Engine and transmission

[Bonzai]

Long time dreamer first time owner... Needing some advise as I am learning as I go. I just bought a 72 C10 heavy half and wanting to use it as my daily driver I'm over spending 40k for new trucks. I'm also going to buy a mid level 5th wheel and do some traveling
Soooooo being someone who is mechanicly incline enough to get me in trouble I'm looking for some wisdom to tell my better half on why this is the best idea I've ever had lmao.. And besides 40k more like 60k for a truck with all the bells and whistles to pull a camper.. I know pushing it with this truck and should own a 1 ton but damn I love this truck and thinking may pull it down to the frame.

I have a 350 that is running rough at low Rpm has a knock or tap rod or lifter? Seals leak nothing extreme couple drops on the ground. Oil level not dropping. Engine seems loud bearings?? Manifold?? Would not think its the original motor because of what appears to be a vette fuel injection looks like block been painted orange flaking to reveal more orange underneath it. Automatic 3 speed transmission which is wet also and spinning oil off u joint has spilt axel carrier bearing shot rear end is a greasy mess not sure what gears are slinging oil off that u joint to.

Guy I bought it from had it in storage for 3 years to rebuild it never got around to it so he's not much help. He bought it from a guy in Tennessee that used it to pull camper to Florida every winter. Been reading a lot on the forum and it seems 50/50 split rebuild to crate motor.. I'm leaning towards crate 350 from Jegs making it 260 hp for reasons I'm not sure and new transmission what kind no clue.. rear end gears?? What types of issues I'm going to run into installing.. Drive shaft etc.. Not sure how much truck frame can handle on weight and how much it can pull

So there's my long winded questions I'm sure I'll think of more.. And mayb I'm pipe dreaming and can't get away with this and push it into storarage when I'm ready to travel and tell the Mrs. I changed my mind on what truck I want to use lol

[SoCoC10]

If you are going to do any pulling with the truck, a 383ci or 400ci would be a much better option. I think my local machine shop does a rebuilt 383ci Vortec truck motor for $1700-1800. Get your trans rebuilt and you have a good towing rig for $4000-5000.

[dazza]

Welcome... to the board and to the beginning of your journey/project/part of your life/chunk of your money! (although nowhere near 40k!)

[dazza]

oh, and lets see some pics of this new member of your family!

[67 chevelle]

HT383 Straight from gm , will do everything you want , and put a smile on your face , Id make sure your transmission is a turbo 400 , get a quality rebuild , new converter , and heavy duty trans cooler , should tow well , make sure your sway bars busing are good , maybe add a rear sway bar

[Bonzai]

Thx I will get a pic up.

The 383 or 400 makes a lot of sense instead of stressing out a 350. On the transmission keeping it rebuilding as a 3 speed makes since on wear n tear on tranny of going back n forth between gears towing your not going to get great mileage anyway but would a fourth gear at least help? I know you do a lot of going back and forth with a 5 speed but it is lower RPM on engine. I believe the tranny is a th350 going off the design of the oil pan

[Bonzai]

I don't know bout 400 have to do some reading thx the advise.. Gonna change out radiator has leak on upper end

[Bonzai]

Never thought about sway bar etc..

[GASoline71]

I have pulled many a travel trailer with these trucks and mid to late 70's trucks. A 350 will pull a lot so don't sell it short. In this day and age of overdrive transmissions and practically flawless fuel injected engines.... everybody forgets about the old bread and butter of the GM engine lineup.

I will say that along with either rebuilding that 40 year old worn out engine or replacing it with a crate engine... you will need to make sure that your cooling system is in tip top peak performance. No matter what kind of small block you use, you have to make RPM's to make power in a SBC. RPM's create heat... your cooling system has to up to the task. Also a transmission cooler will pretty much be mandatory.

Next system is the brakes. You bought a '72 so you have discs up front. You're ahead of the game there. But go through the entire system. Worn out calipers and rear cylinders for the drums need to be either rebuilt or replaced. Rotten old brake lines that are rusty and brittle will need to be addressed. Replace the short rubber hoses up front and the one out back.

Go through the rear axle and have new bearings and seals installed. Last thing you need is a 40 year old worn out rear end to let go while you are on a trip pulling a trailer. The transmission will need to be rebuilt. Also, you need to ensure you have new u-joints and that the carrier bearing is in good shape on the drive shaft.

Like I said... a 350 will pull A LOT. You won't be pulling mountain passes at 65mph, but you will pull them. But, it's still a 40 year old truck. So a lot of maintenance and replacement of parts needs to be accomplished. At least... if I was gonna pull a 5th wheel with my '72. it's what I would do.

Gary

[Bonzai]

Thx Gary

[MARKDTN]

I agree with the post above, you do not have to have a big block or 383 to pull trailers. Many a 350 has pulled a heavy load and done fine.

As far as engine, I would do a 5.3/4L60E swap. If I had to do an original small block, it would have TPI fuel injection. I am over carburetors. Lawn equipment and a boat are all I have left carbureted. As far as rebuild original vs: crate, I pick either crate or a later 350 to rebuild. Either way it would have a 1-pc real seal and 2 bolt valve covers. I am over the leaking early ones.

Don't get me wrong, the original small block is strong and long lasting. But adding fuel injection makes a good thing even better. The 1pc seal and 2 bolt valve covers went a long way to make the leaks stop. And the LSx engines just make an even better thing outstanding. My DD 2001 5.3 Tahoe has almost 300K miles and still uses less than a qt of oil in 5000 miles. Never had a starter or transmission. Alternator went 200K. Water pump went 250k. As much as I like the original stuff, it will not touch those numbers.

Now, can you safely pull a 5th wheel camper with a 1/2 ton? Depends on size, but I don't think so. Even if you can start it, can you stop it? Most 5th wheels are going to need a 3/4 ton or bigger to safely stop. Can you do it-maybe. Should you do it-not so sure. I want to drive a cool truck, but I don't want to hurt myself, my family, or the proverbial bus load of children just to look cool. Just some things to think about.

[Bonzai]

Thx dice and mark ... It has a trailer brake system on it now and not sure if the camper with its own brakes also would suffice.. The "kool" factor would be great but I agree not worth a life.. The newer engines and tranny is a good thought

[Big Kev-O]

Low mileage 6.0 LQ4 or even better LQ9 with 4L80 transmission is the only way to go.

I was in the same boat you are in. I have no patients so I bought a crate low mile crate vortec 350 ($750) from a friend. After new carb, accesories, gaskets, timing cover, proper TV cable kit for my 700R4 I am probably close to $2000. After messing around with the carb for 8 months I just bought a EFI kit making it $3500.

I WISH I would have just been patient and found a LQ9. It would have been easier for me to install, more reliable, more powerfull and better gas mileage.

Don't be afraid of installing a modern engine. This site is here to help.

[leftybass209]

Hmm, I'd say price is your biggest obstacle. If you were to rank the 3, from lowest to highest, I'd say:

260/350 crate: affordable, and smooth running. The camshaft is weak and leaves a huge power potential on the table. It can be bought, slap on some Edelbrock E-street heads and a better camshaft, and gain roughly 100hp for cheaper than any other crate and most rebuilds. It voids the warranty though.

Rebuilt 350/383: simply put, you can get what you want, albeit at a price. It's a rebuild, so you can pick your parts, rpm range, power, and probably pick up some kind of warranty with it.

LS swap: Easily the most uncertain and deceptive, but the gains have the possibility of being plenty. Once you factor engine, trans, harness, headers, fuel system, gauges, mounts, radiator, fans, driveshaft and miscellaneous items, that $500 used engine isn't so cheap anymore. On top of that, you've got a used engine, which will last HOPEFULLY as long as the rebuild, except you never know with a used engine.

I'm not dogging on the LS, I love them and would swap in a heartbeat if it were truly affordable, but it has to make sense to truly gain the benefits of turnkey performance and gas mileage. I think I figured it up one time, it would cost me roughly 150,000 miles in gas and maintenance just to break even on the build price.

[swamp rat]

Originally Posted by GASoline71

Like I said... a 350 will pull A LOT. You won't be pulling mountain passes at 65mph, but you will pull them. But, it's still a 40 year old truck. So a lot of maintenance and replacement of parts needs to be accomplished. At least... if I was gonna pull a 5th wheel with my '72. it's what I would do.

Gary

Well maybe not with a 30' 5th wheeler, but i was doing Snoqualmie pass in my K20 at 65 towing a 21' Fiberform boat and trailer some years back with a 2o year old original engine with no problem.

[frogsmakr]

292 4bbl/4l80
Posted via Mobile Device

[diceman50]

For your intended use I would recommend getting a low mileage 5.3 or 6 liter LS style motor and transmission from a salvage yard. For power and durability you can't beat it. You should get the entire package from the same vehicle i.e. engine, transmission, wiring harness, sensors, etc.

It should give you plenty of power to tow a trailer and decent fuel mileage along with all the other benefits of a modern fuel injected drive train.

As far as cost, just add up all the major components and double it.

Ron

[GASoline71]

I agree... not everybody wants or needs an LS based engine. Too many throw out that it is the only option. It's not.

The LS based engines are fantastic and can not be disputed on their reliability and functionality. Not to mention the ridiculous performance potential.

But again... they aren't for everyone.

Gary

[Bonzai]

Thx lefty Gary and kev

Great info from everyone on here lots to think about can go in several directions depending on how much to spend wish I had money running out of my pockets looking for a home.. And can it be done safely.. It sure would look and sound sexy

[diceman50]

Lots of good advice. But, don't let someone else's fears or prejudices sway you too much. Do plenty of research. Car shows are a good place to find someone with a similar project and talk to them about their experience. As far as used engines go I have no fear of a low mileage unit from a reputable salvage yard purchased directly from the damaged vehicle. LS or otherwise.

I have done projects in the past using all of the above strategies with good results and didn't find any of them to be significantly more difficult or expensive than the others.

The main thing I would advise is to develop a strategy and stick to it. Changing the build in mid stream is what gets expensive sometimes frustrating. Please don't ask me how I know.

[Crabass]

How soon do you need it? How simple or complex do you want to keep it, both the initial build and later maintenance and troubleshooting? What kind of budget do you have for the project? The answers to these questions should tell you whether to go basic gen 1 small block, or get into the more exotic.

For a dd that can handle some towing duties I'd go with a all-iron 383, a well built 700r4, and a rebuilt 4:10 12 bolt rear axle. Build the engine with around 9.2-9.3 static compression and stay with components that make torque in the lower rpm range.

Crate motor if you're in a hurry, build your own otherwise (befriending a good machine shop/builder is not cheating). I think taking the time to learn at least the basics of good engine building is well worth the effort, and few things are more rewarding than being a part of the process of building a good one for yourself. It feels pretty good to know what you have and to understand why.

I'm approaching this from the perspective of someone that would not go traveling/towing without a lot of confidence in the machinery.

[Acorn]

What are you calling a "heavy half"? Just curious cuz that's what I jokingly call my 1/2 ton that has a Dana 60 under it.

I may have missed it but you also mentioned "vette fuel injection" Is it a newer fuel injected 350?

[trac209]

The 260 hp crates are a solid performer for the cash. And I agree with lefty, the Ls is a great engine that's has modern reliability built into it but by the time you factor in all the extra work and parts that goes into the swap it's not as cheap as most who've done it will admit or remember. There's lots of options that are more friendly to the wallet that can work. IMHO best bang for buck to get best of both is an od trans and gears that match what you want out of it.