Aftermakrket EFI or LS Swap???

[Sean C]

Hey guys. So I've been reading up on the LS swaps and there's a ton of information out there. I like the 350 I have in my truck, but since it's a daily driver for me, I need more reliability in the cold weather. I also want to swap in a manual transmission (5 or 6 speed) and so the questions arises: Which is more affordable, aftermarket EFI and new tranny OR LS/T56 swap??

My dilemma is that from what I have found the initial cost for both options is about the same, but I am not capable of freshening up the LS motor/ T56 myself, as well as moving the shifter forward to accommodate my bench seat. I believe that I can do the EFI/new tranny swap with the help of a very knowledgable neighbor, but if it would be feasible, an LS swap would just be gnarly!!

Any idea on how much it would run to have a shop do the swap for me? Any help would be much appreciated!

P.S. A 5.3L swap would also be quite alright, but I don't know all that needs to be done to a salvaged motor to make it reliable.

Sean

[NEWFISHER]

I have a new never opened Holley Projection setup that I was going to install o the 318 in the Dart, then the 360 I built for the Dart. I then realized that the original 318 ran great so I slated it for 50 burband the inline 250 motor, but it runs great as a daily (living in the wet and cold Northwest) so I then thought I was going to put it on the 65. World heads, cam, edlebrock 1406 etc and realize it runs great. With the electric choke set up on a properly tuned carb, cold mornings are not an issue. Is 3 mpg worth it? The burb gets 19 mpg with the 700r4 and the 65 gets around 12 to 14 with a 700r4. Both have good power and with the overdriven transmissions ,they get good mpg's.

My point is, maybe with your mechanical skills, learning to tune what you have and then instll an overdriven trans will be less costly for you to do everything at once and you will end up learning about what you already like and get to do a trans swap in a weekend in the garage.

Ls motors and injection is cool and has its place in life. I have swapped in 3 injected engines into carb toys and been happy. I have ithis injection system ready to install on something, but have been hapy learning to work on what I have and with proper gearing can get the best of all worlds.

[joedoh]

Just as a counterpoint, I've fooled with my last carburetor. if a carb is a bugle, efi is a trumpet. a carb is tuned for one perfect condition, and less than perfect everywhere else, like a parametric. EFI looks at everything, the air coming in, the gases going out, the rpm, the load, the and adjusts hundreds of times a second.

Carbs are nirvana for some guys, tinkering and tracking changes in weather. every carb I ever had wasnt worth spit in the winter till it warmed up, and you get 0mpg just sitting there. The weather really swings here and the thing I appreciate most about EFI is driving away after only a couple minutes even in the teens. I'd put EFI on my toilet if I could find a way.

[wutnxt]

I vote LS swap....

The LS setups are made to take and put out so much more power and great fuel mileage . They run really well and are easy to setup. The take tons of abuise and there are guy's running 1000 hp on stock bottom ends.The are also not a huge amount of money anymore and even a 5.3 will fry your tires off. Keeping that in mind i just ordered a inglese injection set up running the fast computers for my buddies truck...because he likes the way they look and it's built complete for his engine.

[Gobuffalo]

LS swap.
Find a 2000 to 2007 GM Truck, 2 wheel drive, 3/4 or 1 ton. Look for a U in the 8th digit in the VIN. The most common will be auto trans. The U is a 6.0L LS, RPO LQ4. The trans should be a 4L80E. The cheapest way I have found is buy a wrecked truck from the auction. This way you get all the little things you need to swap. While your at it swap in the hydra boost brakes, you will love it. If the electronics look too hard, just send the computer and harness in to one of the many aftermarket shops (Howell, 150 Tunes, etc) and have it cut down and reprogrammed for your app. Motor mounts and cross members are available in the aftermarket.

[BR3W CITY]

We do have a whole forum for this

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/f...play.php?f=206

[tincan1966]

I went the very simple route:
I have a TBI efi on my daily driver '65 and couldn't be happier. I get a very consistent 17-19 mpg. extremely reliable and not a huge hit to the pocket book.

[Sean C]

Hey guys sorry for the late response here, but thanks so much for all the input!! I hate to disappoint, but I'm going with the EFI system. Haven't settled on which one yet, but I'm thinking Edelbrock E-Street would be best for me.

It comes down to a time issue for me. I just don't have the time to parts search/auction hunt for what I'd need to do the swap and I need my truck on track to Nebraska daily driver status. Hopefully, I'll have more time in the future for the swap.

I am, however, going to do a manual swap still. Any recommendations on a tranny besides the T56?? I'm curious if anyone knows which one will swap in with the least amount of modification, so for example one that works with our bench seats?

Oh and brakes are a big issue for me. Haven't heard of the Hydra Boost Brakes, but sounds like something I should look into. (my truck doesn't stop for crap and she already has front discs)

Thanks again guys! I'm diggin' this community already!

Sean

[AcampoDave]

If your truck doesn't stop for crap with disc, be they manual or power, you got a problem worthy of putting at the top of your to-do list. I have maual disc and they work great. As far as e.f.i goes...I like the idea of a simple throttle body system on an old school small block. You get some modern conveniences and retain a more traditional look.

[wutnxt]

Oh and brakes are a big issue for me. Haven't heard of the Hydra Boost Brakes, but sounds like something I should look into. (my truck doesn't stop for crap and she already has front discs)

================================================
Well i have a bunch of front disc barke truck conversions and they all stop really well and like you just heard in the prior post they all stop great with or with out boosters. If your truck isn't stopping right I would be all over that first. I am wondering if you have the correct master cylinder bore size....? If it was me the first thing I would do is check to see if your rear brakes are set up right...then maybe onto the master cylinder.There are some great threads on that stuff if you look around on here

[Sean C]

Apologies gents, I was only exaggerating! I should clarify that I believe the truck could stop MUCH better than she does even though she stops well enough.

Thanks for the input!

[66LSx]

Just sayin....

[Sean C]

Originally Posted by 66LSx

Just sayin....

Hahaha I saw your build thread a few days ago which prodded me to ask this question in the first place!! I just don't have time/tools/know how to do the work and I'm scared to know what a shop would charge.

Looks like you're on a roll though!

[66LSx]

Originally Posted by Sean C

Hahaha I saw your build thread a few days ago which prodded me to ask this question in the first place!! I just don't have time/tools/know how to do the work and I'm scared to know what a shop would charge.

Looks like you're on a roll though!

it might be sitting inside the truck by the end of the weekend....


know how wise..... if you can plug in connectors... just buy a stand alone harness.... send out your junkyard ECM to get reprogrammed without the theft stuff... and viola... (well.. that and fuel tank and pump etc etc etc)

Its alot of money... most junkyard an engine/trans w/ 100k miles on the clock and spend somewhere between 3-6k doing it. [yes.. some less... some more... I'll be coming in just around $5000]

That being said... 100k mileage motor from a 2005 Silverado has alot more reliable transportation to give then most carbed crate motors. (in terms of varying conditional useage...[at night.. in the day.. hot... cold, summer, winter, etc]

[Sean C]

Originally Posted by 66LSx

it might be sitting inside the truck by the end of the weekend....


know how wise..... if you can plug in connectors... just buy a stand alone harness.... send out your junkyard ECM to get reprogrammed without the theft stuff... and viola... (well.. that and fuel tank and pump etc etc etc)

Its alot of money... most junkyard an engine/trans w/ 100k miles on the clock and spend somewhere between 3-6k doing it. [yes.. some less... some more... I'll be coming in just around $5000]

That being said... 100k mileage motor from a 2005 Silverado has alot more reliable transportation to give then most carbed crate motors. (in terms of varying conditional useage...[at night.. in the day.. hot... cold, summer, winter, etc]

It really is tempting, but I have to restrain myself. Also, having never done any of this before it's a bit intimidating to try to rip out the motor(especially a perfectly good one) and hope I don't mess something up. I have a buddy who tried (has been trying...) to get a swap done on his 87 camaro and the thing has been out of commission for 2 years and he even took it to a shop. Not to mention $20k in the hole. Yeah, he probably got screwed (is getting screwed...) but I'd hate to be in his shoes.

So, for now when time is sparse and money tight, I'll go the safe route. I'll be watching your build though!

Sean

[Clyde65]

Originally Posted by Sean C

Hey guys. So I've been reading up on the LS swaps and there's a ton of information out there. I like the 350 I have in my truck, but since it's a daily driver for me, I need more reliability in the cold weather. I also want to swap in a manual transmission (5 or 6 speed) and so the questions arises: Which is more affordable, aftermarket EFI and new tranny OR LS/T56 swap??

My dilemma is that from what I have found the initial cost for both options is about the same, but I am not capable of freshening up the LS motor/ T56 myself, as well as moving the shifter forward to accommodate my bench seat. I believe that I can do the EFI/new tranny swap with the help of a very knowledgable neighbor, but if it would be feasible, an LS swap would just be gnarly!!

Any idea on how much it would run to have a shop do the swap for me? Any help would be much appreciated!

P.S. A 5.3L swap would also be quite alright, but I don't know all that needs to be done to a salvaged motor to make it reliable.

Sean

Sean,

do not get all freaked out about an LS swap. There are so many options out there that make this so easy.

I did my swap all by myself ( I am a computer tech) in my carport, mostly in the evening and on some weekends. it took me 9 months to complete.

If you can use a socket and wrench, you got this.

I cleaned up everything, new wiring harness etc, then put the motor/trans in. I sent my harness off along with the PCM for standalone setup. I plumbed the fuel ( external pump). I used aftermarket guages. the thing that took te most time was the wiring harness redo.

it really isnt that difficult for a stock LSx to go into our trucks really.

Good luck!

[Sean C]

Originally Posted by Clyde65

Sean,

do not get all freaked out about an LS swap. There are so many options out there that make this so easy.

I did my swap all by myself ( I am a computer tech) in my carport, mostly in the evening and on some weekends. it took me 9 months to complete.

If you can use a socket and wrench, you got this.

I cleaned up everything, new wiring harness etc, then put the motor/trans in. I sent my harness off along with the PCM for standalone setup. I plumbed the fuel ( external pump). I used aftermarket guages. the thing that took te most time was the wiring harness redo.

it really isnt that difficult for a stock LSx to go into our trucks really.

Good luck!

Thanks for the encouraging words Clyde! I think I'd really like the LS swap, but I think that will just come later in life. For now the 350, being nearly brand new, is more than enough for me and I think EFI will make it just right. I'd love to get my hands dirty and give the swap a go, but like I said I'm going to hold off.


Thanks everyone for the input! I really appreciate it. I'll have to start a build thread for my truck and let everyone know what I'm doing! For whoever cares anyway haha.


Sean

[jmack91z28]

Someone mentioned a TBI swap. That's a really good idea. It's a tried and true system, it's kinda the best of both worlds, a smart carb in a sense. The guys over at fullsizechevy are very good with TBI. You can get a running 350 tbi and 700r4 for dirt cheap. Roller cam and 1 piece rear from the factory. I know of a guy that I've used multiple times that rebuilds the throttle body, flow matched injectors and all new sensors for fairly cheap.. Adjustable fuel pressure regulator, the whole deal. Just a thought.

Newfisher brought up some very good points with staying with a well tuned carb, they really aren't that difficult to adjust, what, 2-3 times a year. I'm just saying, you can buy a lot, A LOT, of fuel for the cost of doing an EFI swap if you're doing solely on the basis of mpg's.

Of course an LS1/T56 setup can be had for very cheap these days. They are a bulletproof combo. So I guess it's down to what you're comfortable with doing and spending money on.

[1Bad62Pro/Street]

Holley Terminator™ EFI

http://www.holley.com/Terminator%20EFI/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AznPwnMAuPY

[Clyde65]

We care dude, and we support whatever you do! I think the 350 is a fantastic idea! You rock!

[66LSx]

Originally Posted by Clyde65

We care dude, and we support whatever you do! I think the 350 is a fantastic idea! You rock!

Ditto... they belong on the road.........

Better than an empty wallet and a guilty feeling...with a truck disabled in the garage... (although most are indeed capable).

Let us know when you have questions whatever your direction.... that IS WHY BOARDS LIKE THIS EXIST....

The 350 is a great motor.... cheap to maintain..... and does its job.... period.

[jmack91z28]

Originally Posted by 66LSx

Ditto... they belong on the road.........

Better than an empty wallet and a guilty feeling...with a truck disabled in the garage... (although most are indeed capable).

Let us know when you have questions whatever your direction.... that IS WHY BOARDS LIKE THIS EXIST....

The 350 is a great motor.... cheap to maintain..... and does its job.... period.

Great comment.

Yeah Sean, get you a little build thread going, they're always fun to watch. It's a good way to get advice along the way too.

[bj383ss]

Looking forward to your build thread Sean. I am in the exact same place. I have a good 350 and 700r4. I would really like to have fuel injection or an lsx. I have the LS1 in my Camaro and I just love that motor. I have never cracked a bolt on it and it has 115,000 miles on it. I also have the TBI on a 305 in my 95' pickup. It has a 165,000 miles and I have only had to do the normal tune up and just recently replace the egr valve.

Bret

[theastronaut]

I must be really messed up to do a carb'd LS swap...

[NEWFISHER]

Originally Posted by theastronaut

I must be really messed up to do a carb'd LS swap...

or spend $2400 for the Edlebrock system on a 350 when you could do 1 1/2 injected LS swaps for that

I think my new in box Holley projection was $1000 a couple years ago and I thought I was crazy to buy another one after using it on a rock cawler/street 4x rig. Still haven't unwrapped it