drove 20 miles to work now won't turn over

[BB72CHEVKT]

I drove my daily driver burb into work this morning like every other morning and went back out 30 minutes later and get nothing when you turn the key but the electric fans. It has an aftermarket painless harness, 260 hp crate with
14k miles, summit HEI with 14k miles. There have been a couple of occasions where the transmission was not fully engaged in park and the same thing would occur. I would then just make sure it was fully in park and it would immediately start. The truck ran fine on the way to work. I checked the main fuse on the firewall and it seems fine.

[D.PASSMORE]

Neutral saftey switch, mounted on column. Make sure it is in the right postion to start. Also, ensure you have 12 VDC on the electrical system.

[BB72CHEVKT]

I don't have anything with me to check the volts. The battery seems to have a charge. I am going to try to jump it to rule out a dead battery.

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by BB72CHEVKT

I don't have anything with me to check the volts. The battery seems to have a charge. I am going to try to jump it to rule out a dead battery.

Hook the 2 purple wires on the neutral switch together to rule that out.

[GASoline71]

Could be heat soak on the solenoid on the starter as well. The General decided to put the solenoid right in a spot next to the exhaust. Some have heat soak issues and some don't. I personally have never experienced it, but have seen others that have first hand. It usually happens after headers are installed, but I have seen it happen with just plain ol' stock manifolds too. Since you live in Texas... it can get crazy hot there. So under hood temps can get pretty darn warm.

Remedy is a heat shield on the solenoid.

Gary

[BB72CHEVKT]

In between calls I went out and tried it again and it fired right up. Hmmmmmmmmmm........

[GASoline71]

Solenoid heat soak. Or the module in the HEI is doing the same thing... heat soak.

When it cools down, will fire right up.

Gary

[gipper]

What he said^ Mine did that exact same thing! I dropped starter and checked out solenoid and it was bad.

[Jonlopes]

Originally Posted by GASoline71

Solenoid heat soak. Or the module in the HEI is doing the same thing... heat soak.

When it cools down, will fire right up.

Gary

Do you have Headers? If so you may think about adding a starter heat shield. It is a little silver blanket that wraps around the starter motor. I do not like "Header heat wrap" since it tends to hold water against the headers and causes rust.

[BB72CHEVKT]

I am sure time will tell. This is the same starter that was on it when I got it and I have put 32k miles on the starter since I have had the burb. It is only 85* here now so we will get much hotter later today and in the weeks and months to come.

[GASoline71]

You can replace just the solenoid and not the whole starter. Solenoid should be about $25 bucks.

Gary

[Ol Blue K20]

I'm voting on solenoid heat soak. I would change the solenoid sooner than later.

[MARKDTN]

If I pulled it, I would change to a newer style starter. With an HEI you have no wiring issues. They last SO much longer. Use '92 5.7 Corvette as a reference for gear reduction style. Even the permanent magnet starters last a lot longer-use '95 2wd 5.7 Suburban as reference.

[GASoline71]

I do have headers. I have installed headers on every rig I've ever owned. I have never wrapped headers and I have also never had the dreaded heat soak problem. Also the heat shield I am referring to isn't the header wrap... it's either a wrap or a metal shield around the starter and solenoid.

Gary

[Jurassic-1]

If you run headers and also the original style starter you may want to upgrade the starter to the later model version. They are much smaller and much more powerful. I got a factory return starter for my 1970 and not only is it easier to install being smaller and lighter but it starts so much faster being a high torque.

[Sklptrljay]

You can also just add a $5 relay that runs battery power straight to the solenoid. That fixed my heat soak problem.

[davepl]

It's not actually heat soak, though everyone calls it that. I mean it is, but it's not what causes the problem, it just exacerbates it.

The problem is most likely a bad connection through the heavy purple solenoid wire. Usually this happens after someone cuts the wire for an ammeter or some other reason and makes a poor quality pigtail splice or something.

You could verify with a volt meter at the starter's end of the wire while trying to crank it. Has to be under that load to tell you anything though.

I've seen people (myself once) throw parts at this issue for years before they find the root cause.

[hdff]

I am having the same issues with starting when hot

Originally Posted by gipper

What he said^ Mine did that exact same thing! I dropped starter and checked out solenoid and it was bad.

how do I check a solenoid?

Originally Posted by MARKDTN

If I pulled it, I would change to a newer style starter. With an HEI you have no wiring issues. They last SO much longer. Use '92 5.7 Corvette as a reference for gear reduction style. Even the permanent magnet starters last a lot longer-use '95 2wd 5.7 Suburban as reference.

do you have a reference/suggestion for a better starter for a big block?

Originally Posted by davepl

It's not actually heat soak, though everyone calls it that. I mean it is, but it's not what causes the problem, it just exacerbates it.

The problem is most likely a bad connection through the heavy purple solenoid wire. Usually this happens after someone cuts the wire for an ammeter or some other reason and makes a poor quality pigtail splice or something.

You could verify with a volt meter at the starter's end of the wire while trying to crank it. Has to be under that load to tell you anything though.

I've seen people (myself once) throw parts at this issue for years before they find the root cause.

so not to sound stupid, i'm still on a learning curve, the other end of the purple wire at the nss goes to the starter?

I just got my truck up on stands so when I get some time it will be up and ready to look at.
I am talking about a 402BB with headers that is not wanting to start when it gets hot. also I have something draining my battery could the solenoid have an issue and be the culprit? and by changing this will be lucky and kill 2 birds with one stone? and suggestion will be appreciated..

keith

[davepl]

so not to sound stupid, i'm still on a learning curve, the other end of the purple wire at the nss goes to the starter?

I just got my truck up on stands so when I get some time it will be up and ready to look at.
I am talking about a 402BB with headers that is not wanting to start when it gets hot. also I have something draining my battery could the solenoid have an issue and be the culprit? and by changing it is will be lucky and kill 2 birds with one stone? and suggestion will be appreciated..

keith

Not to worry, there are no stupid questions except the ones already available via search :-)

My brother had a similar issue (ammeter again) and they replaced a ton of parts on his car - NSS, starter, ignition switch, everything.

Can't hurt, for the price, to stick a new solenoid on it. But I'm still thinking its the current available at the solenoid. Hotter it gets, the more current it will take, and if that wire's marginal, pretty soon it won't start when hot.

If you think you can do it safely, use a screwdriver to short the big battery wire on the solenoid to the solenoid engage wire (usually purple, but I can't recall from memory). They're about half an inch apart. If that kicks it in even when hot, I've solved your problem. You don't even need the key on to see if it cranks like that. Just be careful and don't do any welding. If in any doubt, consult a qualified mechanic.

You could band-aid this in a dozen ways - gear reduction starter, header wrap, whatever. But best to fix the actual problem. I've urinated on the starter once when I was stranded like this and didn't know why (other than it would start when it cooled down).

[hdff]

Originally Posted by davepl

Not to worry, there are no stupid questions except the ones already available via search :-)

My brother had a similar issue (ammeter again) and they replaced a ton of parts on his car - NSS, starter, ignition switch, everything.

Can't hurt, for the price, to stick a new solenoid on it. But I'm still thinking its the current available at the solenoid. Hotter it gets, the more current it will take, and if that wire's marginal, pretty soon it won't start when hot.

If you think you can do it safely, use a screwdriver to short the big battery wire on the solenoid to the solenoid engage wire (usually purple, but I can't recall from memory). They're about half an inch apart. If that kicks it in even when hot, I've solved your problem. ).

What problem is solved?


If the purple wire is unmolested from the nss to the starter should it be good and not a problem

[davepl]

Originally Posted by hdff

What problem is solved?


If the purple wire is unmolested from the nss to the starter should it be good and not a problem

OK. Good luck.

[Sklptrljay]

Originally Posted by hdff

What problem is solved?


If the purple wire is unmolested from the nss to the starter should it be good and not a problem

If it turns over even when hot by bypassing the ignition then you know the problem is in the ignition itself and not the solenoid.

Remember that electrical parts wear out and the fact that it's getting hot can make a small problem bigger.

If I were you I would try the relay idea after you test and verify that the solenoid is good. It's cheap and works well.

[MARKDTN]

Originally Posted by hdff

...do you have a reference/suggestion for a better starter for a big block?...

Same ones fit either SB or BB.

[davepl]

Originally Posted by MARKDTN

Same ones fit either SB or BB.

Fit, yes. Same, no. Don't put a small block starter on a big block (or at least not one with any compression or timing) as they're weaker.

[hdff]

Had an opportunity to drop the starter today, I think I might have found part of my problem. Pic is in reply #28 below


What is the wire harness that goes from the firewall block to the starter called if I wanted to replace it. ThE purple wire is the only one that is not cut but it is nicked near the connection at the firewall, the other 3 wires are just cut and laying in a wire loom, I have no idea where they are suppose to go, there is a pink a green and a tan.