Zz502/572 ?

[saxmo]

also, greg where did you get the headers? What kinda motor mounts did you use? I have a 73-87 front member that will upgrade the front end to the later style motor mounts, and disc brakes.

[mrein3]

Unless I missed it nobody mentioned brakes.

You don't have to tell the wife but I think you are starting at the wrong place for a tow rig. You need a heavy duty rear end and a VERY GOOD set of brakes up front.

I can pull my 3100 pound bass boat with my Ford Escort. I just can't stop it with my Escort.

Your sub is a 1969. Unless you upgraded to disk brakes you have drums. DO NOT hook a 4000 pound boat up to that truck if it has drums up front still.
Yes it will stop it once. But if you are coming down a hill and really need to stop you aren't going to be able to.

As far as transmissions go, forget overdrive if you are towing that much weight. You'll kill a 700r4 the first summer if you pull with it in OD.

I live in a small town that is completely surrounded by lakes. Unless i take the highway east or west I can't leave town and keep my feet dry. There is a stop light on the highway entering town. The ice went out last week. Starting this week I can expect once a week to be stuck in traffic while the tow trucks pry some underequiped vehicle out of the back of another one at the stop light because their boat pushed them right into the vehicle in front of them.

AFTER you get your bags installed, a heavy duty rear end, and good disk brakes up front, then go build/buy a fire breathing dragon for under the hood.

[saxmo]

Originally Posted by mrein3

Unless I missed it nobody mentioned brakes.

AFTER you get your bags installed, a heavy duty rear end, and good disk brakes up front, then go build/buy a fire breathing dragon for under the hood.

lol, I didn't mention brakes, but that was simply because the engine is the biggest $$ item. I have already upgraded the front with a 1986 front member. It has disc and later model motor mounts. It is very simple to do, so I left it out of the equation. Good call though, cause I see lotsa people who throw 20" wheels on a vehicle and wonder why the stock brakes have a hard time dealing with the rotating mass, not to mention tow weight.

[70rs/ss]

Well, where I live we use trailer brakes and they stop pretty much anything, so..... Discs are a normal upgrade , but back to your question (motors). The 502 is wicked and the 572 even more so, but like mentioned above the 502 (truck version I believe is what they call it) is what you want torq moves stuff HP is for smiles, pulling a boat will require the tq. I am buying a bare (new) 502 and stroking it myself to end up in the middle bigger than 502, smaller than the 572. Remember Function over Form. Torq gets it done, call Scoggins Dickey in Tx and ask, they will shoot straight and get you into the RIGHT motor. As for upgrading the susp, 3/4 ton stuff will bolt right in. I bought a long bed 3/4 ton and put the truck arms into my 1/2 ton short bed and the bolt in and add extra plating for strength, it can be done, just buy a 3/4 ton lwb for parts and build away.

[Ole Blue 68]

Hey Saxmo,

Where you towing that boat to, Livingston? If you can talk your wife into letting you drop $30-40k to tow a boat 5 minutes up the road, you are a god.....

[saxmo]

you got it ! Livingston, and maybe all the way to Lake Houston! Funny that you figured out the logistics! It's our little secret.

[saxmo]

Originally Posted by 70rs/ss

As for upgrading the susp, 3/4 ton stuff will bolt right in. I bought a long bed 3/4 ton and put the truck arms into my 1/2 ton short bed and the bolt in and add extra plating for strength, it can be done, just buy a 3/4 ton lwb for parts and build away.

Will the 3/4 stuff fit the panel? If so, it's on!

[Ole Blue 68]

Originally Posted by saxmo

you got it ! Livingston, and maybe all the way to Lake Houston! Funny that you figured out the logistics! It's our little secret.

I won't tell as long as you come down and help convince my wife next...

[70rs/ss]

Originally Posted by saxmo

Will the 3/4 stuff fit the panel? If so, it's on!

The same, same, same. I tried just to see if it would and BAM super tough stuff for $150!! Springs and all. Now, understand, it don't ride like a caddy but it will hold up your boat, kids and probably another boat. BBC springs can be bought for the front as well. Suburbans, trucks, short and long all use the same stuff even panels, but sub stuff is usually built with higher rates to support the weight of the body, but 3/4 ton truck should do it.

[saxmo]

Originally Posted by Ole Blue 68

I won't tell as long as you come down and help convince my wife next...

My methods of convincing are top secret, only a fortunate few have succumbed to my powers of persuasion. I will; however, say that it MUST BE her idea.

[saxmo]

Originally Posted by 70rs/ss

The same, same, same. I tried just to see if it would and BAM super tough stuff for $150!! Springs and all. Now, understand, it don't ride like a caddy but it will hold up your boat, kids and probably another boat. BBC springs can be bought for the front as well. Suburbans, trucks, short and long all use the same stuff even panels, but sub stuff is usually built with higher rates to support the weight of the body, but 3/4 ton truck should do it.

[dougs69c10]

napaengine.com is the site for the performance engines, gives the back ground, whats done etc etc

[saxmo]

ok I'll check it out.

[4x4Poet]

�

Originally Posted by saxmo

I guess what I may need to do is compare the differences. I already have a built Vortec 383. It has Vortec performer heads,1.6 rockers,comp cams 270 magnum,...
Any ideas on numbers for the 383? Plus I already have it, new.

Since you already have the 383, why not go with it? Unless you have another truck to throw it in, I can't see BBC power being worth 5-10k more $$ -unless you were starting from scratch. The 383 would have plenty of power to tow. Saving the dough now could go towards a towing truck purchase later if the panel doesn't work out. Easier install, too.

I'm pretty sure the 270 magnum cam does not have a towing friendly torque range down low. You might start a desktop dyno thread on the 383 in the engine section. Ask for the full torque curve so you can see how the power is down low. Choose a torquer cam along with the 270 for comparison purposes.

dwaite made a great point about probably needing to swap a torquer cam in any factory BBC like the RamJet502. Seems like GM cams them for street legal drag racers. I've had a RJ502 in mind for one of my burbs but have long planned to use a torquer cam. Probably a Voodoo. Totally skipped my brain cells as I posted till dwaite's post. Good catch on his part.

[67shortie]

I don't believe anyone has also mentioned that the 572 is a TALL deck block. That usually means maybe accessory mounting problems and headers=$$$$

I would opt for a towing 502, and a TH400 and the gear vendors OD.

OR (always one) pick up a 502 block and get a 4.25 crank kit for it=540cid

540, AFR oval heads, good hyd roller cam and 9.5 compression, TORQUE baby!

[Ole Blue 68]

Originally Posted by saxmo

My methods of convincing are top secret, only a fortunate few have succumbed to my powers of persuasion. I will; however, say that it MUST BE her idea.

Words of wisdom...

[kbs71]

Hey saxmo I'll be glad to come over and move that 383 out of the way for you to make room for your new engine.....check out these web sites, they got some pretty cool stuff.
http://www.hotrodlane.cc/
http://www.700r4l60e.com/

[saxmo]

Thanks kbs71, I'll keep that in mind, but the 383 is new and it would fit in my 1976 Camaro

[PanelDeland]

I think the info above is good.Build or buy a torque engine.The HP looks good but the torque is what gets you moving.18 wheelers usually have a 425 HP diesel max but they put out huge amounts of torque.The torque has to also be in the rpm range you will be towing at.Even tire size is going to affect the torque range as will axle ratio and tranny.Another thing to consider is that the 383 is going to get enough better gas milage to be able to make an extra trip to the lake occasionally.You may also want to look at a later model rear end with disc's if you are doing a lot of towing.

[saxmo]

yeah, I am gonna focus on the torque. i heard we could use a lincoln mark VI rear in our trucks, and it has correct lug pattern,disc,and Ford 9". elieve it's a bit narrower, but that just means bigger meats on the rear... anyone else done this swap.

[dougs69c10]

Originally Posted by saxmo

yeah, I am gonna focus on the torque. i heard we could use a lincoln mark VI rear in our trucks, and it has correct lug pattern,disc,and Ford 9". elieve it's a bit narrower, but that just means bigger meats on the rear... anyone else done this swap.

you sure its not a 8.8 and not a 9 inch, I thought the only car to get factory 9 inch rear was a lincoln zephyr and a few rare production cars

[saxmo]

From what I understand there were quite a few cars with 9" rearends, understandibly there were 28 and 31 spline axel differences. Here's a linkhttp://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2...ch/index.shtml

[72CSTC5]

Saxmo, I think in one of your earlier post you hit the nail right on the head. I would buy the torque model of the 502 and then supercharge it or turbo charge it. That would help once you are actually moving and the want to speed up or pass someone. I would use the gm 4l80e trans if you could with torque converter lock up to help you tow. Good luck. P.S. when you get it done let me know and we will invite ourselves for a boat ride!! LOL!!!

[saxmo]

Hey sounds like fun! I am working with Zumo right now ... we are dialing in the paint scheme, what you think?

[saxmo]

we are trying to base the idea on my Avatar