Is that illegal? - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

Slammed70 · 11-25-2006, 02:34 AM

I got pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt today....and a fix it ticket.

Other then the CD player, speakers, auto-column, and my nifty floormats the interior of my truck is completely stock. And there is NO trace of seatbelts being in this truck.

I tried to explain to him that its to old and I wont do it because Im in the process of restoring it back to stock(haha).

But this asshole still gave me a ticket and I have 30 days before it gets inspected.

Anyone know if a 70 truck was for sure a seat belt equipped truck? Or if theres a way to fight it so I dont have to put a seat belt in my truck?

Thanks,
Mitch

1BadSS · 11-25-2006, 02:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slammed70

I got pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt today....and a fix it ticket.

Other then the CD player, speakers, auto-column, and my nifty floormats the interior of my truck is completely stock. And there is NO trace of seatbelts being in this truck.

I tried to explain to him that its to old and I wont do it because Im in the process of restoring it back to stock(haha).

But this asshole still gave me a ticket and I have 30 days before it gets inspected.

Anyone know if a 70 truck was for sure a seat belt equipped truck? Or if theres a way to fight it so I dont have to put a seat belt in my truck?

Thanks,
Mitch

My 69 has lap belts if that helps at all.

texascowboy593 · 11-25-2006, 02:44 AM

My 67 GMC and 71 both came with lap belts as well...

Litemup · 11-25-2006, 02:53 AM

I'm sure your truck had seatbelts at some point, I'd buy some and put em in.

Seatbelts were mandatory after 1968

Brad · 11-25-2006, 02:54 AM

It was right around 67 that seatbelts became federally madated so yes, he gave you a legitamate ticket. You don't have any ground to stand on. What's puzzling me is how did he know you weren't wearing your seatbelt???

SCOTI · 11-25-2006, 03:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad

..... What's puzzling me is how did he know you weren't wearing your seatbelt???

Exactly?

masterbeavis · 11-25-2006, 03:30 AM

Some states don't require a reason to give you a seatbelt ticket, or to pull you over because they cant see you wearing your seatbelt. Used to be in Cali, you had to be pulled over and ticketed for something else for the policeman to give you a ticket for seatbelts. (or at least pull you over for something other than not wearing your seatbelt. They changed the law a while back, now they can pull you over and give you a seatbelt ticket just for that reason.

[edit] I bet if you pulled out your seat/lift carpet you would see the holes in the floor where the seatbelt bolts go, unless somebody cut em out.

Americanrider · 11-25-2006, 03:32 AM

Knowlegde is Power

Google up the traffic laws in your state. It should be written on the ticket which law your in violation of. Here is our law for Washington State:

RCW 46.37.510
Seat belts and shoulder harnesses.

(1) No person may sell any automobile manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1964, nor may any owner cause such vehicle to be registered thereafter under the provisions of chapter 46.12 RCW unless such motor car or automobile is equipped with automobile seat belts installed for use on the front seats thereof which are of a type and installed in a manner conforming to rules adopted by the state patrol. Where registration is for transfer from an out-of-state license, the applicant shall be informed of this section by the issuing agent and has thirty days to comply. The state patrol shall adopt and enforce standards as to what constitutes adequate and safe seat belts and for the fastening and installation of them. Such standards shall not be below those specified as minimum requirements by the Society of Automotive Engineers on June 13, 1963.

(2) Every passenger car manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1965, shall be equipped with at least two lap-type safety belt assemblies for use in the front seating positions.

(3) Every passenger car manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1968, shall be equipped with a lap-type safety belt assembly for each permanent passenger seating position. This requirement shall not apply to police vehicles.

(4) Every passenger car manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1968, shall be equipped with at least two shoulder harness-type safety belt assemblies for use in the front seating positions.

(5) The state patrol shall excuse specified types of motor vehicles or seating positions within any motor vehicle from the requirements imposed by subsections (1), (2), and (3) of this section when compliance would be impractical.

(6) No person may distribute, have for sale, offer for sale, or sell any safety belt or shoulder harness for use in motor vehicles unless it meets current minimum standards and specifications conforming to rules adopted by the state patrol or the United States department of transportation.

**Ron 586** · 11-25-2006, 04:02 AM

My 72 C/10 only has lap belts. There is a dimple where the shoulder belt mounted on the high end trucks but mine never had them. I have been pulled over and checked and even went through a DUI check point one night when coming home from work at 2:30 AM. It was bad enough when they asked kind of smart assed how much I had to drink. When I answered nothing he shined a 4 cell mag light in my eyes and told me my eyes were bloodshot and he knew I had been drinking. I am 6'1'' and 280 lbs driving a 1972 C/10 with manual steering and it has the large steering wheel which don't leave a lot of moving around room so I had released my seat belt to get my licenses out of my back pocket to have it ready. He started in about my truck not having proper shoulder belts and then set in to tell me that I had not been wearing my seat belt. I had 2 state troupers and 3 county law men and things were beginning to heat up by this time because the one cop called me a liar and I had had enough. They told me to shut off the engine and get out of the truck and I was not looking forward to getting my head beat on with a stick and that was where this was heading. While I was getting out of the truck a set of headlights pulled up and it was another county cop. He was a Sargent and a friend of mine for about 15 years. He got there just in time to see 3 of his men grab me and push me up against the bed of my truck. He yelled for them to stop what they were doing and asked them what the hell was going on. The one that was giving me a hard time told his version of it and then sarge called me by name and asked me to tell my side. When I got my side told he set in to tell them who, what, and when. He finished up with if Ron tells you that a rooster dips snuff just look under his wing for the box. He told me I could go and I made sure to buckle my lap belt before starting the engine or shutting the door. It took me awhile to get over that night and to this day I have no use for those three cops. I have been checked since with no problems once I show them that it never had shoulder belts but I wait for them to walk up to the truck before I unbuckle.

corn · 11-25-2006, 04:07 AM

Pretty sure 1964 & later vehicles had belts. I was told if your vehicle never had them you dont have to wear them. Not sure about all states...

Longhorn Man · 11-25-2006, 07:51 AM

no state can require you to install belts that were never there, but yes, all 67 - 72 trucks had them.
That washington law needs reworded, a light truck is considered a passenger vehicle, and it states that all 68 and newer is required shoulder harnesses... which is bogus anyways, most of us have had a 68 something or another (mine was a cougar) that never had shoulder harnesses.

Now... if a femail cop ever pulls up beside you, and looks to you and pulls on her seatbelt while mouthing the word S E A T B E L T... what ever you do... do not... I REPEAT... DO NOT point to your lap and continue driving.

Sweet72 · 11-25-2006, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longhorn Man

Now... if a femail cop ever pulls up beside you, and looks to you and pulls on her seatbelt while mouthing the word S E A T B E L T... what ever you do... do not... I REPEAT... DO NOT point to your lap and continue driving.

Too funny Andy!

**Ron 586** · 11-25-2006, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longhorn Man

no state can require you to install belts that were never there, but yes, all 67 - 72 trucks had them.
That washington law needs reworded, a light truck is considered a passenger vehicle, and it states that all 68 and newer is required shoulder harnesses... which is bogus anyways, most of us have had a 68 something or another (mine was a cougar) that never had shoulder harnesses.

Now... if a femail cop ever pulls up beside you, and looks to you and pulls on her seatbelt while mouthing the word S E A T B E L T... what ever you do... do not... I REPEAT... DO NOT point to your lap and continue driving.

If it ticks off a female cop what do you think would happen if you did it to a male cop. Shot maybe?

71Dragtruck · 11-25-2006, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Longhorn Man

Now... if a femail cop ever pulls up beside you, and looks to you and pulls on her seatbelt while mouthing the word S E A T B E L T... what ever you do... do not... I REPEAT... DO NOT point to your lap and continue driving.

Can't see the senerio going any better with a "male" cop.

71Dragtruck · 11-25-2006, 10:10 AM

Looks like I need to type faster.

Can't wait to get pulled over some day with my 5-point race belts, by a cop that knows that they aren't DOT approved only SFI, and NHRA spec mounted, and have him tell me that my factory lap belt is safer and I need them. Here's your ticket have a nice day.

PanelDeland · 11-25-2006, 11:05 AM

LM I knew I had read that story on here somewhere.I just couldn't remember who posted it.

*Shane* · 11-25-2006, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Slammed70

I tried to explain to him that its to old and I wont do it because Im in the process of restoring it back to stock

Thanks,
Mitch

That statement probably had more to do with you getting the ticket than the truck not actually having them. Cops are funny like that and usually don't take NO for an answer very well.

Rokcrln · 11-25-2006, 11:34 AM

I know my 70 2wd blazer, 71 SWB, 67 chevelle and my 64 Nova all came with them. In the Nova I found a owners manual explaining how to use them!

Kevin
LFD Inc.

timcos · 11-25-2006, 11:39 AM

www.ticketslayer.com

**Boog** · 11-25-2006, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shane

That statement probably had more to do with you getting the ticket than the truck not actually having them. Cops are funny like that and usually don't take NO for an answer very well.

I've only been stopped a few times but I have found when I get a cop who has his mind already made up it is often better just to agree with him and go on. I had one once tell me I had to mount my taillamps and license tag higher up on the bed of my truck so he could see them better. Of course I told him they were in the factory location but saw he was set on this. I said ok and went on my way. Never did get around to moving those taillamps, like I really intended to!

Sgt.Booya · 11-25-2006, 02:14 PM

You have to remember that the majority of police officers today, especially after 2008 (when a large group retire) were not even born when are 67-72 trucks were. Most are not into old trucks/cars like we are and have only known vehicles to be equipped with lap/shoulder belts. Therefore if the officer did not see a shoulder belt you could see why he/she might conclude that you didn't have your seat belt on.

The best advice I can offer if you get pulled over is NOT to be confrontational, that gets anyones back up. Explain to the officer that your model of vehicle was only equipped with LAP belts not shoulder belts and that you are wearing all the safety equipment available from the factory. After expalining that and if you really don't want to get a ticket (and project yourself to be a decent guy or gal) .....and this is going to sound crazy to some. Thank the officer for stopping you and that you're glad to see he/she is concerned about traffic safety.

If you still get a ticket...fight it. Afterall, you're right. That's the beauty about your judicial system.

Slammed 70...I don't know your State law but I know in Ontario operating a vehicle without a seatbelt on or the factory equipped seat belts removed (lap or whatever) is illegal.

powell72 · 11-25-2006, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shane

That statement probably had more to do with you getting the ticket than the truck not actually having them. Cops are funny like that and usually don't take NO for an answer very well.

I couldn't agree more, you usually don't have an upper hand when it comes to getting pulled over. Best thing to do is swallow the pride and say yes sir, no sir.

Slammed70 · 11-25-2006, 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 71Dragtruck

Can't wait to get pulled over some day with my 5-point race belts, by a cop that knows that they aren't DOT approved only SFI, and NHRA spec mounted, and have him tell me that my factory lap belt is safer and I need them. Here's your ticket have a nice day.

I had that happen a few years ago....I had a 10pt cage and a 5pt in my old S-10. I originally got pulled over because the cage "obstructs my view" then he went on about how the factory restraint system had been modified and he should impound my truck. I tried to tell him my truck was safer then any vehicle on the road, and I also wanted to know how he found my cage to be "obstructive"

I got 3 tickets that day....126 in a 55, and then two more of them handy fix-it tickets these Kansas cops love to give out.

I was able to fight off the two fix-its by telling them my truck was inspected, insured, and tagged in that condition.

Ive noticed its the younger generation cops that always pull me over for stupid miniscule **** like that. Where as the older cops would just tell me "Your still a young man, with the potential for a bright future....so slow your ass down and stop driving so fast"

Longhorn Man · 11-25-2006, 11:36 PM

The problem with the 4 and 5 point harnesses, and the reason they are illegal on the street, is that they are not DOT approved, and 99.9% of the cops... and state inspectors, don't know how to install them, so they can't verify that YOU know what you are doing.
And, another argument, even though you are safer (if installed properly) in an accident, the added restraint could possibly cause an accident being that your movement (looking over your shoulder for example) might be obstructed.
Of course, what you can do, is leave the stock restraints in, and when some one busts your balls about the wiz bang 5 point harness, take it off, and slip on the stock lap belt.
For your own safety, make sure you have those things installed correctly. If they are not right, they will compress your spine in a collision, making you wish you were dead.

LUV2XCLR8 · 11-26-2006, 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SCOTI

Exactly?

X2

11-25-2006, 02:34 AM	#1
Slammed70 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Cheney, KS Posts: 669	Is that illegal? I got pulled over for not wearing a seatbelt today....and a fix it ticket. Other then the CD player, speakers, auto-column, and my nifty floormats the interior of my truck is completely stock. And there is NO trace of seatbelts being in this truck. I tried to explain to him that its to old and I wont do it because Im in the process of restoring it back to stock(haha). But this asshole still gave me a ticket and I have 30 days before it gets inspected. Anyone know if a 70 truck was for sure a seat belt equipped truck? Or if theres a way to fight it so I dont have to put a seat belt in my truck? Thanks, Mitch

11-25-2006, 02:44 AM	#3
texascowboy593 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Southeast Tx Posts: 1,302	Re: Is that illegal? My 67 GMC and 71 both came with lap belts as well... __________________ "The rays of light thru the Shiner Bock bottle make me wanna turn the key and put down the throttle...and get lost down 35" - Jason Boland www.YouTube.com/user/593Films - Watch My Videos! 1977 Silverado K10 2014 Dodge Durango (Wife-mobile) 2008 Dodge Ram Lone Star Edition (Daily driver)

11-25-2006, 02:53 AM	#4
Litemup Steel Horse Cowboy Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Tacoma, WA Posts: 89	Re: Is that illegal? I'm sure your truck had seatbelts at some point, I'd buy some and put em in. Seatbelts were mandatory after 1968 Last edited by Litemup; 11-25-2006 at 02:55 AM.

11-25-2006, 02:54 AM	#5
Brad Out of the carpool lane. Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Clark Co, WA Posts: 5,673	Re: Is that illegal? It was right around 67 that seatbelts became federally madated so yes, he gave you a legitamate ticket. You don't have any ground to stand on. What's puzzling me is how did he know you weren't wearing your seatbelt??? __________________ 1968 C-10 SWB, 5.7 Vortec/700R4/3.73 posi, Torch Red 1968 Camaro, 250/Powerglide, all original (No, I'm not gonna drop a 350 in it!...Jeez!) 2000 Honda VFR in the faster yellow! 2008 Husqvarna TE-610 1967 C-10 SWB 'Six Appeal'-Gone but not forgotten...

11-25-2006, 03:30 AM	#7
masterbeavis Having issues Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Eldorado Ca, an hour east of sacramento Posts: 696	Re: Is that illegal? Some states don't require a reason to give you a seatbelt ticket, or to pull you over because they cant see you wearing your seatbelt. Used to be in Cali, you had to be pulled over and ticketed for something else for the policeman to give you a ticket for seatbelts. (or at least pull you over for something other than not wearing your seatbelt. They changed the law a while back, now they can pull you over and give you a seatbelt ticket just for that reason. [edit] I bet if you pulled out your seat/lift carpet you would see the holes in the floor where the seatbelt bolts go, unless somebody cut em out. Last edited by masterbeavis; 11-25-2006 at 03:38 AM.

11-25-2006, 03:32 AM	#8
Americanrider Registered User Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NW, WA. Posts: 1,421	Re: Is that illegal? Knowlegde is Power Google up the traffic laws in your state. It should be written on the ticket which law your in violation of. Here is our law for Washington State: RCW 46.37.510 Seat belts and shoulder harnesses. (1) No person may sell any automobile manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1964, nor may any owner cause such vehicle to be registered thereafter under the provisions of chapter 46.12 RCW unless such motor car or automobile is equipped with automobile seat belts installed for use on the front seats thereof which are of a type and installed in a manner conforming to rules adopted by the state patrol. Where registration is for transfer from an out-of-state license, the applicant shall be informed of this section by the issuing agent and has thirty days to comply. The state patrol shall adopt and enforce standards as to what constitutes adequate and safe seat belts and for the fastening and installation of them. Such standards shall not be below those specified as minimum requirements by the Society of Automotive Engineers on June 13, 1963. (2) Every passenger car manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1965, shall be equipped with at least two lap-type safety belt assemblies for use in the front seating positions. (3) Every passenger car manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1968, shall be equipped with a lap-type safety belt assembly for each permanent passenger seating position. This requirement shall not apply to police vehicles. (4) Every passenger car manufactured or assembled after January 1, 1968, shall be equipped with at least two shoulder harness-type safety belt assemblies for use in the front seating positions. (5) The state patrol shall excuse specified types of motor vehicles or seating positions within any motor vehicle from the requirements imposed by subsections (1), (2), and (3) of this section when compliance would be impractical. (6) No person may distribute, have for sale, offer for sale, or sell any safety belt or shoulder harness for use in motor vehicles unless it meets current minimum standards and specifications conforming to rules adopted by the state patrol or the United States department of transportation.

11-25-2006, 04:02 AM	#9
Ron 586 RIP Mr Ron Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Big Sandy, Tn. 38221 Posts: 8,166	Re: Is that illegal? My 72 C/10 only has lap belts. There is a dimple where the shoulder belt mounted on the high end trucks but mine never had them. I have been pulled over and checked and even went through a DUI check point one night when coming home from work at 2:30 AM. It was bad enough when they asked kind of smart assed how much I had to drink. When I answered nothing he shined a 4 cell mag light in my eyes and told me my eyes were bloodshot and he knew I had been drinking. I am 6'1'' and 280 lbs driving a 1972 C/10 with manual steering and it has the large steering wheel which don't leave a lot of moving around room so I had released my seat belt to get my licenses out of my back pocket to have it ready. He started in about my truck not having proper shoulder belts and then set in to tell me that I had not been wearing my seat belt. I had 2 state troupers and 3 county law men and things were beginning to heat up by this time because the one cop called me a liar and I had had enough. They told me to shut off the engine and get out of the truck and I was not looking forward to getting my head beat on with a stick and that was where this was heading. While I was getting out of the truck a set of headlights pulled up and it was another county cop. He was a Sargent and a friend of mine for about 15 years. He got there just in time to see 3 of his men grab me and push me up against the bed of my truck. He yelled for them to stop what they were doing and asked them what the hell was going on. The one that was giving me a hard time told his version of it and then sarge called me by name and asked me to tell my side. When I got my side told he set in to tell them who, what, and when. He finished up with if Ron tells you that a rooster dips snuff just look under his wing for the box. He told me I could go and I made sure to buckle my lap belt before starting the engine or shutting the door. It took me awhile to get over that night and to this day I have no use for those three cops. I have been checked since with no problems once I show them that it never had shoulder belts but I wait for them to walk up to the truck before I unbuckle. __________________ Ron (Mr Round Tuit) Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle TN Message Forum TN Facebook Group SETN Truck Show My Photobucket

11-25-2006, 04:07 AM	#10
corn Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: here Posts: 5,789	Re: Is that illegal? Pretty sure 1964 & later vehicles had belts. I was told if your vehicle never had them you dont have to wear them. Not sure about all states... Last edited by corn; 11-25-2006 at 04:10 AM.

11-25-2006, 07:51 AM	#11
Longhorn Man its all about the +6 inches Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Hilliard Ohio Posts: 2,693	Re: Is that illegal? no state can require you to install belts that were never there, but yes, all 67 - 72 trucks had them. That washington law needs reworded, a light truck is considered a passenger vehicle, and it states that all 68 and newer is required shoulder harnesses... which is bogus anyways, most of us have had a 68 something or another (mine was a cougar) that never had shoulder harnesses. Now... if a femail cop ever pulls up beside you, and looks to you and pulls on her seatbelt while mouthing the word S E A T B E L T... what ever you do... do not... I REPEAT... DO NOT point to your lap and continue driving.

11-25-2006, 10:10 AM	#15
71Dragtruck Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Saskatchewan, Canada Posts: 1,368	Re: Is that illegal? Looks like I need to type faster. Can't wait to get pulled over some day with my 5-point race belts, by a cop that knows that they aren't DOT approved only SFI, and NHRA spec mounted, and have him tell me that my factory lap belt is safer and I need them. Here's your ticket have a nice day. __________________ Speed is just a matter of money, question is how fast can you afford to go? 8.95@148.97mph all motor haven't tried bottle yet Sponsored by: Getz Oilfield Consulting Hard Candy Customs Last edited by 71Dragtruck; 11-25-2006 at 10:19 AM.

11-25-2006, 11:05 AM	#16
PanelDeland I am a Referee of life. Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Greensboro N.C. Posts: 13,993	Re: Is that illegal? LM I knew I had read that story on here somewhere.I just couldn't remember who posted it. __________________ The 47-present Chevrolet and GMC Truck Message Board Network,it's owners,moderators,members,and associates of any type should not be held responsible for my opinion. You can't fix stupid,not even with duct tape. "My appearance is due to the fact that "GOD" does punish you for having too much fun!" Barrett-Jackson has perfected alchemy,they make rust into gold! "You can lead a horse to water but you can't saddle a duck" "Cleverly disguised as a 'Responsible Adult' "Sometimes your Knight in shining armor is just a retard in tinfoil"

11-25-2006, 11:34 AM	#18
Rokcrln Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Winters Ca. 95694 Posts: 4,843	Re: Is that illegal? I know my 70 2wd blazer, 71 SWB, 67 chevelle and my 64 Nova all came with them. In the Nova I found a owners manual explaining how to use them! Kevin LFD Inc. Attached Images

11-25-2006, 11:39 AM	#19
timcos Chief Honcho In Charge Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Bentonville AR Posts: 970	Re: Is that illegal? www.ticketslayer.com __________________ 1992 1500 4x4 Shortbed 1984 Ford F250 Supercab Longbed 6.9L Diesel 1972 K10 Cheyenne Super Fleetside Short Bed - 350 - A/C 1971 VW SuperBeetle 1960 Wife 1984 Son 1986 Son 1989 Son Previous Trucks 1967 C10 SWB (1980-1981) 1971 C10 LWB (1998-2004)

11-25-2006, 02:14 PM	#21
Sgt.Booya Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 75	Re: Is that illegal? You have to remember that the majority of police officers today, especially after 2008 (when a large group retire) were not even born when are 67-72 trucks were. Most are not into old trucks/cars like we are and have only known vehicles to be equipped with lap/shoulder belts. Therefore if the officer did not see a shoulder belt you could see why he/she might conclude that you didn't have your seat belt on. The best advice I can offer if you get pulled over is NOT to be confrontational, that gets anyones back up. Explain to the officer that your model of vehicle was only equipped with LAP belts not shoulder belts and that you are wearing all the safety equipment available from the factory. After expalining that and if you really don't want to get a ticket (and project yourself to be a decent guy or gal) .....and this is going to sound crazy to some. Thank the officer for stopping you and that you're glad to see he/she is concerned about traffic safety. If you still get a ticket...fight it. Afterall, you're right. That's the beauty about your judicial system. Slammed 70...I don't know your State law but I know in Ontario operating a vehicle without a seatbelt on or the factory equipped seat belts removed (lap or whatever) is illegal. __________________ If you keep and open mind you never know what might drop in. 1970 Chev C10 SWB, "250 turbo thrift" Last edited by Sgt.Booya; 11-25-2006 at 02:16 PM.

11-25-2006, 11:36 PM	#24
Longhorn Man its all about the +6 inches Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Hilliard Ohio Posts: 2,693	Re: Is that illegal? The problem with the 4 and 5 point harnesses, and the reason they are illegal on the street, is that they are not DOT approved, and 99.9% of the cops... and state inspectors, don't know how to install them, so they can't verify that YOU know what you are doing. And, another argument, even though you are safer (if installed properly) in an accident, the added restraint could possibly cause an accident being that your movement (looking over your shoulder for example) might be obstructed. Of course, what you can do, is leave the stock restraints in, and when some one busts your balls about the wiz bang 5 point harness, take it off, and slip on the stock lap belt. For your own safety, make sure you have those things installed correctly. If they are not right, they will compress your spine in a collision, making you wish you were dead.



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