A/C Options

[zac]

I had the whole family in my '70 going through brutal Cincinnati rush hour traffic on I-75 yesterday. We were headed towards Dayton on a parts run for my K20 pickup, and the thought occurred to all of us that it would be really nice to have the windows rolled up and air conditioning.

What are the various options here? Retrofitting to an original style system seems like a ton of work and would be expensive, plus I have my doubts about 40-year-old parts and r134. I converted several mid-70's Caddy coupes with iffy results. I have an 80's burb rear unit that could probably be adapted. Would just a rear-unit be enough to really take the edge off the heat? How about an underdash or brand new conversion/retrofit kit? What have you guys come up with? I don't mind spending some money as long as it works. My only conditions are that it can't be monstrously ugly and I want to keep cutting/drilling to a bare minimum. Thanks.

[big blue 72]

i remember where somebody had used a system under the dash from a small car or something, cant remember.
Maybe someone else will chime in. It was a self contained unit.

[48richard]

I just finished putting in an OE-style set-up in my 71 longbed. Yes, it was a lot of work, but except for the Sanden compressor my truck looks as though it came out of the factory that way, and I get 40 - 42 degree air out of the outlets. You can see my thread "installing A/C in a 71" for pics. Total cost was about $1400 using new compressor, evaporator, condenser, heater core, wiring harness and pipes/hoses, with used controller, evaporator and heater boxes, vents and vacuum controlled air valves. Cutting the dash was not hard and you'd have to do that with an aftermarket kit anyway. The extra cutting was the firewall, and that was easy. No problem with R134a - I just had to have one fitting welded.
I was lucky enough to be able to buy a box of leftover parts that had all the little brackets and so on that I needed; otherwise they might have been a pain to find.
As for finding the used parts, this forum was awesome. A week after posting my WTB I had located all the used parts I needed, plus picked up a lot of good advice on the way.
Well worth the $25 fee.

[rsavage]

An aftermarket system like Vintage Air, if you do not care if it looks original, will be easier and cheaper in the long run to install in a non air Burb than will an original system.

[low'n slow]

The big problem with the new kits is the lack of a freah air intake.

[zac]

The more I think about it, the more I assume it would tick me off to not have something that looked original. I think the big upside with a new aftermarket kit is that it would have all new parts, because I know from experience that r134 wants to leak. So can you get all new original-style evaporators, condensors, hoses, pipes, etc? Is it an accumulator-style system? Obviously I have done no research yet.

How about just installing the front part of the system and skipping the rear? Anybody done that, or had their rear a/c disabled? Does it help at all, or do you have to have everything working? I'm guessing with the huge interior volume of a suburban you have to have it all working to make much difference. But at least I would have cold air blowing on my face.

[haulnrat]

I put Classic Auto Air in my '72 burb. I works pretty well but with the big interior I would suggest intalling rear air as well. I plan to add one in the future. Nice thing about Classic Auto Air and some others they offer kits that use the stock controls and vents for the factory look. Also they will all tell you insulation is very important.

We drove ours to Bonneville and back two summers ago and we survived, it was just enough to take off the edge. We are going back this year and I would really like to have the rear installed before we go.

[AzDon]

When you strip away the plastic headliner trim from the rear air in a 73-87 burb, you will find a unit that's configured very similar to the old under-dash aftermarket units from the sixties.
I think a suburban needs dual air because of the amount of glass and cubic feet.
I'm going to install aftermarket air in the front for several reasons.....
First, The aftermarket systems recirculate cabin air only and fit completely within tne cabin including the heater meaning less clutter under the hood. Need fresh air? Thats what the kickpanel vents are for!
Aftermarket units include heat, air and defrost in a fairly compact package. They also incorporate the 1970's era concept of running both heat and air simultaneously during defrost, which defogs the glass by using the a/c to dry the cabin air. I'll probably spend extra to get big capacity, metal construction, and American made if these specs are available. You can use any compressor and dryer system with any evaporator unit meaning you can use era-correct compressor and belt drive system, eighties factory serpentine system (like I'm doing) or aftermarket with Sanden compressor. Vintage Air sells all the parts, fittings and hoses you'll need if you are going to mix and match with stuff you already have but be warned that th restocking charges for leftover parts that makes returning unused parts more expensive than keeping them

[zac]

OK, making some good use of time at work, I have had some time to read through a bunch of stuff and do some searches. Looks like rear unit is something of a problem. Does anybody out there have a functional front and rear a/c they've been using successfully for any length of time with r134? Give us the details.

I am intrigued by some of the stuff I've read about switching to an accumulator-style system. They always worked well on the Caddies. Leaks and seizing compressors were always the problem. That is another issue. The higher temp and pressure always seemed to be too much for the old A6. The Sanden is better? And is it big enough to handle a front AND rear evaporator? So what size condenser are we talking about here? A pretty big one I'll bet, with electric fans. Of course there are big late model trucks that utilize front and rear A/C. I assume they work OK. It would be interesting to pull apart a fairly new burb and see how it works. Maybe some of that stuff could be adapted.

I like the idea of the heat and A/C working for defrost. That would be a nice feature with so much glass. So it looks like the brand new aftermarket kit is the way to go with ???? in the back.

Nice thread and pictures by 48richard. Looks like you really did your homework.

I started collecting some pictures of original components (front, rear, underhood) to help sort this out. I've got a bunch already, if you know of a site or thread with other pics or diagrams please let me know.

Sorry about the long post. You guys got me thinking.

[kev2809]

i know you wanted to keep everything stock, but i really wanted to try robbing a 73-87 ac setup. havent looked a lot into it, but they both have just about the same space.

[zac]

www.ackits.com I used to be on the forum at this site alot a ways back at the height of my old Caddy days. It was very helpful. I'm trying to find my login info. Has anyone dealt with this company before (Arizona Mobile Air)?

[thelonerife]

imo The Vintage Air is the way to go. I Installed it in a truck I just sold and have ordered one for my current pickup project. It will look stock when I get done with factory vents,controls in the dash.It is a non air truck originally. I like the fact that the firewall is cleaner and the motor is easier to get to. As for a burb I think that they may have a rear air kit for that but I'm not sure. Good luck on your cool down.

[zac]

I'm still beating this dead horse. I rode in a BRAND NEW suburban today and it did not have rear a/c. It was in Nashville and was decked out with leather, so I would assume it would have the rear unit if available, especially since it was black. The ceiling in the center above the 2nd seat was dropped for the ducts that feed in from the front. Also, a guy at work said his Tahoe doesn't have rear a/c either. He said it does not cool well, especially in the back. I'm just starting to wonder if running front and rear a/c with r134 and one standard engine driven compressor is a losing cause.

[afreshnewlook]

My 1967 has an aftermarket mounted under the rear seat. It a very large unit. It is really hidden well and does not take away from stock dash look. It has a small switch on dash to control on and off and fan speed. I can send pics if needed. I am not sure if somone made it and mounted it there or if it was a true aftermarket. But as for the stock look it is very well hidden.

Clayton
1967 suburban

[WayneE]

Originally Posted by zac

I'm still beating this dead horse. I rode in a BRAND NEW suburban today and it did not have rear a/c. It was in Nashville and was decked out with leather, so I would assume it would have the rear unit if available, especially since it was black. The ceiling in the center above the 2nd seat was dropped for the ducts that feed in from the front. Also, a guy at work said his Tahoe doesn't have rear a/c either. He said it does not cool well, especially in the back. I'm just starting to wonder if running front and rear a/c with r134 and one standard engine driven compressor is a losing cause.

I had a 2008 Yukon XL Denali and it had rear air.

[zac]

How did it work? Was it similiar to the the '72 system with a separate evaporator and blower motor?

[WayneE]

I honestly don't have a clue. It was under warranty in the short time I owned it (only 7mos).

I had a 2003 Yukon XL Denali and it also had front/rear air.

I'm pretty sure that both had their own blower motors, but I can say with any certainty. My buddy bought my '03 off me, I'll check it out next time I see him.

[Beelzeburb]

I've read about a '72 burb that had been retrofitted with a Vintage Air Mark IV in front and Mark II in the rear. I'd love to know how that worked (1 or 2 compressors, etc...).

[extremesounds13]

I know this thread is a year old but I am curious to what has come of your research? Have you installed anything?