Speakerboxes (pics)

[farside847]

Finally got off my arse and finished my speakerboxes this weekend. So, I'll put
together the info and some pics for the board.

Started off by buying some nice quality speakers. A pair of the Kicker L5 8"
subs and a pair of the Pyle 4" two way speakers. I already had a pair of 4"
kenwood speakers in the dash.

Since I now have a 68 bucket seat frame in my truck I measured up the space
under the seats and made my boxes to fit.


I used 1/2" MDF since the boxes would end up so small. It ented up with just
under .5cuft


When I went to test fit them, I noticed a problem. They fit so well that when
they were in place I could no longer reach the bolts for the seats. Since I
had to remove the bolts to get the box in there, this was a problem. So, out
came the saw and I cut a few inches off the side and rebuilt them.




As you can see this is a sealed box and I used some old calk to fill in the seams. Then I got some cheap fabric at the fabric store to cover the boxes.


Then I wired up the speakers and put them in.



Last I unbolted the seats and slid them in.


Super tight fit! I ended up not using an amp for now, just running them off
the powered outputs from the radio and it fills the cab with more sound
than I can handle. Actually the woofers are too strong. I had to turn them
down a bit so it didnt drown out the music. If I were to do it again I would
probably use different subs. The kickers are real deep and there are other
shallow 8" subs out there that would have made it easier. I wired in 2-way
crossovers into the boxes, and hooked them up to the left and right rear
speaker outs from the radio. Then hooked up the dash speakers to the left
and right front outputs. Now all I need to do is finish tuning the sound
with the radio. It still sounds a bit off. Need to play with the front/ rear
ballance and base/treb adjustments I think.....

[Brad]

Very cool! Nice work.

[matthufham]

that sub has enough air space? and you didn't need to port the box i assume?

[farside847]

Originally Posted by matthufham

that sub has enough air space? and you didn't need to port the box i assume?

barely.

Kicker reccomeded a min of .33 cuft volume for a sealed enclosure. This
setup gave me .31 - pretty darn close.

[bagged74]

that looks good...............but, if you put an amp on the woofers they are going to blow out those 4" speakers from the pressure inside the box. you really need to put a divider of some sort in there.
It looks like you did a good job on building everything, i just thought that you ought to consider putting in the divider before you put an amplifier on them.

[67chevemall]

Originally Posted by bagged74

that looks good...............but, if you put an amp on the woofers they are going to blow out those 4" speakers from the pressure inside the box. you really need to put a divider of some sort in there.
It looks like you did a good job on building everything, i just thought that you ought to consider putting in the divider before you put an amplifier on them.

What he said^^^^^^^^^

Plus you can warp the amp inside your deck running like that...

[farside847]

Originally Posted by bagged74

that looks good...............but, if you put an amp on the woofers they are going to blow out those 4" speakers from the pressure inside the box. you really need to put a divider of some sort in there.
It looks like you did a good job on building everything, i just thought that you ought to consider putting in the divider before you put an amplifier on them.

Hmmm, would the divider need to be air tight? Or just a block behind the 4 inchers?

[shifty]

Originally Posted by farside847

Hmmm, would the divider need to be air tight? Or just a block behind the 4 inchers?

Man, I need to stop making assumptions. I figured you're using sealed-back drivers.

You'll need to isolate (I.E seal off) that small speaker so it does not share the same air cavity behind the subwoofer. If it shares the same air cavity, the air pressure from the subwoofer moving in and out will force the cone on your small speaker to move and destroy it.

[phantom dually]

If that is another mid in the top of the box you will not get the best sound from your speaker.

[AesC10s]

you said you are just running your subs off of your deck right? how many watts are the subs? how many watts is th deck? be careful and dont under power them becuase if you under power the subs you can fry the subs in a heartbeat. trust me ive done it twice. really pisses ya off when ya fry your subs you just got.

[farside847]

Originally Posted by AesC10s

you said you are just running your subs off of your deck right? how many watts are the subs? how many watts is th deck? be careful and dont under power them becuase if you under power the subs you can fry the subs in a heartbeat. trust me ive done it twice. really pisses ya off when ya fry your subs you just got.

Kicker says 50-300 wats. My deck is only 60 wats. Think thats ok? I never even thought of that....

[shifty]

Use an in-line capacitor, aka 'inductor', 'coil', 'PAC/low pass filter', any other number of terms are used to describe it. It discretely mounts inside your box and filters all highs and mids from your subwoofer (you willl likely damage your subwoofer if you keep cranking highs and mids through it).

Example: http://www.speakerboy.org/files/T3_Inductor.jpg

You can buy these at any respectable audio shop nearby for around $15 and it is an exceptional alternative to using a crossover (it is actually what they use in a crossover). Be sure to explain the imedance (ohms) of your subwoofer to the stereo guy.

While you're at it, I would recommend adding bass blockers to your small midrange speakers in the box. Here, these things, you need one per positive wire:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-C2O9TUD...roup.asp?g=761

[farside847]

Originally Posted by shifty

Use an in-line capacitor, aka 'inductor', 'coil', 'PAC/low pass filter', any other number of terms are used to describe it. It discretely mounts inside your box and filters all highs and mids from your subwoofer (you willl likely damage your subwoofer if you keep cranking highs and mids through it).

Example: http://www.speakerboy.org/files/T3_Inductor.jpg

You can buy these at any respectable audio shop nearby for around $15 and it is an exceptional alternative to using a crossover (it is actually what they use in a crossover). Be sure to explain the imedance (ohms) of your subwoofer to the stereo guy.

While you're at it, I would recommend adding bass blockers to your small midrange speakers in the box. Here, these things, you need one per positive wire:

http://www.crutchfield.com/S-C2O9TUD...roup.asp?g=761

I did use cross overs inside the box so the subs are only getting bass.

[shifty]

60w is often 30x2, to boot, you might be splitting that further if using the same channel to power the other speakers in the box also.

Not to mention that 30w from a head unit actually translates to like 5w from a real honest-to-God amplifier. So, no, that's not really sufficient power. I was assuming you might have had a more powerful head unit.

[shifty]

I think you would reap much benefit from tossing a small amp dedicated to the subwoofers in the mix. You can get a nice Audiobahn amp for less than $100. Like this one for $88 which is overkill (400x1 or 200x2 or 2x100):

http://www.hookedontronics.com/show_....jsp?cid=12997

It has built in crossover, so if it would be possible to return the crossovers/coils/whatever that you used, this will do exactly what those are doing

If that's just too much money for you, you could get this one for $69 (1x200 or 2x100 or 2x50):

http://www.hookedontronics.com/show_....jsp?cid=12996

Or you could consider buying one of the $88 amp (for subs) and one of the $69 amps (for mids n highs). You just can't beat that for less than $200 and from a reputable brand like Audiobahn and a store like H-O-T.

If you're on a super budget, I might be able to find something cheaper for you. I'd just hate to see you nuke your subs or something.

If you do choose to get either of these, spend money on the proper wiring. If you are on a budget, this kit is suitable for one amp @ $25:

http://www.hookedontronics.com/show_...s.jsp?cid=1662

Be sure to use the inline fuse.

If you got a few xtra bucks to spend and want a higher quality kit, I prefer not using Monster Cable, something like this Rockford Fosgate kit for $38 is much, much higher quality and better:

http://www.hookedontronics.com/show_....jsp?cid=13976

Again - fuse it within 18" from the battery for safety's sake and be sure to use a rubber gromit at the firewall to prevent your power wire from getting cut and shorting out.

[farside847]

Ok, you convinced me. I have a Pyle PLAD413 2000 Watt 4 Channel just sitting on the shelf I could hook up. Only bummer is it only has RCA inputs. My current radio has RCA outs, but not the radio I plan on having in a few months (looking to have my stock radio converted and they done offer RCA outs). Is it safe to wire normal speaker wire to a RCA jack? My buddy says it is, but......

[shifty]

Originally Posted by farside847

Is it safe to wire normal speaker wire to a RCA jack? My buddy says it is, but......

Nope. You cannot take a high-level output and slap an RCA jack on it to make it a low level out. It just doesn't work that way. If you do this, you're going to be pushing a high power signal into the low-level RCA input on your amp and you'll either blow it or introduce so much noise you'll blow something else.

[shifty]

PS - sorry for the triple post...but you need something like this to run your speaker wires to RCA cables:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...&category=4950

I cannot say if that is a good brand or not. I do not like using these stupid boxes because back in the day they used to make the bass really punchy and muddy.

[farside847]

Just when I thought I was done, it looks like its time to start over. Oh well. I cant make the boxes any bigger, and if I need to seal off another portion for the mids then the box will be too small.

Can you suggest a speaker setup that will work for me? That is small enough to fit (say 4" depth or less?) . Without amp as my new radio head unit will have up to 180 watts continuous RMS into four speakers, about 250 watts peak. And it will not support RCA outs.

Im looking for good all around sound, not a license plate rattler. And, as you
can tell - Im new at this.

Also, anyone want a set of (hardly) used kickers

[shifty]

Um, "too small"? hardly. You might lose .05cu inches.

You gotta understand - the specs the manuf'er gives you are just general guidelines for an all-around good performance for high and low bass notes. When making sealed enclosures, the concept is to put a sealed pocket of air behind the speaker for it to force against. If you design a box with less airspace, you're simply making it harder for the driver to hit super super low bass notes because you're impeding the ability of the cone to travel in and out as much - the figures the company gives you are just the absolute prime airspace figures. If you want to get technical, your box was probably already smaller than suggested specs of an airspace for the speaker because the cone, magnet and cage of a speaker takes up .15 - .75 cu feet depending on the brand and size of speaker you're using.

Less airspace = "tighter" bass notes and better high bass.
More airspace = more cone movement which helps with thumpy low bass notes

So, you don't need to start over from scratch, just expect that your high and middle bass notes will sound killer and the lower bass notes won't be as punchy/thumpy as they could be. I personally doubt you'll notice - after all, you're not trying to make a license plate rattler

As for your claims that your new radio head unit will have 180 continuous power, I gotta call "BS" on that one. No radio on the face of the planet is equipped to produce that kind of "real" wattage. If it was possible to flawlessly push out that kind of wattage from a tiny car stereo, a reputable 200w amp would be small enough to stick in your ashtray. Head units are not equipped to produce that kind of wattage and any person out there who tells you otherwise is full of poo . Likewise, if this feat of pushing 180w was really possible, why are home stereos so freaking big? Why do they generate so much heat? It's because of the massive heatsinks and internals that are required to push the wattage you need.

In the past couple of years, we've taken leaps and bounds in working with true digital amplifiers which lets us cram much more wattage into a much smaller package, but I have yet to see this technology really put out in a head unit. If it was, it surely would cost several hundred dollars.

Dollar for dollar, you will not be able to really push a pair of speakers and subwoofers adequately without using an external amplifier.

If you really are dead set on getting new subwoofers, your best bet is to go to www.google.com and search for "low profile subwoofer" and start comparison shopping amongst your choises.

Don't give up hope. You've done a great job already. I see a couple of people in this thread trying to give you genuine help so you don't fry something and you really get the most out of your stereo with the least amount of money. Nobody ever does anything 100% the first time when it comes to computers or electronics...stereo installs are no different. Take what you can from this experience and use it next time around I can point you to some install threads and stuff for amps with more info if you want. They're all in this forum.

[farside847]

Thanks for the wealth of info.

So, if I keep my existing boxes I should seal the woofer area from the mid area and use a good amp. That Audiobahn amp looks like it has speaker level inputs? That would solve my lack of RCAs problem without having to use a questionable adapter.

I went onto Audiobahn's website but I can not tell if it has two speaker level inputs (left and right) or just one. Do you know? An amp with two speaker level imputs would be perfect (I think)

thanks!

[shifty]

Originally Posted by farside847

I went onto Audiobahn's website but I can not tell if it has two speaker level inputs (left and right) or just one. Do you know? An amp with two speaker level imputs would be perfect (I think)

thanks!

Yes. It says this quite clearlly in the "specs" at the H-O-T sebsite. See the specs:

Tri-way capable with optional crossover
MOSFET power supply
Chrome-plated Finish
1 or 2 channel output
Variable crossovers
Subsonic filter
Bass boost
Preamp outputs
Soft-Start Circuitry
Speaker-Level Inputs
Cooling Fan

This would solve your RCA problems in fact. Just to get more bang for your buck, I would get the $80 one and turn the gain/levels way down to a suitable level for you. Seal your current box and like chevmall says, be sure that you use very good grounds, scrape the paint off of the grounding source really well and try to ground to something that's thick metal and attaches to the frame using a good thick gauge of wire. Bad grounds are the #1 cause of electrical noise.

That amp also has built in crossovers. I suggest buying that amp to power your subs, buy the $38 amplifier wiring kit above (don't get the cheap $24 one) wire it up nicely and neatly, use the head unit to power your small speakers (put bass blockers on the little guys), use the amp to power your subs, remove any treble/mid filters from the subwoofer and use the crossover built into the amp instead. This will leave you with a kickass little system for you to rock out with.

This is just my 2¢

[bagged74]

....yeah, what he said.

[67chevemall]

I would take the 4" out seal the box. Make new small boxes for them.
Get a amp for the sub, run the highs off a new poineer deck with a built
in crossover for your sub, and 40x4 for your highs.

This way you only have one amp which is good for your electical,
Deck and crossover are one unit, which make things easy, and reliable.
The sub box is seperate and sealed
You only need two 4" and tweeters but four 4" will work too.
Make sure your wiring is good with a nice fuse at the batt.
Grounds are important as anything.

$0.02

[farside847]

Thanks for all your help guys. This was my first try at adding speakers. And Im still learning! Something new every day until you die, right? I unhooked everything until I have some some to reconfigure the set up.