Major Crisis - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

**hotrodmtodd** · 03-03-2011, 02:06 PM

Cliffs Notes: Made a shocking discovery a few minutes ago. Am in the middle of a TH350 to SM465 swap in my 72 K5 4x4 and just realized that NONE of the bosses on my 400 SBC are drilled out for a pivot ball or pivot ball bracket. I am using the old style cast bell housing with no pivot ball on the outside edge. I need to fab some kind of pivot ball bracket but I need some help from anyone who might have run into this before. I am desperate, so ANY help will be greatly appreciated. Two things I wont consider are removing the engine OR tranny. I am doing this job completely by myself, and I just about killed myself putting them in the first time. I need some of my old timer friends on this board to chime in if possible. Using the factory frame bracket and have many SBC, BBC and 6 cylinder z bars in my collection that I can cut weld or adapt, just need a glimmer of hope from somebody to point me in the right direction. Thanks, Mike

1969K10 · 03-03-2011, 02:42 PM

Not much help, but the '68 I've got has a transplanted V8 in it (PO). They bolted on a plate to 2 bosses, and then bolted the pivot ball to the plate. I've not had any problems with it, and been driving it daily for a couple months now.

**special-K** · 03-03-2011, 02:50 PM

Without looking at a block or bellhousing I wonder if there are any threaded mounting points in that area you can mount a plate,then mount the pivot. I have seen a variety of these in a bucket at a guy who parts Chevy truck's place and figured this was not uncommon and the pieces were factory. There seamed to be a few different types. I know I had a '72 K/20 with a SBC400/4spd. Not sure what arrangement was on that.

budman k20 · 03-03-2011, 02:51 PM

Do you have room to drill them out in the truck? Cast iron drills and taps pretty easy? A right angle drill and a stub drill should only need 6 in of room.

**hotrodmtodd** · 03-03-2011, 02:52 PM

Yes, its probably one of the factory bridge plates that came on most small blocks with 4 speeds in trucks. The cars just bolt the pivot ball into the hole in the boss. My problem is this 400 small has NO holes drilled in the bosses like the 350s. Never even gave it a second thought before I started this swap. Most people usually swap autos in to replace manuals so it doesnt matter to them. I just assumed the 400 would have the same holes. WRONG. Thanks for the info though.

GCncsuHD · 03-03-2011, 03:00 PM

Just drill and tap the bosses if they are there in the correct places.

I plan on building a bracket off the frame and a custom Z-bar for the pivot for my clutch when I throw my 5.3 between the framerails. I am keeping the original 3 speed with the LS engine.

**hotrodmtodd** · 03-03-2011, 03:01 PM

Yeah Tim, I am so used to big blocks and sixes that it just never entered my mind. There is not a single drilled hole on the left side of the block. The pads are there, bot no holey moleys. hehe I may have to do what Bud said and try to drill them, but WOW what a mess. At this point, the big block swap would have been easier. Gonna go take a good hard look and see what my options are. Its a shame you cant weld cast iron, I would already be done. Keep those suggestions coming.

*stich626* · 03-03-2011, 03:12 PM

hyd throw out bearing

Dark Knight · 03-03-2011, 06:08 PM

You could get some angle iron and bolt that to the back of the bellhousing where it meets the engine, and then go from there. Make a triangle off the angle or something and screw in a pivot ball. Something like this:

**hotrodmtodd** · 03-03-2011, 07:50 PM

Wow, cool engine drawing there Dark Knight. That would probably work out nice. Well, I spent all afternoon under that thing measuring and feeling around and discovered a head bolt right above the place where the front boss is and directly across from the frame bracket. Took an old piece of Hurst shifter linkage and bent it at a 45, got a 1/4 inch longer head bolt, and bolted it in there, bolted the pivot ball onto it, and used a 6 cylinder Z bar which was the perfect width. It looks like crisis averted. Thanks for all the ideas guys. Always good to have 75,000 friends to brainstorm with. Take care, Mike

**special-K** · 03-03-2011, 08:24 PM

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That was too easy.

Dark Knight · 03-03-2011, 09:27 PM

Why thank you. It's a 454 big block with 10:1 compression, Holley Dominator carb, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap intake, and lots of other goodies. I couldn't draw all of that though.

I seriously had nothing else better to do at the time so I figured, why not? Maybe GM will see this and hire me as a new engine designer. Yeah right! Now I kinda want to try my idea just to see if it'll work...

**LockDoc** · 03-03-2011, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hotrodmtodd

Wow, cool engine drawing there Dark Knight. That would probably work out nice. Well, I spent all afternoon under that thing measuring and feeling around and discovered a head bolt right above the place where the front boss is and directly across from the frame bracket. Took an old piece of Hurst shifter linkage and bent it at a 45, got a 1/4 inch longer head bolt, and bolted it in there, bolted the pivot ball onto it, and used a 6 cylinder Z bar which was the perfect width. It looks like crisis averted. Thanks for all the ideas guys. Always good to have 75,000 friends to brainstorm with. Take care, Mike

I think I would try to run another brace to that bracket. Over time it may crack from flexing. Just a thought.

LockDoc

03-03-2011, 02:06 PM	#1
hotrodmtodd 'Burban Legend Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Mingo Junction OH Posts: 918	Major Crisis Cliffs Notes: Made a shocking discovery a few minutes ago. Am in the middle of a TH350 to SM465 swap in my 72 K5 4x4 and just realized that NONE of the bosses on my 400 SBC are drilled out for a pivot ball or pivot ball bracket. I am using the old style cast bell housing with no pivot ball on the outside edge. I need to fab some kind of pivot ball bracket but I need some help from anyone who might have run into this before. I am desperate, so ANY help will be greatly appreciated. Two things I wont consider are removing the engine OR tranny. I am doing this job completely by myself, and I just about killed myself putting them in the first time. I need some of my old timer friends on this board to chime in if possible. Using the factory frame bracket and have many SBC, BBC and 6 cylinder z bars in my collection that I can cut weld or adapt, just need a glimmer of hope from somebody to point me in the right direction. Thanks, Mike __________________ '67 Chevy Iron City Beer Truck (9ft step) '67 Chevy Panel Truck 467 '68 Short Fleet 305v6 '68 McLaren Ramp Truck '68/'68/'70/'71 Burbs 292/366/402/454 '69 C-30 dump '71 C-50 dump and church bus '71 4x4 454 '72 Blazer (w/pop-up camper) $15 x-hooks '66 Chevy II 194/Weber '68 El Camino" 305v6 '69 Skylark 455 Buick '70 Chevelle 427 '71 Cutlass W-31 '71 GTO 400 2x2 "The 51" Chopped '51 Chevy (409) my first car OK Toad, we'll take 'em all... John Milner

03-03-2011, 02:42 PM	#2
1969K10 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Clarks Hill, Indiana Posts: 733	Re: Major Crisis Not much help, but the '68 I've got has a transplanted V8 in it (PO). They bolted on a plate to 2 bosses, and then bolted the pivot ball to the plate. I've not had any problems with it, and been driving it daily for a couple months now. __________________ 1969 K10 - V8, 465, 205, 12 bolt, D44 2002-current 1969 K20 - V8, 465, 221, Eaton, D44 2012-current Nothin' but drums on all 4 corners! past horses in the stable 72 C10-short step (97-02), 68 C10-long fleet (06-12)

03-03-2011, 02:50 PM	#3
special-K Special Order Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Mt Airy, MD Posts: 85,858	Re: Major Crisis Without looking at a block or bellhousing I wonder if there are any threaded mounting points in that area you can mount a plate,then mount the pivot. I have seen a variety of these in a bucket at a guy who parts Chevy truck's place and figured this was not uncommon and the pieces were factory. There seamed to be a few different types. I know I had a '72 K/20 with a SBC400/4spd. Not sure what arrangement was on that. __________________ "BUILDING A BETTER WAY TO SERVE THE USA"......67/72......"The New Breed" GMC '67 C1500 Wideside Super Custom SWB: 327/M22/3.42 posi.........."The '67" (project) GMC '72 K2500 Wideside Sierra Custom Camper: 350/TH350/4.10 Power-Lok..."The '72" (rolling) Tim "Don't call me a redneck. I'm a rough cut country gentleman" R.I.P. ~ East Side Low Life ~ El Jay ~ 72BLUZ ~ Fasteddie69 ~ Ron586 ~ 67ChevyRedneck ~ Grumpy Old Man ~

03-03-2011, 02:51 PM	#4
budman k20 1972 K20 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Greenfield MN Posts: 360	Re: Major Crisis Do you have room to drill them out in the truck? Cast iron drills and taps pretty easy? A right angle drill and a stub drill should only need 6 in of room.

03-03-2011, 02:52 PM	#5
hotrodmtodd 'Burban Legend Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Mingo Junction OH Posts: 918	Re: Major Crisis Yes, its probably one of the factory bridge plates that came on most small blocks with 4 speeds in trucks. The cars just bolt the pivot ball into the hole in the boss. My problem is this 400 small has NO holes drilled in the bosses like the 350s. Never even gave it a second thought before I started this swap. Most people usually swap autos in to replace manuals so it doesnt matter to them. I just assumed the 400 would have the same holes. WRONG. Thanks for the info though. __________________ '67 Chevy Iron City Beer Truck (9ft step) '67 Chevy Panel Truck 467 '68 Short Fleet 305v6 '68 McLaren Ramp Truck '68/'68/'70/'71 Burbs 292/366/402/454 '69 C-30 dump '71 C-50 dump and church bus '71 4x4 454 '72 Blazer (w/pop-up camper) $15 x-hooks '66 Chevy II 194/Weber '68 El Camino" 305v6 '69 Skylark 455 Buick '70 Chevelle 427 '71 Cutlass W-31 '71 GTO 400 2x2 "The 51" Chopped '51 Chevy (409) my first car OK Toad, we'll take 'em all... John Milner

03-03-2011, 03:00 PM	#6
GCncsuHD Charlie Daniels w/ a Tq Wrench Join Date: May 2009 Location: Statesville, NC Posts: 1,570	Re: Major Crisis Just drill and tap the bosses if they are there in the correct places. I plan on building a bracket off the frame and a custom Z-bar for the pivot for my clutch when I throw my 5.3 between the framerails. I am keeping the original 3 speed with the LS engine. __________________ ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ 67 C10 Shortbed "Great Grandpa's Truck" I6 3 on the Tree 71k original miles 5.3 swap in the works 69 K5 Blazer-Family Beach Cruiser Project 78 K30 Dually Semi-Retired Fire Truck 350/SM465 35"s SOLD01 2500HD ECSB 6.0 4x4 5.13's 8" lift 38"s

03-03-2011, 03:01 PM	#7
hotrodmtodd 'Burban Legend Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Mingo Junction OH Posts: 918	Re: Major Crisis Yeah Tim, I am so used to big blocks and sixes that it just never entered my mind. There is not a single drilled hole on the left side of the block. The pads are there, bot no holey moleys. hehe I may have to do what Bud said and try to drill them, but WOW what a mess. At this point, the big block swap would have been easier. Gonna go take a good hard look and see what my options are. Its a shame you cant weld cast iron, I would already be done. Keep those suggestions coming. __________________ '67 Chevy Iron City Beer Truck (9ft step) '67 Chevy Panel Truck 467 '68 Short Fleet 305v6 '68 McLaren Ramp Truck '68/'68/'70/'71 Burbs 292/366/402/454 '69 C-30 dump '71 C-50 dump and church bus '71 4x4 454 '72 Blazer (w/pop-up camper) $15 x-hooks '66 Chevy II 194/Weber '68 El Camino" 305v6 '69 Skylark 455 Buick '70 Chevelle 427 '71 Cutlass W-31 '71 GTO 400 2x2 "The 51" Chopped '51 Chevy (409) my first car OK Toad, we'll take 'em all... John Milner

03-03-2011, 03:12 PM	#8
stich626 Account Suspended Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: hingham ma Posts: 1,721	Re: Major Crisis hyd throw out bearing

03-03-2011, 06:08 PM	#9
Dark Knight Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pleak, Texas Posts: 420	Re: Major Crisis You could get some angle iron and bolt that to the back of the bellhousing where it meets the engine, and then go from there. Make a triangle off the angle or something and screw in a pivot ball. Something like this: Attached Images __________________ -1967 Chevrolet Fleetside LWB- 350 V8 w/thumpr cam, NV3500, 3.08 gears, A/C, PS -1983 Chevy Silverado C1500- 383 stroker, TH400 -1989 Chevy Silverado K1500 SWB- 5.3L swap, 700R4, 3.42 gears -And a '66 Ford Mustang- 200 I6, C4 trans, rust bucket "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself." -FDR (and maybe rust too) You've gotta be able to stop and steer before you can go fast!

03-03-2011, 07:50 PM	#10
hotrodmtodd 'Burban Legend Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Mingo Junction OH Posts: 918	Re: Major Crisis Wow, cool engine drawing there Dark Knight. That would probably work out nice. Well, I spent all afternoon under that thing measuring and feeling around and discovered a head bolt right above the place where the front boss is and directly across from the frame bracket. Took an old piece of Hurst shifter linkage and bent it at a 45, got a 1/4 inch longer head bolt, and bolted it in there, bolted the pivot ball onto it, and used a 6 cylinder Z bar which was the perfect width. It looks like crisis averted. Thanks for all the ideas guys. Always good to have 75,000 friends to brainstorm with. Take care, Mike __________________ '67 Chevy Iron City Beer Truck (9ft step) '67 Chevy Panel Truck 467 '68 Short Fleet 305v6 '68 McLaren Ramp Truck '68/'68/'70/'71 Burbs 292/366/402/454 '69 C-30 dump '71 C-50 dump and church bus '71 4x4 454 '72 Blazer (w/pop-up camper) $15 x-hooks '66 Chevy II 194/Weber '68 El Camino" 305v6 '69 Skylark 455 Buick '70 Chevelle 427 '71 Cutlass W-31 '71 GTO 400 2x2 "The 51" Chopped '51 Chevy (409) my first car OK Toad, we'll take 'em all... John Milner

03-03-2011, 08:24 PM	#11
special-K Special Order Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Mt Airy, MD Posts: 85,858	Re: Major Crisis NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That was too easy. __________________ "BUILDING A BETTER WAY TO SERVE THE USA"......67/72......"The New Breed" GMC '67 C1500 Wideside Super Custom SWB: 327/M22/3.42 posi.........."The '67" (project) GMC '72 K2500 Wideside Sierra Custom Camper: 350/TH350/4.10 Power-Lok..."The '72" (rolling) Tim "Don't call me a redneck. I'm a rough cut country gentleman" R.I.P. ~ East Side Low Life ~ El Jay ~ 72BLUZ ~ Fasteddie69 ~ Ron586 ~ 67ChevyRedneck ~ Grumpy Old Man ~

03-03-2011, 09:27 PM	#12
Dark Knight Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Pleak, Texas Posts: 420	Re: Major Crisis Why thank you. It's a 454 big block with 10:1 compression, Holley Dominator carb, Edelbrock RPM Air Gap intake, and lots of other goodies. I couldn't draw all of that though. I seriously had nothing else better to do at the time so I figured, why not? Maybe GM will see this and hire me as a new engine designer. Yeah right! Now I kinda want to try my idea just to see if it'll work... __________________ -1967 Chevrolet Fleetside LWB- 350 V8 w/thumpr cam, NV3500, 3.08 gears, A/C, PS -1983 Chevy Silverado C1500- 383 stroker, TH400 -1989 Chevy Silverado K1500 SWB- 5.3L swap, 700R4, 3.42 gears -And a '66 Ford Mustang- 200 I6, C4 trans, rust bucket "The only thing we have to fear is fear itself." -FDR (and maybe rust too) You've gotta be able to stop and steer before you can go fast!



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