Serpentine setups..info please

[pcmcobra]

Been looking at serp setups on egay for awhile, only the gm ones.
The ones I have been looking at have like off early-mid 90's v8 trucks. Will one off a say 85-92 tpi car work without any problems? Reason I ask, a guy has one locally for like $60...a/c is shot, but no biggie, everything else works, needs a little cleanup, for that price seems decent.
Any feedback and thoughts are appreciated.

[BaddBusa2005]

Originally Posted by pcmcobra

Been looking at serp setups on egay for awhile, only the gm ones.
The ones I have been looking at have like off early-mid 90's v8 trucks. Will one off a say 85-92 tpi car work without any problems? Reason I ask, a guy has one locally for like $60...a/c is shot, but no biggie, everything else works, needs a little cleanup, for that price seems decent.
Any feedback and thoughts are appreciated.

I would buy it, you can also use the ones off of the 4.3 s series trucks and blazers. They are a little tighted to the engine and look pretty good, but they brackets are steel, rather than aluminum.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by BaddBusa2005

I would buy it, you can also use the ones off of the 4.3 s series trucks and blazers. They are a little tighted to the engine and look pretty good, but they brackets are steel, rather than aluminum.

Some are steel, some aluminum.

I bought a set off of a S-10 Blazer 4.3 & they were alum w/the smog pump bracket (I pulled them off myself @ the wrecking yard).

[jdmaffeo]

I bought my entire setup from a guy parting out a 1992 Firebird. Everything bolted right up except for the passenger side head I had to drill and tap one hole. I paid $200 for everything including the following:

All Studs, bolts, brackets, and pulleys
A/C Compressor, lines and condensor
Alternator
Waterpump
Powersteering pump and lines

Here is how it turned out....

[bowtiecb]

did you cut the alt wire or did you have it converted to a 1 wire

[Pyrotechnic]

That looks awesome. Is the Firebird serpentine setup the same as a truck setup?

I got some questions about the A/C setup.

What did you do about the A/C condenser? With the compressor on the drivers side on my 78, the lines to the condenser were on the drivers side as well. What did you do to correct this ?

I know these setups come on the 88-91 Blazer/Suburban/CrewCab. Did you just use those hoses ?

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by Pyrotechnic

That looks awesome. Is the Firebird serpentine setup the same as a truck setup?

I got some questions about the A/C setup.

What did you do about the A/C condenser? With the compressor on the drivers side on my 78, the lines to the condenser were on the drivers side as well. What did you do to correct this ?

I know these setups come on the 88-91 Blazer/Suburban/CrewCab. Did you just use those hoses ?

This is how the A/C was hooked up when I had Zoomad’s engine with the '92 – ’95 aluminum brackets. The local Napa store custom made my A/C hoses.

The second picture is how my 4fidy4 is A/C plumbed.

[smills78gmc]

Bowtiecb-- I have the same setup, DONT cut into the alt harness, GM has a direct adapter for old style to new style alt conversions. They told me It has a built in resistor so it wont burn your alt up. I picked it up for less than $30 dollars. It just plugs into your old plug then into the new alternator. I got my serpentine setup off 1990 camaro TPI engine. The water pump and PS pump have to be reverse direction.(NOT REVERSE FLOW). When i started my truck for the first time I had the right WP but not the right PS pump. PS fluid was coming out the top of the pump.

[Zoomad75]

I've got the same serpentine setup on my K5. I don't have A/C but have a compressor in place to keep the system up (I need the a/c delete pulley). DirtyLarry had this installed this setup when the engine was in his K10. He was using the a/c and since the compressor location swapped sides from the stock setup, he got a couple of hoses that fit the compressor from the junkyard, cut the ends off for the compressor and took them in with his old lines to make new ones. They made a hybrid with the old fittings he needed for the evap and condensor, but with the new correct fittings for the R4 compressor. It was the perfect time to switch to R134a too.

He had to do the lines again when he put the big block in with the L29 serpentine setup as the compressor and alt swapped sides again.

Here's a tip when using the style of serpentine setup I have. Get the thermostat housing for a 88-95 truck and the upper hose from the same. This will change the position of the outlet on the thermostat housing to rise up and then forward, clearing the serpentine belt. Only difficulty is that the inlet on the radiator is slightly bigger that what the hose was designed for on the later trucks. Just a little dab of vasoline is all you need to slide the hose on the radiator.

[Zoomad75]

I can vouch for the a/c output in DirtyLarrys truck. You can hang meat in there. Thats with 134a too. I do remember that he did install a hot water shut off valve (manual ball valve) on one of the heater core lines as the stock a/c setup still has the hot water ciruclating even with the a/c on.

Larry and I were talking about the hole he had to drill just a little bit ago. It was on the passenger side head. Best thing to do is to bolt the pass side bracket to the engine and mark the spot on the head where the bracket hole lines up to. Then remove the bracket and carefully drill the hole making sure to be level with the head top to bottom and side to side.

You only need to drill the hole if you have older heads. The later heads have all the holes in the right spots for the serp brackets. Your iron eagle heads should have all the holes too.

[DirtyLarry]

Personally, I think the Delphi on R134A runs pretty close to the original A6 on R12 as far as duct temperatures go but it has been so long since I have ridden in a vehicle with R12 so I can’t really say for sure. Keep in mind, the Delphi was engineered to run R134A so it is pretty efficient. Definitely cooler than the supposed R134A prepped R4 compressor.

Actually hoses aren’t that expensive to have made. Mine cost $80 but I have also known the guy that owns the local Napa store since I was a little kid. I would suspect most hose fabricators would charge around $150 or so to build hoses.

You know, 10 years have gone by now since I bolted those brackets onto my old 350 and I can’t exactly remember which side needed to be delt with. I want to say it was the driver’s side head toward the top intake side of the head that needed to be drilled and tapped but Rob said it was the pass side. Heck, I dunno….but I bet you will figure it out real quick once you get brackets. I remember being pretty worried about drilling into a water jacket and fangling the head up. Hopefully, your aluminum heads have the accessory hole already in them or that will sure make things exciting for you, as would be no other way to fasten the bracket to the head on that corner.

Here is the pic of the F and B body car brackets.

[piecesparts]

One thing most individuals miss on a serpentine setup is that there are two different positions for the accessories. A truck setup and TBI F Body cars have the accessories mounted close together at the top of the motor (there is no TPI involved) where the ones on a Camaro and Firebird with TPI has the alternator and the A/C set further apart. The Camaro brackets are usually matched to a long water pump and that is what trucks are equipped with. I came across this when I started my endeavor to put a TPI corvette motor in my 91 silverado. The Corvette brackets are a really boogered mess compared to the brackets on the F Body cars. The bolts for mounting the A/c and the Alternator are different than the truck bolts and (of course) GM doesn't sell them anymore. I had to get creative or go junk yarding. I made my own out of Grade 8 Redi-bolt and lock nuts. I also bobbed off the extra cud on the brackets where the air pump would mount and got rid of the stuff that just stuck out in the way.

If you strip a GM F Body, get it all---even the funny bolts laying on the ground around the car, just in case.

[Mickey_D]

Originally Posted by piecesparts

If you strip a GM F Body, get it all---even the funny bolts laying on the ground around the car, just in case.

Heh, that goes for any vehicle. I just got the surprise of my life to day when I went to the stealership to get replacement transmission bolts (the ones that go into the engine).

They are just shy of $5.00 EACH!!!

[piecesparts]

Believe me, i know that the TBI and the TPI is different for F bodies to truck bodies. My 91 Chevy truck has a set of TBI brackets and a long water pump. The Camaro TPI brakets i purchased are there to move the accessories out for the install of the Tuned Port intake and it's Throttle body. The items that are the same are the water pump items, such as long or short. That is why the F bodies are aligned to a truck easier. I have just about all of that laying on my shop floor, not to mention the LS-1 parts and the LT-1 items in the Wife's car.

[phishfud]

I am in the middle of this conversion, and got my whole setup off a 90 Camaro TPI car. Pretty straightforward, but I have run across one thing. Seems my stock clutch fan doesn't have the same bolt pattern as the new waterpump. I either have to convert to electric fans, or elongate the holes on my clutch fan so it can be bolted on. I plan on doing a TPI swap pretty soon, and just wanted to run my stock fan setup for now. Anyone else have this issue?

I also ordered the adapter for the alternator, but I am going to have to extend one wire on the stock alt plug. It is the one that goes to the starter. I am trying to run a clean install with the alt wires running along the driver's head, and the starter wires dropping down the back of the motor.

[smills78gmc]

Phishfud-- I had the same problem, just get a fan clutch off of an S10, Also you may have to do some trimming on your fan shroud. I trimmed mine up by the alternator about 2 inches back. It fits good now.

[pcmcobra]

Question...
I bought the tpi setup, only no smog pump delete pulley.
Instead of buying the pulley...what belt can I use? Any one have a part # for the slightly shorter belt?
thx

[piecesparts]

Originally Posted by pcmcobra

Question...
I bought the tpi setup, only no smog pump delete pulley.
Instead of buying the pulley...what belt can I use? Any one have a part # for the slightly shorter belt?
thx

When I purchased my brackets, I got a belt from S&P for the setup W/O the air pump and idler pulley. I have yet to try it, but the number is GOODYEAR 4060960 6PK2440.

[sneezys72]

What needs to be done to the rest of the ac setup. I got the serpentine brackets with the new Delphi compressor and will be putting it in soon. I will also be adding the ac as my truck doesn't have it yet. I have a stock ac setup minus the compressor and brackets. Can I still use this, or do I need the condensor, dryer, etc out of the new model? Also how deep do you need to drill into the head (not mine, the one on my truck)? I just want to be sure of these answers before I start because it is my daily driver.

[jdmaffeo]

Originally Posted by pcmcobra

Question...
I bought the tpi setup, only no smog pump delete pulley.
Instead of buying the pulley...what belt can I use? Any one have a part # for the slightly shorter belt?
thx

Here is the Gates belt and part number that you are looking for. I am not running the smog pump. I hope this helps.

[pcmcobra]

good questions sneezy,
I was going to ask about the depth/size of hole in the head....Mine is on the back burner for a few weeks at least.

[Zoomad75]

Originally Posted by pcmcobra

good questions sneezy,
I was going to ask about the depth/size of hole in the head....Mine is on the back burner for a few weeks at least.

Here's the best way to gauge the depth. Go to an existing hole and run a bolt in until it just bottoms out. Mark the bolt where it's flush with the head. Remove the bolt and measure from the end to the mark you made. to be safe I'd take a 1/16th of an inch off as a saftey margin, not to go too deep. Transfer that measurement to your drill bit with a piece of tape and drill to the tape.

[piecesparts]

We drilled one of my heads for the brackets and went in about 7/16 of an inch.

[pcmcobra]

zoomad,
good answer, wished I would have thought of it...
thx
John

[Zoomad75]

No problem, just be carful not to drill too deep! Plus you got to keep the drill perpendicular to the head in two directions to make sure the hole is straight. I know DirtyLarry said he was pretty spooked about taking a drill to a cylinder head when he did it. take your time, use a sharp bit and plenty of cutting oil. Clean the hole out often and let the bit do the work. This isn't like drilling into a 2x4. Drilling cast iron takes time. Oh and be sure to center punch the head first before you start drilling. Otherwise your bit is going to walk all over the front of the head and you wont be able to start the hole in the right spot.