1987 1/2 4WD - sometimes wont start

[Lakerjay]

New here so I appreciate all the help.
Normally I may only drive it at most 10 miles a week. It usually will start fine but if I seem to drive it a lot for the day it gradually seems harder to get it to turn over. For example I needed to make a 70 mile trip and at about half way I stopped for gas and when I went to leave it wouldn't start. It sounded like it wanted to turn over but couldn't quite get there. Sat around for about 10 minutes leaving it alone then tried it again and it finally started.
Bad battery? Alternator? Any suggestions?

[bnoon]

It depends on how you describe your hard start issue. Does it crank and crank and crank easily every time? Or does it crank really hard and slow like the starter is having a hard time turning the engine over? Pops and sputters???

[draimondi]

A little more detail and we might be able to help. Could be a multitude of issues. Sometimes the starters on these trucks can get a little warm from exhaust heat (especially if you're running headers) and they'll be difficult to start until the starter cools down a bit. Could also be a timing issue. Does it turn real slow and seem like the starter just doesn't want to turn it over when its hot and when it cools off seems to turn over freely?

[Lakerjay]

I would say it sounds like it cranks hard and slow. It seems to only do this after what I described as more than "usual" use. If I have a lot of little trips but am constantly using it, it will happen also. And I notice that I can feel it gradually getting worse until it wont start.

[Lakerjay]

Also wanted to say that every time if I wait long enough it will eventually start right up.
And I never have the issue on first start of the day.

[Lakerjay]

Does it look like I need to replace starter?

[Auctioneerhere]

How good are your battery connections? Is either cable hot when you try to restart it?

[draimondi]

Originally Posted by Auctioneerhere

How good are your battery connections? Is either cable hot when you try to restart it?

I second this. Check your battery leads(power and ground). I had similar issues many years ago and I swapped my battery leads to a thicker gauge cable and it cured my hard-start issues. Sounds to me like you'll find the culprit somewhere between your battery to your starter.

[Lakerjay]

Sorry if this is a stupid question but I am somewhat of a newbie. How would I check for this? do you just mean are they hot to the touch when I am having the issue?

[draimondi]

Originally Posted by Lakerjay

Sorry if this is a stupid question but I am somewhat of a newbie. How would I check for this? do you just mean are they hot to the touch when I am having the issue?

Yes, if there is too much resistance you'll feel the cables get "hot" when trying to turn it over.

[Lakerjay]

Sounds like I will go in order of checking the cables then the starter.

Draimondi mentioned that the starter could be getting hot from exhaust heat. Does this mean that a new starter wouldn't fix the problem if that is indeed the issue?

[draimondi]

Originally Posted by Lakerjay

Sounds like I will go in order of checking the cables then the starter.

Draimondi mentioned that the starter could be getting hot from exhaust heat. Does this mean that a new starter wouldn't fix the problem if that is indeed the issue?

Are you running headers? Usually the exhaust heat is caused when someone swaps out the the stock exhaust manifolds for headers that end up running real close to the starter, causing excessive heat. They make starter shields for folks running headers or starter blankets to deflect some of the heat.

[draimondi]

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=356195

Here is a thread I just found on the forums here. Some talk about similar issues as you're having. Looks like this guy had his headers running too close to his fuel line causing similar issues. Other folks on there talking about heat issues related to the starter as well.

[geezer#99]

It's just heat soak. Common on chevy starters.
You can change the wires, clean them all, replace the starter or install a heat shield and you'll still have the problem.
Or wire in a remote solenoid and fix it forever.
http://www.maliburacing.com/starter_solenoid.html

[Lakerjay]

Draimondi: I'm not running headers.

So im not sure what to try first. heat shield? battery cables? or as geezer#99 suggested wire in a remote solenoid?

Not sure if this is helpful or not but my exhaust smells pretty strong to me, not sure if this is sign of running rich and if so could it be related?

And just so you know, this is my first time really working on a car. But thought its never to late learn. So forgive me in advance for any rookie questions.

[draimondi]

Originally Posted by Lakerjay

Draimondi: I'm not running headers.

So im not sure what to try first. heat shield? battery cables? or as geezer#99 suggested wire in a remote solenoid?

Not sure if this is helpful or not but my exhaust smells pretty strong to me, not sure if this is sign of running rich and if so could it be related?

And just so you know, this is my first time really working on a car. But thought its never to late learn. So forgive me in advance for any rookie questions.

One thing about owning an older vehicle is that you can't plug it in and have a machine tell you what's wrong. For me it's always been an educated process of elimination when it comes to working on these trucks. I would start by checking things that aren't going to cost you money first. Worst thing you can do is jump to a conclusion as to what the issue is and start throwing new parts at it. I'd check timing first, too far advanced can cause hard-start issues when you get up to operating temp(that's free). You mentioned a rich odor, is your truck carbureted? Are you running an HEI ignition? I'm still leaning towards something between your battery and starter being the culprit. I have however also ran into similar issues with bad HEI coil packs when warm. Again I'd check timing, then go from there, won't cost any money to crank it over and feel a battery cable for heat either. I do agree that heat soak is common on these squares but I wouldn't jump to buy anything until you've checked the other things first. I've owned. And drove and wrenched on many of these trucks over the last 15 years and have ran stock starters with little to no issues once all the other issues were ironed out.

[Lakerjay]

Thanks draimondi. I will check the timing and battery cables first and go from there.

You mentioned a rich odor, is your truck carbureted?

It has the TBI

[draimondi]

Originally Posted by Lakerjay

It has the TBI

I don't have much experience with TBI but I'm confident that this forum has several folks very knowledgable when it comes to tuning these TBI trucks. Keep us updated on your progress fixing this issue.

[Lakerjay]

will do and thanks for the advice. have a Happy Thanksgiving!

[draimondi]

Originally Posted by Lakerjay

will do and thanks for the advice. have a Happy Thanksgiving!

I'm planning on it! Happy Thanksgiving!