Detroit Diesel Running Video and a ?

[greywuuf]

ok so the title is a bit of a click bait, but here is a video of an issue I am having ( less than 2 minutes )

https://youtu.be/lBYbFUcGqtE

[Dieselwrencher]

I'm guessing there is something bypassing in the steering valve that bolts on the top of the gear box that sends the pressure to the steer assist cylinder. Maybe a bad seal, rolled o ring or all the above?

[greywuuf]

yeah it is acting like the steering valve is wide open regardless of the position, and the ram just does its thing, reversing at the top and bottom of the stroke...I am assuming this would be a self bleeding system if all was working correctly ?

[LynnB]

I am guessing you don't have a power steering box that what we call an integrated power steering box. You have the ram type power steering cylinder mounted on the steering linkage, right? There is a control valve that looks something like this:



Swap the two hoses going to the end of that control valve. Ask me how I know.

[greywuuf]

no, looks nothing like that
looks for all the world like a chevy recirculating ball steering box ....but there is a second portion around the steering shaft that has the hoses going in the top and out the bottom
.... I can take the ram off and it will steer ( very very stiffly ) with just the box .. and I don't mean stiff as in the box is bad ... works fine with the weight off ... just it is power type turns ratio and with no assist it takes a LOT of grunt


watch the vid clear through I thought I had a decent picture of the box ... it could be unclear I was using my phone as a viewfinder with my go pro so sometimes I don't get exactly what I think I am

[greywuuf]

also unless the hose were previously made incorrectly I could not have swapped them .. pump side I have a threaded flare fitting for pressure and a rubber with hose clamp return ... on the valve on the box they are both threaded flare and they are not the same size , plus I never removed them

[LynnB]

You haven't had the hoses off the ram cylinder? Talking about the two blue cloth braided hoses.

[greywuuf]

Originally Posted by LynnB

You haven't had the hoses off the ram cylinder? Talking about the two blue cloth braided hoses.

Nope ... pulled one of the lines on the other side of the steering valve early on just to see if the pump was flowing. Figured I would pull them after I got it working and have new ones built ..... but I kind of have to spend money in small increments. the radiator being bad when I pulled the pump ( repair the radiator and all new hoses and belts has kind of blown the budget for this repair

[LynnB]

When you turn the wheel, does it immediately start to turn the OTHER direction?

If all else fails, and if you don't mind living without power steering, I know where a good manual steer box is on a 70 C50. I think it is the same box. It could be had cheap, and I would be glad to go get it for you and ship to you for actual shipping.

PM me if interested.

I repaired a ram like that on a early 70's Corvette back in the late 70's. I crossed those two lines (the ones going to the ram) and when there was no pressure on the steering wheel, it sat still. As soon as I started turning it to the left, it immediately went all the way right, bottomed out and headed back the other way. That is why I thought you might have them crossed. That Corvette used a control valve as I pictured above. Yours is apparently controlled by something in the box. Wish I could be more help, but I am not familiar with that box set up.

Before you throw in the towel, try some Lucas PS conditioner, and let it run a bit. If something is stuck in the box, it may set it free.

[greywuuf]

Originally Posted by LynnB

When you turn the wheel, does it immediately start to turn the OTHER direction?

nope, it turns the same direction not opposite

[LynnB]

In that case, I think you have a sticking valve. Try some conditioner, flush it well, and see what happens.

[Bob B.]

That is a common Saginaw heavy truck power steering setup. I drove an 1989 TopKick with the same system. The 2 hoses going to the box are for the control valve, which functions similar to the center link/pitman arm control valve used on old GM vehicles with the ram type power steering. If the steering goes all the way to lock the same direction you are turning, the control valve is likely sticking. If it is going the opposite direction you may have the lines from the control valve to the hydraulic cylinder crossed. If the lines are correct try flushing the system and use some power steering conditioner as LynnB says. Do you have a manual for this truck? They are on Ebay all the time.

[greywuuf]

No I do not have a manual, and you did not watch the video I assume . As the wheel goes full lock immediately on start up....but rebounds and goes full lock the other direction and repeats. Pretty violently......any sources for rebuilding the valve?

[Bob B.]

Was the power steering working when you first got the truck?

[greywuuf]

Originally Posted by Bob B.

Was the power steering working when you first got the truck?

No, the system was empty ( I filled before starting) but the vanes were all dislodges and scattered in the bottom of the reservoir, that is why I just replaced the pump....truck had been sitting in unknown condition for at least 10 years, the water pump was stuck ... it is a classic "it was running when I parked it" kind of thing. suspect moisture in the system sticking or leaking valve and I know the seals around the steering shaft at the top of the box are leaking badly .... I am just not able to find ONE example of this type of system either on YouTube or in parts house searches.. so until I can find parts I am not wanting to tear the valve off and see what it really up with it.

[greywuuf]

I may have discovered my issue.
[IMG]This is the valve "spool" from inside the steering box, why do I get the feeling it was assembled incorrectly? by Greywuuf, on Flickr[/IMG]

[rkn463]

Did you ever get it working right?

-Richard

[greywuuf]

Not yet, just got the seal kit in and from preliminary inspection I think it is the wrong one ....I am afraid the nick in the spool valve is going to require me to replace the box though.