03-04-2008, 12:20 AM | #1 |
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Numbers matching?
Ok, I searched previous threads and wasn't able to come up with a clear answer to my question. I recently bought a 67 C10 CST shortbed fleetside that was an old farm truck here in AZ. The truck is completely rust free and seemingly 100% original. According to the build sheet in the glove box, it was pretty well optioned including bucket seats, hub caps, A/C, power steering, wood bed, CST package, push button stereo, HD springs, and the 327/turbo 400 option, the biggest engine available in 67 on a C10.
The truck is completely unmolested, except for one problem...I can't verify that the engine block is numbers matching. I want to return it to prestine stock condition, but want to verify that the engine is the original first. The engine looks completely stock including the old canister oil filter but the spot in front of the passenger side head is blank, no date code or VIN stamping. The canister oil filter leads me to believe that the block hasn't been replaced since it wasn't offered after the early 69 production year. Is there a different location that the blocks were stamped with the VIN number? Last edited by mahanian; 03-04-2008 at 12:22 AM. |
03-04-2008, 12:22 AM | #2 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
What's the casting number on the back of the block (driver side)? Pictures would be nice also.
R
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03-04-2008, 12:26 AM | #3 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
You'll never know for sure, but you can get a good idea, like hartrod says, pictures would be good - the cannister doesn't mean much - someone had put an old 283 in my '67, and it had a cannister.
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03-04-2008, 12:33 AM | #4 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
The blank pad will be a mystery but another good id is after you find that cast block number on the rear block shelf behind the distributor is to try and capture the casting date also on the rear. To be correct it will have to be from 8/66 to about 8/67 cast. You can also check the intake to see if it matched the block date era generally a week but Vet rules allow about 4 weeks difference. You can also id the heads but this is cast between the valves under the valve cover.
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03-04-2008, 01:48 AM | #5 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I didn't think truck engines had the vin # stamped on them like alot of the cars from this era. I think they had the three digit suffix code and the date stamped on the front of the block.
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03-04-2008, 01:54 AM | #6 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
There will be a series of letters, two or three, at the end of the "stamping" that will be significant to specific year, transmission and emission equipment. There are several sources of reference for these codes, but you won't find any VIN contained within the stamping on these engines. It wasn't until '71 or '72 that they had the 17-digit Vehicle I.D. numbers, anyway. On my truck, the two-letter code at the end of the engine ID number says it is a '69 block, and would be correct for my truck. It is, in fact, the original block.
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03-04-2008, 02:02 AM | #7 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
you will NEVER be able to prove without a doubt that your block is the exact block it left the factory with, without the partial VIN stampping on the block. if its not there you can only assume its original from the casting numbers on the block and heasds and the casting dates.
its probobly safe to say there the original parts, but there is always the possibility theve been changed. |
03-04-2008, 02:44 AM | #8 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
Thanks for the feedback. The engine is pretty dirty so I may have to wait till I pull it out of the truck and clean it up to see the casting numbers.
I guess my question now is has anyone seen a 67 C10 with the partial VIN stamped into the block in the location just in front of the passenger side head or was there always something in this spot, even if it didn't include the VIN? |
03-04-2008, 02:50 AM | #9 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
If the block has ever been rebuilt or bored over the is a very good chance that the #'s you are looking for on the pad area have been honed off or ground off during the rebuild process.
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03-04-2008, 02:55 AM | #10 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
The 67-72 trucks never had the VIN or even partial stamped in the pad boss on the front of the engine. The stamping will have engine plant code, the month and day digits of engine assembly and a two or three letter code which is easily looked up in the GM parts book to verify the engine size and things like A.I.R and tranny types that it was assembled with. If the casting date codes and the casting block number are correct and it meant enough to you there is a number of specialty shops that can stamp the correct numbers on that pad. They do it on Vettes Chevelles and Camaros all the time.
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03-04-2008, 03:09 AM | #11 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
I guess my next step is to pull all the casting date codes and numbers to see if everything matches up with the build date of the truck. Then I will check to see if the block has been bored. If it is the original engine I would like to restamp the pad boss, but only if I am convinced it's original and only if it looks legit afterwards. I would like to show the truck when it's finished.
What would I look at on the Turbo 400 to verify it is the orginal tranny? The build sheet documents a turbo 400, but I want to check it as well Last edited by mahanian; 03-04-2008 at 03:10 AM. |
03-04-2008, 03:34 AM | #12 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
I ran all the numbers on my 68 327 when I had it rebuilt a couple of years ago. I was able to confirm that the major engine components were correct for my truck. Everything came up correct except for my water pump.
Get a good chevy casting numbers book and disassemble your engine. I had fun researching my engine. It's also interesting to understand how the chevy small block has changed through the 50 some years it was produced.
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03-04-2008, 03:50 AM | #13 | |
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Re: Numbers matching?
Quote:
Last edited by mahanian; 03-04-2008 at 03:51 AM. |
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03-04-2008, 05:10 AM | #14 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
It's on the passenger side front if it hasn't been ground off, and it looks like the first picture. The second picture is the casting number on the back of the block.
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03-04-2008, 06:00 AM | #15 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
The trans should have a tag on it that indicates the build date and other information. I ran into this when I did my 71 Super- when I took my original trans in to trans guy he said the drum? in the early 400 spun/slipped and were not as strong as later ones- in any case I ended up buying and rebuilding a later one
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03-04-2008, 06:09 AM | #16 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
I just bought a book of casting numbers for 55-93 motors but my intake doesn't match anything in there...now I'm really confused. The casting number on the intake is 3882858
Ok, I googled that casting number and it looks like it's for a 283. Guess the truck is going to be a resto mod now instead of a numbers matching restore Last edited by mahanian; 03-04-2008 at 06:32 AM. |
03-04-2008, 07:43 AM | #17 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
I had a wierd thing on my 67 K20. I went to find the numbers stamped on the front and there were none. I got the truck from my father in law and didin't know if it was original, rebuilt or what so I asked. He said his dad bought it new in 67 and never had anything done to the engine. I never thought about it again until now. I just assumed the factory left that spot blank on that model. Now I will have to do some investigating. I was going to rebuild it then decided against it when I checked the compression. All but 2 cylinders where 150 lbs and the 2 that wern't were 145 lbs. Not bad for an original.
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03-04-2008, 08:27 AM | #18 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
There is no telling with these old trucks. The intake casting number on my truck is supposedly for a 66 Chevelle or Nova II with a 283 (no other vehicles listed), but the date code is 1967.
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03-04-2008, 08:28 AM | #19 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
The only way you can verify that the engine, trans, carb, rear end are all the ones that came with that truck off the production line is via the Protect-o-Plate that came in the warranty pamphlet with the truck. On that Protect-o-plate are the codes from that match those components on your truck. Other than that you will never know 100% that the stuff you have is the original that came with that truck.
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03-04-2008, 09:03 AM | #20 | |
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Re: Numbers matching?
Quote:
s/t
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03-04-2008, 09:15 AM | #21 |
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Re: Numbers matching?
If your engine cast date lines up with your Tag date, assume they belong together and leave it be. There's way too many folks restamping engines and getting lots of things wrong. Then there's people out in the real world who are experts at stamping and can spot a restamp a mile away. The minute a restamp is spotted, it brings up all kinds of questions on the trucks originality and your word and usually runs a buyer off. Most Camaros that are restamped don't get sold as original for this reason. Don't know about Corvettes but I bet they are under more scutiny than camaros. I would bet if the block cast date lines up and the heads and intake id and cast dates line up, you have a pretty good chance that they all belong.
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