Title issues in texas

[73kay]

Hey folks,

I got my 53 3100 inspected today by tx police dep. my truck was a bill of sale only with no motor and I wanted to try and title right instead of using a 49 gmc cab/title I have. I through in a 54 235 with it and officer used that number as the vin. (Texas does that for 55 and older. The vin plate was missing on the cab.

Anyways in his findings he says it's a 54 Chevy truck and a presumably 53 cab. This drive the Waco dmv crazy and they wanted to title it as a 2016 assembled vehicle or a rat rod type. You try and do thinks the legal way. Lol

Called the officer back and he Referred me to a gal who used to work for the dmv and has her own title company. She knows her stuff and for $250 said she would get it titled as a 53 and also include the bond etc. I'm
Starting to lean that way after getting different answers from Austin and Waco.

Before you preach that I should of bought a titled vehicle. This was a parts truck
For me real cheap but I'm pursuing this ave so I don't have a gmc title for a Chevy truck. Lol anyways thought I'd share this with you and see if you have any feedback. At this rate it might be easier to just say it's a 54 but then the common sense goes out the window. I mean if I drop in a crate 350 is it a 2016?

[Boom]

titles are weird, I did a mechanics lean on a vw beetle and the state put the wrong year but the correct vin, pan and body matched. so instead of a 1961 vw I suddenly had a 1960 vw......only people who notice is the people that know anything about the differences. but as far as Texas was concerned it was completely legal and could be titled.
I dont think it would bother me too much if they title it as what ever year they want unless you want to run YOM plates then it will look like you dont know what you have.

[chopit]

Andrew, $250 is pretty standard price for bonded title even here in AR.

The one thing you need to clear up with her and/or state cop IS using engine # for vin # because if and when you swap the motor again it could cause problems.

See if they can do an assigned vin.

Would it really matter if they did it as an assembled vehicle? Its obvious to everyone what it is lol. Might save you from the $250 bond?

Saw a thread on here somewhere where you can buy a blank vin plate to stamp state assigned vin # on.

Just some thoughts on questions you may not have covered.

[1project2many]

Does the title have to say it's a 1954 or '53? What are the restrictions for assembled vehicles? They're not too bad here.

[mr48chev]

Ok is it a 2 piece windshield or a 1 piece curved windshield? There is a definite difference between a 53 and a 54 cab.

That's no to say that years ago some guy swapped door post tags to license the truck one way or the other to match the title he had though.

Then again 250 and no hassles on the title isn't all that bad and what ever time the bond is for goes by pretty fast.

[dwcsr]

Here in Texas if you don't have a title your best off going to a title company and bypassing the DMV until you have all the paper work done. The rules are applied not by statute as they should be but by who ever in the local office has the best memory of the last time they titled an old truck.

Title companies in Texas are usually run by ex DMV personnel and have a better handle on what the rules really are. Some times you get lucky and get passed right through with no issues other times you get the title flagged and its almost impossible to get it done unless you follow what the DMV office tells you to do right or wrong and you may end up with a composite title that needs to conform to a 2016 truck and emissions. Never ever ask the PD to look at it, they are most always wrong.

Not having an original engine number AND no vin tag is an issue here but all you need is any era correct block with a number running or not.

[73kay]

Chopit: ya I want that because I do want the freedom down the road lt
Upgrade the motor, but I guess I can request them
To install vin plate before I change motors. That's like phase 20 lol

Ya I read about classic car titles or assembled vehicle titles but if for some
Reason I had to sell the truck I don't want to have any remorse and if I understood it correctly I would have to get safety inspections to make sure the car was safe and maybe have to do some $$$ improvements.

Mr48chevy: ya it's two windows. I know it's a 53 but I think the folks at the dmv are looking at this very straight and without some common sense. They may have titled trucks by the engine, but that doesn't change the identity of
The vehicle. It looks like a 53 it is a 53. Except with 54 motor. The title company lady was all over it today so I'll get my packet together tomorrow.

Dwcsr: you hit it on the head man. It's crazy. lol but I'll report back what happens. I have another cab with proper docs sitting in reserve but gmc
Title with Chevy sheetmetal isn't my cup of tea and sheetmetal/parts for gmc pricey!

Thanks all for your insights.

[1project2many]

you may end up with a composite title that needs to conform to a 2016 truck and emissions.

That would be enough of a threat for me to find an alternate path!

[918733]

I kinda went through this situation except I had a vin tag, yes 55 and down was titled by the number on the block. When I bought my truck it had a title but no motor the title said it was a 1955 chevy (first series) but I checked the numbers on the title and it came back as a 1965 GMC, from my understanding back then if you changed the motor you could go down to the dmv and for a fee have the title amended to show the numbers on the new motor, but I wanted a title that showed the numbers on the vin tag for future sale of the truck, so I wouldn't have to convince someone later on that's how was done once upon a time. So I filed for a bonded title probly with the same lady refered to in an earlier post and in order to do a bonded title part of the process is having a theft inspection done, and it has to be a complete vehicle or at least the important parts a frame, a cab, and motor or it is considered a parts vehicle, so it can be done and for me it was worth the $250 but I had to tote it 2 hours away from home for the theft inspection

[joedoh]

sorry to hear of your title troubles. most states treat 49 and down differently than 50 and up, I know mine does.

GMC sheetmetal may be pricey but there isnt a lot of people who can tell a GMC from a chevy externally if the front sheetmetal and tailgate are swapped. arent you running a chevy motor too? GMC motors were completely different for a lot of years. you are also buying a $250 bonded title, usually the bond is for 3 years so any plan to sell it will wait that long.

[73kay]

Ya I no plans to sell this puppy. but like mentioned earlier if an emergency happened or something unforeseen and I had to sell it I would want everything to be actual you know like a title for a 53 and a truck that is a 53. Hahah it's ok though I lived in California for 18 years and I'm so so glad I don't have to deal
With the dmv there! At least the folks in Texas try to help hahah.

[iowaboynca]

Originally Posted by 73kay

I lived in California for 18 years and I'm so so glad I don't have to deal With the dmv there!

actually its not that hard here in CA...as long as you have the vin tag You can have a 3rd party inspection done then walk right into DMV easy peasy. That's how I did it.

[73kay]

Originally Posted by iowaboynca

actually its not that hard here in CA...as long as you have the vin tag You can have a 3rd party inspection done then walk right into DMV easy peasy. That's how I did it.

You had me until the "walk into the dmv" part. Everything I went I had to wait a long time and the people working there seemed annoyed by you just being there. Lol

[chopit]

I actually have kind of the same situation with my most recent purchase. Only difference being I have a 53 engine and a split window cab with no vin and year unknown that I could care less what year it is because its split window so 53 is fine with me. Just got off phone with contact at state police and no problem with title to engine block # here on bonded either.

Roughly $250 for bond.

On reselling a vehicle with bonded title I think there is a misconception as I just spoke to my contact at DMV in Little Rock. She said this is the way it works in AR and she would think anywhere else as a bond is a bond:

The bond is just an insurance policy that you buy and stays in your name on record with the DMV against future ownership claims. The title comes back from DMV as a clear regular title. No different than any other title. It is transferable to a buyer from the day it is in your hand.

The bond on the other hand is a separate legal instrument that stays in your name to protect you and any future owner for the 3 years of the bond against claims. If there is a claim, you, not the next owner would be represented and protected in court with the bond and if the claimant were to win the case the bond (which is insurance) would pay out by your insurance company that wrote the bond.

As always check with your own state however insurance works the same nationwide and that is all a bond is. You pay the premium and you are covered. After x years (3 in AR) no claims can be made and bond (insurance) expires.

(I would be curious to here from someone that has bonded in another state as to whether their title actually has the word bonded anywhere on it)

[joedoh]

Originally Posted by 73kay

You had me until the "walk into the dmv" part. Everything I went I had to wait a long time and the people working there seemed annoyed by you just being there. Lol

here they use state troopers for VIN inspections called MVE-1, and they take their job as seriously as new parents. unfortunately, like new parents, they are also very reactionary and frequently wrong, sweeping "because I said so" across anything that could be solved with a little research. Dealing with the troopers is sometimes less enjoyable than a pineapple enema.

Aside from the overzealous troopers, the counter people at the DMV are less likely to help or even know the basis of the rules. 49 and down does not require an MVE-1 and yet every title I take in they say "you need an MVE". I have to calmly and clearly explain and then give them a chance to verify it. I take all the documentation I can get including old shop manuals, most of the time it is about their level of comfort of you as the expert.

I wish I could loan you a time machine so you could go back and get this square BEFORE doing all the work, good luck!

chopit: if you can sell a bonded title then thats news to be and good news to 73kay!

[iowaboynca]

Originally Posted by joedoh

I take all the documentation I can get including old shop manuals, most of the time it is about their level of comfort of you as the expert.

This is it in a nutshell. Do your homework. If your DMV does appointments, do that! (Longest session i've had in the CA DMV w/an appt. is 45min. If you just walk in, you can expect 2-3hrs.) be polite and have everything filled out in advance, should be slick.

Have you ever noticed the girl who probably works at the local dealership go in and process titles...they've got it down!
Not to defend the DMV staff (well I guess I am ), could you imagine dealing with knuckleheads like us, 8 hours a day, day in day out 5 days a week?

Well 73kay, sounds like it won't be so bad after all!

[1project2many]

The bond on the other hand is a separate legal instrument that stays in your name to protect you and any future owner for the 3 years of the bond against claims. If there is a claim, you, not the next owner would be represented and protected in court with the bond and if the claimant were to win the case the bond (which is insurance) would pay out by your insurance company that wrote the bond.

But you are potentially liable for multiple claims. Guy you sold the truck to, guy he sold the truck to, guy that owns one or more parts of truck you titled... How many claims does ins co actually pay and at what point do they say "You've reached max dollar amount with us. Sorry?"

[chopit]

Originally Posted by joedoh

here they use state troopers for VIN inspections called MVE-1, and they take their job as seriously as new parents. unfortunately, like new parents, they are also very reactionary and frequently wrong, sweeping "because I said so" across anything that could be solved with a little research. Dealing with the troopers is sometimes less enjoyable than a pineapple enema.

Aside from the overzealous troopers, the counter people at the DMV are less likely to help or even know the basis of the rules. 49 and down does not require an MVE-1 and yet every title I take in they say "you need an MVE". I have to calmly and clearly explain and then give them a chance to verify it. I take all the documentation I can get including old shop manuals, most of the time it is about their level of comfort of you as the expert.

I wish I could loan you a time machine so you could go back and get this square BEFORE doing all the work, good luck!

chopit: if you can sell a bonded title then thats news to be and good news to 73kay!

I can't agree more on doing your homework first and becoming the expert!!!

(and never volunteer ifo that could pidgeon hole you if you need to change approach lol)

Plus I am damn lucky in my state compared to a lot of states.

We only have 1 trooper that does all the inspections in this area and he is an easy guy to deal with esp. if you've delt with him before, so it make life much easier. PLUS he will even come to your location for a $25 fee instead of having to drag down on a trailer. Last time I wasn't even home. He just looked at the truck called me and said your good, its on file with DMV electronically.
Hope nothing ever happens to him or he retires lol. I don't want to start over with a new guy.

Then, once he has filed, I print the app for bonded title from DMV website and mail it and the bond paperwork directly to Main office in Little Rock where there is also only one person in charge and I have made it a point to get to know and have her direct #. She processes and mails back title.
Everything that the local DMV employees do regarding title issues ends up going to her anyway and I never have to walk into the DMV or deal with somebody different every time that has a different knowledge curve or take on things.

[918733]

The title have have is a plain old everyday Texas title and the period for the bond is 1 year and thats already passed, so I can sleep at night without any worries, I have a buddy who got an assigned title for his truck and he did all the paper work himself so it can be done

[chopit]

Originally Posted by 1project2many

But you are potentially liable for multiple claims. Guy you sold the truck to, guy he sold the truck to, guy that owns one or more parts of truck you titled... How many claims does ins co actually pay and at what point do they say "You've reached max dollar amount with us. Sorry?"

think you misunderstand... it protects against claim by a previous person that claims interest in truck...for instance I have a bonded title(which are technically 2 separate legal instruments, a clear title with a separate bond attached in my name). A past owner holding original title or lien holder looking for the truck contacts DMV and the bond from my title pops up matching the vin. Again the bond is in my name. They would have to sue me for compensation, not a future owner I sold it to. If they did sue me and won it is in a dollar amount decided by the court. The bond pays them. They don't get the truck.

Of course the insurance company as well the DMV has already done their due diligence to make sure to the best of there ability there is no previous potential claimant, lien holder etc. before they are willing to insure with bond or issue title respectively.

BTW the bond is set at potential future value...in my last case $25,000 for an old truck I paid $2000 for.

Any purchasers after me have nothing to do with it, nor would they ever be the claimant or defendent. They bought the truck, they have the clear title, its their truck. My bond is still in place to protect me and them.

In a nutshell the main person at main office at DMV as well as the bond company said yes you can sell, that's what the bond is for.

Or am I misunderstanding what you are saying?

[73kay]

I sent the packet to the title service lady and we'll see how she does. 53 perfect but if its a 54 no big deal at this point. I just don't want to have assembled or any of that crap if I can help it. Plus it's good experience for me so if I have to go through this again later in life I will have some experience. And like I said before I ain't selling it, hahaha so three years will come and go. Last time the truck was registerd was back in 85, so I'm honestly not too worried about somebody coming outta of the woodwork and wanting their truck back. haha

[mr48chev]

[QUOTE=chopit;7472392

On reselling a vehicle with bonded title I think there is a misconception as I just spoke to my contact at DMV in Little Rock. She said this is the way it works in AR and she would think anywhere else as a bond is a bond:

The bond is just an insurance policy that you buy and stays in your name on record with the DMV against future ownership claims. The title comes back from DMV as a clear regular title. No different than any other title. It is transferable to a buyer from the day it is in your hand.

The bond on the other hand is a separate legal instrument that stays in your name to protect you and any future owner for the 3 years of the bond against claims. If there is a claim, you, not the next owner would be represented and protected in court with the bond and if the claimant were to win the case the bond (which is insurance) would pay out by your insurance company that wrote the bond.

As always check with your own state however insurance works the same nationwide and that is all a bond is. You pay the premium and you are covered. After x years (3 in AR) no claims can be made and bond (insurance) expires.

(I would be curious to here from someone that has bonded in another state as to whether their title actually has the word bonded anywhere on it)[/QUOTE]

Good and timely info. I've never seen it happen personally but there is always the off chance that someone will spot what they believe is or actually is "grandpa's old truck" that got sold off or hauled off without the title and they found the old title when they were cleaning out grandpa's stuff.
We've also seen several things in the news and on the net where some person got back the car that was stolen from them years and years ago and now it's a valuable fully restored car or custom pickup.

In this state This is the process you go through and while it seems to be a hassle it isn't that big a deal and if you have legit receipts for individual pieces it isn't that difficult. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/wac/default.a...te=308-56A-210

The state here wants to know just a few things and the primary ones are that the vehicle or major components aren't stolen and that it is safely built or rebuilt. On custom built frames we have to have them either built or signed off on by a certified welder or have a statement of origin from a legit frame shop like Morrisons or Fatmans or another production frame shop. Too many slap together welded up frames on cars in the state caused that a few years ago.

[franken]

Its best not to deal w/ things that have no VIN tags, but I have no experience w/ 53/54 so...
There are 50 states, and titles are issued by states. Every state is different so posts saying my state does whatever are meaningless unless its TX.

I did a TX 66 Chevelle title by researching the process on the internet (TX DMV), getting the forms, filling them out, getting estimates from low buck tote the note lots on value written on business cards, and took that to the tax assessor for a title. They sent me off for a bond. After the bond and back to the assessor, I had a title in progress.

In TX, it took me ~3 hours and some googling so say 4 hours. No one but me actually saw the car in this process.

I could have used a service, but it was an adventure in getting the desired answer from government agencies, which is more art than science.

BTW, after the bond period expires, the bond is meaningless. Bonds have a dollar amount and a time period. You buy a bond for X $ and Y months/years so a bonded title w/ an expired bond is golden.

All of this is Texas and can be verified via the internet. Other states that use bonds are similar. I've been told storage or mechanics leins are easier.

[joedoh]

Originally Posted by mr48chev

On custom built frames we have to have them either built or signed off on by a certified welder or have a statement of origin from a legit frame shop like Morrisons or Fatmans or another production frame shop. Too many slap together welded up frames on cars in the state caused that a few years ago.

try as I might, and I spent an hour reading all the RCW and 49 fed regs for WA on street rods and hot rods and custom vehicles and even kit cars, and I cant find any mention of your statement in the laws. I decided to look because your statement is oddly specific in a way I have never seen a requirement written before. do you have a handy link to it? or is it more a case of like I was talking about, the troopers interpretation being a little sporty...

and WA has a specific reg to allow blue dot taillights! who knew?

[dubds10]

Originally Posted by joedoh

try as I might, and I spent an hour reading all the RCW and 49 fed regs for WA on street rods and hot rods and custom vehicles and even kit cars, and I cant find any mention of your statement in the laws. I decided to look because your statement is oddly specific in a way I have never seen a requirement written before. do you have a handy link to it? or is it more a case of like I was talking about, the troopers interpretation being a little sporty...

and WA has a specific reg to allow blue dot taillights! who knew?

Frame modifications in many areas require a letter with it saying it was completed by a certified welder/shop and or further stress testing etc after having been rebuilt. Not sure if it's in our regs here in BC but it's a known requirement which is good. There are way too many backyard hackjob builders out there ruining solid frames.