TH350 to T5 manual, Is it worth it?

[cherokeejohn]

My 72 Has gone through a few transmissions in the past 2 years, granted, none of them were new/fresh, I am preparing to swap it out with a direct replacement, again very soon and my good friend asked me if I wanted his truck before he scrapped it. It's a 86 Chevy S10 2wd with a 2.late V6, But it has a T5 manual 5 speed and all the clutch linkage, pedal assembly,etc..., it does have a new clutch and pres. plate with less than 1000 miles on it. My Question is, How hard is it to change my 72 over to a manual and will the clutch pedal assembly, linkage, reservoir, etc... work for my truck. Or should I just bite the bullet and swap in another TH350. I cant afford to buy a reman/new trans, so its gonna be another 2nd hand trans with some new seals, and a filter/fluid change

[James the III]

Originally Posted by cherokeejohn

My 72 Has gone through a few transmissions in the past 2 years, granted, none of them were new/fresh, I am preparing to swap it out with a direct replacement, again very soon and my good friend asked me if I wanted his truck before he scrapped it. It's a 86 Chevy S10 2wd with a 2.late V6, But it has a T5 manual 5 speed and all the clutch linkage, pedal assembly,etc..., it does have a new clutch and pres. plate with less than 1000 miles on it. My Question is, How hard is it to change my 72 over to a manual and will the clutch pedal assembly, linkage, reservoir, etc... work for my truck. Or should I just bite the bullet and swap in another TH350. I cant afford to buy a reman/new trans, so its gonna be another 2nd hand trans with some new seals, and a filter/fluid change

The s-10 v6 t5 is very weak..
I'd not put one behind a v8..
if it was a 2.8 v6 it is a 60* bellhousing that won't bolt to a chevy v8
if it is a 4.3 v6 (350 with 2 cyl lopped off) then it will bolt up..

[jocko]

I put one behind a 283 in a 66 C10 swb and loved it. But, personally, I would not put it in place of a TH350 in a 67-72 era. TH350 is a better, stronger even in stock form, trans. If you REALLY want to row your own, I'd go with a kit-based T56 or TKO, etc. Taint cheap. That's why I'd stick with the TH350 myself. Much stronger than an S10 T5. Some T5's are semi-strong, known as 'world class' T5s, but the only major difference is the bearing for the countershaft, a nice to have - they came behind some Mustangs and some of the final S10s built - but you gotta run your numbers and make sure of what you have (if you didn't know already). In your case, you do, and that is not a good candidate. Bottom line, the ONLY vehicle I'd stick any T5 in, and, again, this is just my opinion, is a lightweight pre-67 that I'm not going to do burnouts in. Can go behind a V8 with that mindset just fine. Anyway, don't be doin any burnouts if you do press forward with this or you'll make a lot of extra work for yourself putting that TH350 back in later...

If you'd like more info on the swap, here's the build thread for the T5 swap I mentioned above, might provide you some additional background or some resources if you need em: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=482069

[James the III]

Originally Posted by jocko

I put one behind a 283 in a 66 C10 swb and loved it. But, personally, I would not put it in place of a TH350 in a 67-72 era. TH350 is a better, stronger even in stock form, trans. If you REALLY want to row your own, I'd go with a kit-based T56 or TKO, etc. Taint cheap. That's why I'd stick with the TH350 myself. Much stronger than an S10 T5. Some T5's are semi-strong, known as 'world class' T5s, but the only major difference is the bearing for the countershaft, a nice to have - they came behind some Mustangs and some of the final S10s built - but you gotta run your numbers and make sure of what you have (if you didn't know already). In your case, you do, and that is not a good candidate. Bottom line, the ONLY vehicle I'd stick any T5 in, and, again, this is just my opinion, is a lightweight pre-67 that I'm not going to do burnouts in. Can go behind a V8 with that mindset just fine. Anyway, don't be doin any burnouts if you do press forward with this or you'll make a lot of extra work for yourself putting that TH350 back in later...

If you'd like more info on the swap, here's the build thread for the T5 swap I mentioned above, might provide you some additional background or some resources if you need em: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=482069

v6 t5 input shafts are smaller..

[jocko]

James, what does that have to do with what I posted? (i.e. wondering why I'm being quoted) I/p shaft is smaller than... what? Sorry, but I'm confused.

S10 V6 T5 goes behind a V8 just fine using the a stock bell housing, just need the spacer - because the input shaft is longer than a stock GM 3 on the tree or 4-speed that came in these trucks. A Camaro T5 has the shorter input shaft and does not require the spacer - but generally has the less desirable rear of the tailshaft shifter location.

John, the shared link outlines swap considerations, including the different input shaft lengths.

[cherokeejohn]

thanks fellas, i appreciate all the info. your exactly right jocko, the 2.late s do have a 60* bell. the truck has a separate bell housing though. I don't think I'm gonna mess with it considering all the extra work involved. I'll just keep the TH350 in her A wonderful member Special-K has offered up a used trans from his parts stash and I believe that's the best route to go. I'll send my original trans out for a overhaul when I can afford to. i love this site and it's members. since I've joined up, I have met some of the nicest people in my lifetime, Gotten some excellent advise and coaching, and seen more people offer up help, parts, guidance, etc... out of the goodness in their hearts. If-ever you start to feel that there's no good left in this world, You only need to look here to see there's a whole group that still have good morals, manners, care, and general good souls!. Thanks to all of you on this site. i truly do appreciate all you've done

[James the III]

Originally Posted by jocko

James, what does that have to do with what I posted? (i.e. wondering why I'm being quoted) I/p shaft is smaller than... what? Sorry, but I'm confused.

S10 V6 T5 goes behind a V8 just fine using the a stock bell housing, just need the spacer - because the input shaft is longer than a stock GM 3 on the tree or 4-speed that came in these trucks. A Camaro T5 has the shorter input shaft and does not require the spacer - but generally has the less desirable rear of the tailshaft shifter location.

John, the shared link outlines swap considerations, including the different input shaft lengths.

The v6 input shaft diameter is smaller, that = weaker .
The t5 in f body's didn't come behind a 350 for a reason, the v6 is even weaker..

the s-10 came with 2 v6's
the 4.3 90* v6 that has the same bell housing bolt pattern as a small block chevy .

the s-10 2.8 v6 is a 60* v6 with the metric bell housing bolt pattern..
and will not bolt to a v8

The length of the shaft, isn't the problem, it's the diameter of it, they twist and snap with any torque put to them..

[weq92f]

One day I would like a T56 so I'm interested in your plight.

What about the install of the clutch parts ( pedal and related plumbing to the manual tranny. How involved is that?

-klb

[jocko]

Originally Posted by James the III

The v6 input shaft diameter is smaller, that = weaker .
The t5 in f body's didn't come behind a 350 for a reason, the v6 is even weaker..

the s-10 came with 2 v6's
the 4.3 90* v6 that has the same bell housing bolt pattern as a small block chevy .

the s-10 2.8 v6 is a 60* v6 with the metric bell housing bolt pattern..
and will not bolt to a v8

The length of the shaft, isn't the problem, it's the diameter of it, they twist and snap with any torque put to them..

Ok. Yes, the T5 is weaker, that's what I stated in the first post when recommending the T56, TKO, or just keeping the TH350. Seems we're in violent agreement - that's why I didn't understand why you were quoting. ...

Anyway, IN CASE the op is still interested in a T5 because perhaps his driving habits support a long happy T5 life behind his sbc (and it can live a long happy life depending on those habits), that's why I was talking about how to make them fit.

[cherokeejohn]

LOL NO, I don't think my driving habits would allow that T5 to last very long at all from what I've seen posted above. Not that I'm hot rodding my old girl, but that I still use her as she was built for, Hard Work!, hauling loads of e everything you can imagine, towing trailers, campers, boats, Harley's, and occasionally hauling and towing at the same time "i.e. Harley's and camper together", my personal favorite. I Wish sometimes that I would've gotten a 8 lugger 3/4 ton, sometimes, not all the time

[James the III]

Originally Posted by jocko

Ok. Yes, the T5 is weaker, that's what I stated in the first post when recommending the T56, TKO, or just keeping the TH350. Seems we're in violent agreement - that's why I didn't understand why you were quoting. ...

Anyway, IN CASE the op is still interested in a T5 because perhaps his driving habits support a long happy T5 life behind his sbc (and it can live a long happy life depending on those habits), that's why I was talking about how to make them fit.

I quoted because I don't think you understand, unless I'm reading it wrong..


the t5
has 3 levels

the world class (strongest oem unit
the t5 put behind small v8's before the world class came out
the v6 t5 not to be used behind a v8..

think of the v6 t5 like the th200 , it's the weaker th350 twin..

I'm just trying to help the o/p before he waste a ton of time..

he'd be better off finding a t5 from a 80-90's 305 full sized truck.. for the cheapest way to get a stick.

[jocko]

Ok, thanks for elaborating James. Have you had a chance to read the thread linked in post #3? It includes several references, lots of other information as well - and outlines what you're talking about clearly. So, yes, well aware of the i/p shaft dia diffs, but in the quoted post, I was simply recommending the WC over a non-WC as the best option.

If anyone is interested, the actual numbers for the i/p shafts are as follows:
83-93 GM T5s behind V8s were 26 spline, 1+1/8" dia
T5s behind 4s and V6s were 14 spline, 1" dia.

The major durability improvements, however, came about with the release of the WC that included bearing and shaft assemblies for 1st and 2nd (rather than solid shafts), 3rd and 4th synchros were steel reinforced and had fiber lined rings, and the countershaft had a bearing also. For the swap meet shopper, the major noticeable difference for identification purposes is the bearing for the countershaft in a WC is visibly different externally (ID images available in the link provided in post #3), but, the several other improvements as outlined above made it an all around better trans compared to a non-WC and it's torque ratings agree with that. I was not differentiating the two non-WC versions (that have different i/p shaft diameters) because they are both weaker than a WC. Weaker or not, the main point is that driving habits are primarily what dictate the life of the trans. If launching off a line at the strip, or even if doing an occasional burnout, any T5 is not the trans of choice. If a WC can be found, it's preferred over the non-WC.

So, I think we're saying similar things in different ways. We all agree the WC is the best bet. Yes, there are a couple different non-WC versions, none of which support burnouts or abuse to the point the input shaft diameter will make the difference. It's just one of many things that won't last long in a non-WC. But your point is well taken - if a shopper only has two transmissions left to choose from, neither of which is a WC, it would be wiser to choose the stronger of the weak ones.

In John's case, I think he's chosen wisely to avoid any T5 if he's going to occasionally haul the stuff he posted above.