me but I appreciate all different inputs.

Kid · 11-25-2004, 12:24 PM

I have used M&H also and am very impressed. They are easy to get help from over the phone also. Never used Painless, so can't say good or bad.

70c10 · 11-25-2004, 12:27 PM

Randy, did the Painless kit include the factory style connectors for the wiper motor, ignition, headlights, heater, etc.,?. If it did, are they already attached or do you just splice them on?

*Randy70C-10* · 11-25-2004, 01:27 PM

All connectors are already attached for everything under the dash, all you have to do is plug everything in. The lights and engine section you have to trim to proper length and terminate with connectors. It's very easy and makes for a cleaner installation because you can route the wiring however you wish since they give you an extra couple of feet to work with.

gonebad2 · 11-25-2004, 01:28 PM

I went with a Painless too.....No problems to report here.

*Randy70C-10* · 11-25-2004, 01:45 PM

Here's some of the under-cash wiring to give you an idea.....

Wootdog · 11-25-2004, 03:49 PM

I agree with Randy. I did my 67 wiring harness with painless, and yes it is painless. Now for the 68 I will go that way again. Kerry

Vince Putt · 11-25-2004, 06:31 PM

I was The very first customer of Painless Wiring. Some twenty years ago I believe. I was so impressed by what they offered I asked what would it take to be a dealer Dennis and his partner looked at each other and grinned, I thought they were going to HI-Five on the spot. I've been using their products ever since. It keeps getting better and better.

GreyHoundSteve · 11-26-2004, 12:14 PM

I bought my painless harness from O'reileys because autozone was out of stock. It looks great and should be a cinch to install.

Harold Shepard · 11-26-2004, 12:30 PM

Depends on what you want now and later, the painless is labelled and comes with connecters but needs some things imo. If you have plenty of time and know your way around these trucks well then go with the painless- especially if the stock look s not your thing. Otherwise go with M&H. They plug right in- no crimps you have to do (less chance for operator/installer screw- up) they have the correct connectors, no hunting or robbing from the old harness, and you will be done and resady to roll in 2 hrs tops for complete truck, painless 8-12 hrs- as there are crimps to make, wires to cut, decissio to tape or sheath and zip ties to install. Was not a hard decission for me... M&H

benoit454 · 12-02-2004, 09:09 PM

Where can I find this M and H wiring harness? Is it for 73-87's?

4x4Poet · 12-02-2004, 09:45 PM

I have no experience with complete, replacement wiring sets/harnesses, but I was at a local customizing shop today and talked with the owner about an engine swap they'd done into a '60s F#$d. They also had put in a complete wiring harness tailored to the engine & vehicle combo. He said he used to use Painless, but once he compared them to Ron Francis stuff, he's used RF ever since. He said RF is admittingly more expensive but worth the extra cost.

He liked the overall quality, pre-terminated ends, new-style blade fuse block, and especially how each wire has printing on each wire's sheath every six inches or so saying what each wire goes to. So, if you are routing a wire away from its start or terminus, you can see at a glance what circuit you're working with. Does Painless do the same with their wiring harness wire sheaths?

Never heard of M&H. I, too, would like to view their website and know if they are the supplier of "factory original" wiring harnesses found in 67-72 Chevy truck part suppliers' catalogs.

ChevyDude · 12-02-2004, 10:17 PM

Just replaced both harnesses up front under the hood (lights and engine) and it could not have been easier. They were M&H and all I did was remove the old two harnesses and plug in the two new ones. THey fit exactly like the originals. I was done in about an hour.

imdarren · 12-03-2004, 12:41 AM

Ok. Does anyone have info on where to get M&H products?
A web site maybe?
Or is M&H part of the Ron Francis product line? I'm confused because I've never heard of M&H.

Thanks!

1972 · 12-03-2004, 02:51 AM

via google

4x4Poet · 12-03-2004, 09:33 AM

Thanks, 1972, for helping out us lazy posters!

11-25-2004, 11:10 AM	#1
Nima Blue 67 Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Western WA Posts: 1,178	Painless or Ron francis Happy thanksgiving to all: I am getting close to order my new wiring harness and I guess I narrowed it to these two brands. Which one do you prefer or think is better? Ron Francis seems to be 30 t0 40% more expensive. Thanks. Nima

11-25-2004, 11:13 AM	#2
Russell Professional Grade Join Date: May 2003 Location: Fort McMurray, Alberta Posts: 7,915	Painless will be perfect for you, I have yet to hear anyone say anything negative about them __________________ 1995 Chevrolet 2 Door Tahoe (6.6L LBZ Duramax / ZF6 / NP241 with 1 ton solid axle swap)

11-25-2004, 11:13 AM	#3
ChevyDude Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 3,071	M&H....if you want it to look Identicle to the stock GM harness. __________________ Alex 1971 Lil' Red 350 SBC 700R4

11-25-2004, 11:41 AM	#4
68LSS1 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Tampa Posts: 1,191	Ron Francis. But Ron Francis can put the connector you will need for later model GM columns or the aftermarket ones. They can put the connector on it for the alternator that you will be using (one wire, integral regulator, etc). Got a HEI distributor? They can put that connector on. Personally, I'd go with the M & H over the Painless if your running a stock set up. __________________ '68 Short Step LS1/T56, Hydratech, Fatman Fabrications Stage III, Baer, Hot Rods to Hell, US Body, S&W, etc

11-25-2004, 12:24 PM	#7
Kid Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Kansas Posts: 702	I have used M&H also and am very impressed. They are easy to get help from over the phone also. Never used Painless, so can't say good or bad. __________________ The kid Build threads: 51 Jimmy http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=154951 http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=219902 http://www.classictrucks.com/feature...uck/index.html 68 C10 http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...ad.php?t=50348

11-25-2004, 11:50 AM	#5
Randy70C-10 Account Suspended Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Virginia Beach, Va. U.S.A. Posts: 15,320	I've installed three Painless kits so far and love'm. They are very easy, trouble free, and fairly inexpensive.

11-25-2004, 12:22 PM	#6
Nima Blue 67 Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Western WA Posts: 1,178	I don't have HEI yet but that's gona changed at the same time I do rewiring (I hope it is not too complicated to do them at the same time!). Also, under the hood is not all original and I don't mind upgrading or new looks, therefore stock look is not that important for me but I appreciate all different inputs.

11-25-2004, 12:27 PM	#8
70c10 67-72 Addict! Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: The TAX State! Posts: 7,857	Randy, did the Painless kit include the factory style connectors for the wiper motor, ignition, headlights, heater, etc.,?. If it did, are they already attached or do you just splice them on? __________________ Jim 1970 C/10 Fleetside w/Ghost Flames Lowered 4.5" front and 4" rear (Raked) 355/350 Turbo w/shift kit 10" Redneck Performance Verter w/2500 stall Hooker Super Comps part#2808-1 Performer RPM Air-Gap 12 Bolt w/3:73 gears- Eaton Posi Comp Cams XE262 with 1.6 Crane Energizers, Road Demon 625 and Brodix IK 180 heads

11-25-2004, 01:27 PM	#9
Randy70C-10 Account Suspended Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Virginia Beach, Va. U.S.A. Posts: 15,320	All connectors are already attached for everything under the dash, all you have to do is plug everything in. The lights and engine section you have to trim to proper length and terminate with connectors. It's very easy and makes for a cleaner installation because you can route the wiring however you wish since they give you an extra couple of feet to work with.

11-25-2004, 01:28 PM	#10
gonebad2 Merciless Butcher Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: CC Nevada Posts: 1,447	I went with a Painless too.....No problems to report here. __________________ Your Bought And Sold....I Got Your Soul!

11-25-2004, 01:45 PM	#11
Randy70C-10 Account Suspended Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Virginia Beach, Va. U.S.A. Posts: 15,320	Here's some of the under-cash wiring to give you an idea..... Last edited by Randy70C-10; 11-25-2004 at 01:49 PM.

11-25-2004, 03:49 PM	#12
Wootdog Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Virginia Beach, Va, USA Posts: 1,676	Painless I agree with Randy. I did my 67 wiring harness with painless, and yes it is painless. Now for the 68 I will go that way again. Kerry __________________ 1969 Chevelle 1990 IROC Z Convertible 2002 Silverado LT

11-25-2004, 06:31 PM	#13
Vince Putt Hippy Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: kaska, pa Posts: 95	I was The very first customer of Painless Wiring. Some twenty years ago I believe. I was so impressed by what they offered I asked what would it take to be a dealer Dennis and his partner looked at each other and grinned, I thought they were going to HI-Five on the spot. I've been using their products ever since. It keeps getting better and better.

11-26-2004, 12:14 PM	#14
GreyHoundSteve Registered User Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: DFW TX Posts: 769	I bought my painless harness from O'reileys because autozone was out of stock. It looks great and should be a cinch to install.

11-26-2004, 12:30 PM	#15
Harold Shepard Registered User Join Date: May 2004 Location: Canton North Carolina Posts: 466	Depends on what you want now and later, the painless is labelled and comes with connecters but needs some things imo. If you have plenty of time and know your way around these trucks well then go with the painless- especially if the stock look s not your thing. Otherwise go with M&H. They plug right in- no crimps you have to do (less chance for operator/installer screw- up) they have the correct connectors, no hunting or robbing from the old harness, and you will be done and resady to roll in 2 hrs tops for complete truck, painless 8-12 hrs- as there are crimps to make, wires to cut, decissio to tape or sheath and zip ties to install. Was not a hard decission for me... M&H



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12-02-2004, 09:09 PM	#16
benoit454 Chris Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Monaville, WV Posts: 3,737	Where can I find this M and H wiring harness? Is it for 73-87's?

12-02-2004, 09:45 PM	#17
4x4Poet Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: "Under Montana skies." Posts: 1,836	I have no experience with complete, replacement wiring sets/harnesses, but I was at a local customizing shop today and talked with the owner about an engine swap they'd done into a '60s F#$d. They also had put in a complete wiring harness tailored to the engine & vehicle combo. He said he used to use Painless, but once he compared them to Ron Francis stuff, he's used RF ever since. He said RF is admittingly more expensive but worth the extra cost. He liked the overall quality, pre-terminated ends, new-style blade fuse block, and especially how each wire has printing on each wire's sheath every six inches or so saying what each wire goes to. So, if you are routing a wire away from its start or terminus, you can see at a glance what circuit you're working with. Does Painless do the same with their wiring harness wire sheaths? Never heard of M&H. I, too, would like to view their website and know if they are the supplier of "factory original" wiring harnesses found in 67-72 Chevy truck part suppliers' catalogs. __________________ '71 GMC K20 Suburban, '71 GMC K10 Suburban, '72 Chevy C10 CST Suburban, '72 Chevy K20 clunker pickup. Last edited by 4x4Poet; 12-02-2004 at 09:47 PM.

12-02-2004, 10:17 PM	#18
ChevyDude Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 3,071	Just replaced both harnesses up front under the hood (lights and engine) and it could not have been easier. They were M&H and all I did was remove the old two harnesses and plug in the two new ones. THey fit exactly like the originals. I was done in about an hour. __________________ Alex 1971 Lil' Red 350 SBC 700R4

12-03-2004, 12:41 AM	#19
imdarren Registered User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: SW Washington Posts: 1,006	Ok. Does anyone have info on where to get M&H products? A web site maybe? Or is M&H part of the Ron Francis product line? I'm confused because I've never heard of M&H. Thanks! __________________ Washington State 1967 Chevy C10 LWB Rodstoration In Progress. 1972 K20 Cheyenne Super

12-03-2004, 02:51 AM	#20
1972 Majician Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: In the Middle Posts: 329	via google

12-03-2004, 09:33 AM	#21
4x4Poet Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: "Under Montana skies." Posts: 1,836	Thanks, 1972, for helping out us lazy posters! __________________ '71 GMC K20 Suburban, '71 GMC K10 Suburban, '72 Chevy C10 CST Suburban, '72 Chevy K20 clunker pickup.

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