Drip Rail Reseal

[Stocker]

My old stuff was breaking up and I was pulling chunks out of the drip rail so it's time to fix it. Never done this before so I read through some old threads. Good news is there's only light surface rust underneath and it's nearly all wire-brushed out now.

I'll spray with NAPA Permatex rust treatment #765-1671 first, but I'm not sure what to do next. I had figured on painting, then applying seam sealer, then painting over that. Or should I skip the first coat of paint and apply seam sealer directly over the rust treatment, and then paint?

Thanks, guys. Old man here but a rookie when it comes to stuff like this.

[prodjay10]

I'm wanting to know this as well.

[35boulder]

Im in too...

[1968aj]

I did the same. I sealed over the rust reformer then I painted. did this about two months ago no problem so far. just smooth out the sealer best as you can. I used my finger.

[HO455]

Had the same issue on my Suburban except it was like 30 more feet. I removed as much of the old sealant and rust as possible, treated with Por 15, scuff sanded and the used Ospho on the spots that I sanded through. Then shot a coat of epoxy sealer over everything, taped off, and then resealed with a two part seam sealant. There was one spot I had to put some punch and hammer action on to close up the gap. It looks as if my burban was a Monday or a Friday truck as the roof just doesn't fit the cab very well, but was good enough for them, on that day. There is some more info in the Working Man's Burban thread in the 67-72 Suburban section.

[Benny-]

Good info

[Dad's72]

How did you fix that part that you had to cut out? What do you do if you have spots that have rusted through with little pin hole spots?

[HO455]

Originally Posted by Dad's72

How did you fix that part that you had to cut out? What do you do if you have spots that have rusted through with little pin hole spots?

I don't know if your question got answered or not. I had a couple of pin holes and prepared them as I stated earlier, then used a waterproof fiberglass putty ( http://www.evercoat.com/product-deta...art/100622/us/ ) to fill the hole. After I had filled the pinholes I Por15-ed them on the inside to seal both sides. If I was unable to access the back side of the pinhole I drilled a 1" hole to allow access and then filled it with a gray plastic snap in GM body plug like the ones in the doors or over the rear door hinge bolts. Then I painted over them like the factory did. Probably not the method everyone would use but it gives me peace of mind that I have stopped the rust. I also had an area on the vertical rail next to the lift gate that was rusted through enough that you could fit a quarter through the spot. This wasn't a hole into the interior, but through the rail. I prepped it and then laid small strips of fiberglass with resin on each side of the missing area, sanded, then smoothed out with fiberglass putty, sanded, and primed. I sorry, but i didn't get any photos of this repair.

[jfnar]

I'm interested in this thread also. I'm also interested if anyone has a good fix for the inside of the cab on the metal below the drip rail. I can get a patch panel for the front from sun visor to sun visor but I haven't found any for the area above the doors.

[HO455]

Originally Posted by jfnar

I'm interested in this thread also. I'm also interested if anyone has a good fix for the inside of the cab on the metal below the drip rail. I can get a patch panel for the front from sun visor to sun visor but I haven't found any for the area above the doors.

If there are no patch panels available find the best used part, clean it up, paint the insides with Por15 and weld it in. After welding it in, find a way to paint the welds in the void space. Or you can use a short strand fiberglass to repair pin holes after sanding and treating with a product like Ospho. This is an acid etching solution that converts the rust to an inert material. The object of rust treatment is to seal the rusted area off to oxygen. One reason they fail is both sides of the sheet metal needs to be sealed from oxygen contact, which in most vehicles can be next to impossible. I bought one of these spray guns to spray Por15 in the voids on my Suburban. http://www.chemicar.com/tools_spraygun_uc.php. It worked better than I had hoped but, it was messy in permanent Por15 way. (If you've never used Por15, once you get it on you it stays for weeks). There is more of the process in the Working Man's Burban thread.

[franken]

I wouldn't trust a rust treatment. Try applying it to something rusty, and then sand it. I'll bet you'll find the rust is still there.

[Ironangel]

Originally Posted by franken

I wouldn't trust a rust treatment. Try applying it to something rusty, and then sand it. I'll bet you'll find the rust is still there.

If you sand it off, what do you think it's going to do? It's goig to rust! Most "reformers" like Navel Jelly are a Phosphoric Acid, when introduced to "Iron Oxide" a chemical reaction occure's resulting in an inert compound called "Iron Phosphate" It is a black compound (and if left undisturbed) will all but stop the oxidation of the metal you expose. It is a paintable long term treatment that stops rust where it breeds! Unless it's removed...? ~Ghostrider~

[Stocker]

Well, I treated the area this afternoon. In the 45 years since my truck was built, there was only very light surface rust anyway. I removed nearly all of it (always gonna be a small amount you can't reach). If the Permatex stuff does even a fraction of what it claims, it oughtta be good to go. Plus it's gonna get a fresh coat of paint and then seam sealer.

[special-K]

I don't understand putting POR15 on then ospho. Wouldn't you want the ospho directly n the rusted bare metal you want to treat?

I also don't understand the not trusting rust treatment. Why not? That stuff works. It is proven science. And if that's not good enough, I say it works from experience.

When I did mine I used a rust convertor after wire wheeling, primed, painted, seam sealed, primed, painted. I want primer under all my paint

[HO455]

In my opinion nothing sticks to clean, dustless rust and seals it better than Por15. The problem I have found is that not everything sticks to Por15. So if you are putting short strand or putty on over your Por 15 it most likely will peal off, unless you scuff it up. Scuffing it can cause small spots of rust to show through if your not careful. So to be sure that I don't have untreated rust I apply a light coat of Ospho and let it dry 24 hours before covering. The putty's and primers seem to have no problem sticking to the Ospho. This is just how I do it and I have evolved to this system as I have found it to work for me. I agree with you. Rust converter's work and work well. Most of the problems I have encountered over the years were self inflicted. In all honesty I will point out that have never built a show car/truck and all my cars live in the world outside. And in that context the new formula paints will fail long before the repair does. For my next project I am half temped to drive to Mexico and bring back some old school acrylic enamel paint, that will last more than 6 or 7 years.

[special-K]

Ok, thanks for explaining. I know that POR stands for Paint Over Rust. That is the whole idea behind the product and others like it. It would be nice if they came out with a POPOR-15 product... Prime Over POR-15.

I have done my '72 twice. First I used 3M's seam sealer. It was nice to work with, came out looking great. The truck also sits out. About a year later, after all my very thorough effort, I looked up there and could see the sealer had let go of the front edge ever so lightly. Don't use this stuff on external areas! It remained pliable and when I rolled it back at that separation I found I could pull it all loose. Next thing I knew I was pulling it all out in one long stretchy piece. Water had been getting down under it. It was wet when I removed that stuff. It didn't do any damage, yet, but rust started to develop. The paint had crackled up due to the pliant nature of the product. I did the whole process all over again using a product my paint supplier recommended. I'd have to look into what it was called, can't recall.

I know there have been threads on best products, but it would help to know that to make this process a true success. Can people who respond also list what product they used? My '67 project cab is all clean metal with all sealer removed and epoxy primed at the moment and I want to get it right.

[HO455]

Originally Posted by special-K

Ok, thanks for explaining. I know that POR stands for Paint Over Rust. That is the whole idea behind the product and others like it. It would be nice if they came out with a POPOR-15 product... Prime Over POR-15.

I have done my '72 twice. First I used 3M's seam sealer. It was nice to work with, came out looking great. The truck also sits out. About a year later, after all my very thorough effort, I looked up there and could see the sealer had let go of the front edge ever so lightly. Don't use this stuff on external areas! It remained pliable and when I rolled it back at that separation I found I could pull it all loose. Next thing I knew I was pulling it all out in one long stretchy piece. Water had been getting down under it. It was wet when I removed that stuff. It didn't do any damage, yet, but rust started to develop. The paint had crackled up due to the pliant nature of the product. I did the whole process all over again using a product my paint supplier recommended. I'd have to look into what it was called, can't recall.

I know there have been threads on best products, but it would help to know that to make this process a true success. Can people who respond also list what product they used? My '67 project cab is all clean metal with all sealer removed and epoxy primed at the moment and I want to get it right.

I bought both of these but I only used the regular 2 part seam sealer (SEM 40477). We felt that the self leveling would have leaked thru the gaps in the rail above the windshield. The original plan was to seal the rear above the lift gate and the joints around the window frames then use the self leveling on the rest of the drip rail.

[Stocker]

For better or worse, the seam sealer got laid down a few minutes ago. My local NAPA had nothing in stock so they ordered a tube. I didn't know what they got in until this afternoon. Turns out to be 3M #08367 which is a black tar-like substance and is not self-leveling. That's OK as long as it stays in place and keeps the tinworm at bay. It's definitely an old work truck and not a show piece (can't bring myself to call it a beater), so results trump beauty. Smoothed it out with my finger as I laid it down. Pretty sure I have had nastier stuff on my finger at some point, and it came off with Fast Orange. Next is primer & paint within a day or two and I can put another little project to bed.

[Ol Blue K20]

Subbed to see your results...

[special-K]

Stocker, the 3M product I got at NAPA off the shelf wasn't the same. I'm sure it wasn't black. Whatever I used acted just like silicone, but paintable. Might be good for hidden areas but sucks for exterior.

And HO455, thanks for that info. I knew from other threads the opinion was the best product was a 2-part but I didn't know who it came from. Shoulda figured SEM. It seems (keep wanting to type seams) everything they make is top shelf

[ck5566]

I can't remember who said from this thread that 3M's seam sealer wasn't for exterior must have gotten the wrong 3M product #'s. This is what the Auto Collision Shop I worked for used and it was 3M's Brand # 08531 called Heavy Drip-Chek Sealer. Google the name 3M and search #08531 Heavy Drip-Chek Sealer and this is what comes up for the product; **Designed for filling "exterior" automotive "visual definition seams". Seam Sealers are used for sealing the lap points of two metals over lapping each other and then are painted over.

If you don't want to use any kind of seam sealers then sand Blast the areas as good as you can then Epoxy Primer Seal and use Body Filler (Bondo) over it and again use the Epoxy Primer if you want to but can also finish up with just Primer Sealer or a Sandable Primer then Color paint the areas.

[Stocker]

Well, that was a bust! I blame myself, not the product. Told you guys I was new to this sort of project. Anyway, the 3M sealer laid down okay for a work truck. Unfortunately I got some over the masking tape, and after primer & paint, I tried to remove the tape. Lifted the edge of the sealer and it went downhill from there, tried to remove it and the mess kept getting worse. Oh well, nothing ventured, nothing gained. I'll sleep on it, but right now I'm tempted to take it to the shop. Need to find a good shop, sadly there's none near here.

[ck5566]

Originally Posted by Stocker

Well, that was a bust! I blame myself, not the product. Told you guys I was new to this sort of project. Anyway, the 3M sealer laid down okay for a work truck. Unfortunately I got some over the masking tape, and after primer & paint, I tried to remove the tape. Lifted the edge of the sealer and it went downhill from there, tried to remove it and the mess kept getting worse. Oh well, nothing ventured, nothing gained. I'll sleep on it, but right now I'm tempted to take it to the shop. Need to find a good shop, sadly there's none near here.

You can call 3M's Collision Repair Solutions, M-F 8 to 4:30 CST at 877-666-2277 they can talk you through what you don't understand. Or you can keep up what you are doing here to get more/other answers.

PS you don't need a Shop to do what you can do for yourself. But hay its your money.

[Stocker]

Originally Posted by ck5566

You can call 3M's Collision Repair Solutions, M-F 8 to 4:30 CST at 877-666-2277 they can talk you through what you don't understand. Or you can keep up what you are doing here to get more/other answers.
PS you don't need a Shop to do what you can do for yourself. But hay its your money.

Thanks for the tip. I'll give it a day or two before deciding what to do next. I usually try to do most things for myself, if I'm able. Just need to decide if it's worth the frustration, especially if it looks like the results might be similar the second time around. If I try it again, I might see about locating some self-leveling sealer.

[Ironangel]

This is for the drip rail, http://3mcollision.com/products/seal...ler-08307.html Great stuff. I wire wheeled the channel clean, wire brush the channel splices, power wash and rinse, and blow dry with a blower or compressed air. I spray Rustoleum Rust Reformer in the rusty cracks and crevasses and then shoot the whole rail with zinc primer. Then apply the sealer from center of cab out and down each side. Have your small brush and butter knife handy because as you apply a thin coat down the radius, you'll help level and feather the bead at the end of the channel. Might as well spring for the applicator and some extra nozzles. I can do one drip rail with one 200ml package. You can use the 8329 controlled flow formula on the radius area if your not comfortable with the self leveling. Wax paper and masking tape help at the gaps in the splices.