1967 shorty or long bed ?

[1971_CST_C10]

so I went out and jumped at this all original 1967 Shorty with great Patina and has all the roughness that goes with the patina so its not painted on.
I checked everything from holes in the floor to make sure buddy seats are original to the truck as well as the frame for any cutdowns and welded in plates which would confirm a long to short conversion even checked the frame ends for straight cuts and they have the original notches and such. she runs great as a 327 M204spd truck. now that a couple of weeks have gone by I got the GM docs from Oshawa Ontario and it shows she was a long bed or long box from birth ??
i thought I checked this out where all the tale tell signs were suppose to be inc vin numbers on frame and by the PS pump. The spidd shows the M20 and the vin but where the model number goes it got rubbed off from almost something being slid accross the spidd heavily so I cant make out the 109 or 107 numbers.
what did I miss ??
other than that she runs like a champ and all the underside was redone from exhaust to springs front and rea to brakes and steering etc.
Thanks for imput
Darren

[xs-cash]

Very cool , jus enjoy it !!

[trac209]

If you can register it do so and don't worry about it unless you paid a crazy amount for a numbers matching truck. Sometimes digging around for serials etc in Canada can land you registration issues

[randy500]

Amazing transformation....somebody had a nice bed and made up a shorty, paint and patina matches all the way around. You had to know it was originally a long bed though from the strategically rubbed of model number on the spid.
I have been making shorties out of long beds and suburbans for 35 years and so have a few others....

[harpo231]

Is the wheel base not on the spid ?

[68bowtie]

Gorgeous truck. Love that color. What exactly is telling you it was a lwb? Any pics of the front and rear of the bed floor and sides, and where the middle stake pockets would have been removed?

[saxart]

Is it possible that someone swapped a short box and matching cab on a cut down long frame for some reason?

I'm a crappy welder, but with enough time (and grinding disks) I could even weld the frame so you couldn't tell once it was painted. Food for thought...

[clay68c10]

That's a damn nice truck, I'd just run it and not worry about it. You and the person that shortened it are the only ones that really know.



And us... but most of us don't care.

[clay68c10]

Welding wise, you could section in the vin portions into a short frame too.

Lots of things are possible if you are creative and have the right tools.

[randy500]

No way the bed was shortened, some one had a nice bed that color and found a long bed truck that was worthy of matching the bed with

[ho70]

Just bought a Cdn 68 with same thing. Glove box door was missing. Short box is not in VIN for Cdn 67's. The model number it is so it rubbed off is a tell tale sign someone wanted it 'rubbed off' for a reason. Someone just put a short frame on a long truck with a short bed. Hey, short box, small back window, 4 spd, 327 and buddy buckets, what's not to like?

[special-K]

Official documents sttaing it was built as a lwb combined with the correct serial# on what appears to be an unaltered swb frame is the stumper to focus on, as the Op already knows. So that's where we'd have to look at the possible changes.

1- Maybe the guy paid GM to falsify the record... I agree, far fetched wildass guess

2- Frame was shortened so well it can't be detected... Could be.

3- VIN was sectioned in... Very possible

4- Front end clipped...Also possible but harder to hide. Same as #2

5- You need to get your eyes checked? just kidding

6- That truck is so nice this is actually a dream.

Anyone have a better 5 or 6 or 7, 8, 9, or 10?

[tutone]

Who cares. That's a perfectly good truck. I would dig the 4 speed. I guess its just an opinion, but way too many folks focus on altered wheelbases on these things. From what you have told us, you aren't as upset over the alteration as you are the misrepresentation. It does sound a little fishy, and perhaps if you ever have to sell, you would be more honest with a buyer. That could cost you gobs, since these same folks I mentioned earlier don't like wheelbase alteration. On the bright side, yours seems to have been done the best way possible, with a short frame and a factory short bed. The ONLY thing about your truck that is out of sorts, is now the paper work. I could live with that.

[67ChevyRedneck]

Post a pic of the SPID. It's odd the firewall markings are gone on a truck so clean and original.

One more place you can look is the rear of the frame. Mine was upside down on the rear crossmember and clearly shows "CS10704" That alone proves factory workers are people and make mistakes. There's no such thing as an 07 body nor an 04 wheelbase, so it was clearly swapped and should have read CS10407 which reads stepside shortbed which my original frame and paint (when I got the truck) clearly indicate.

You probably already know, but yours should read CE13407.

You have one hell of an awesome looking truck. It's fun to find out the history (I was excited when I found the build sheet in my mustang behind the dash) but I wouldn't let that affect my enjoyment of the truck.

Your pics are kinda small, but the paint looks original, with maybe a lower fender cup repair and someone tried to blend the "primer" color? That's the only part of the paint that looks off.

[special-K]

I don't see anyone hung up on it being shortened. You hit the nail on the head on the misrepresentation. Might be easy for others to say who cares, but misrepresentation would burn their arses if it happened to them. And it does actually matter if a truck is the real deal alot to many would be future buyers. This isn't a truck that screams every nut and bolt altered, it says it's original with a few tasteful enhancements...and just what people are looking for, in original form. The whole deal with patina is all about being an original/unrestored survivor. Fake patina is BS that can never stack up to that. I'll never ask anyone how much they paid for a truck, but we all can have a pretty good idea just how cheap it wasn't.

[Canuckvetter]

I know the truck well. I watched the build from ground up. Rockers and cab corners replaced. True short box frame, though 71 I think. Tail gate is original. The guy who applied the patina here in Edmonton does over the top work. Box is almost too perfect. No dents or scratches. Beautiful truck. Fast with that 68 327 with old school camel hump heads. The M20 in that truck is a Muncie 4 speed out of a car.
My pics of the truck are shots when the truck was first running. I sold him the 8" Blazer rims. The builder bought back the wheels and caps for his next build. A true 503 green short box step side.
The builder built the truck for his personal driver. He sold it when a guy buying a short box frame off him just had to have the truck.

Truck is a real head turner where ever it goes. Enjoy the cruises.


http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/a...1&d=1504447261

[tutone]

Originally Posted by special-K

I don't see anyone hung up on it being shortened. You hit the nail on the head on the misrepresentation. Might be easy for others to say who cares, but misrepresentation would burn their arses if it happened to them. And it does actually matter if a truck is the real deal alot to many would be future buyers. This isn't a truck that screams every nut and bolt altered, it says it's original with a few tasteful enhancements...and just what people are looking for, in original form. The whole deal with patina is all about being an original/unrestored survivor. Fake patina is BS that can never stack up to that. I'll never ask anyone how much they paid for a truck, but we all can have a pretty good idea just how cheap it wasn't.

Exactly... In less than two weeks , we have two cases of misrepresentation. Puscifier in his thread " To buy or not to buy" and this one. Even saw it mentioned in another about one on Ebay. Mine is shortened , you can tell it and I am fine with it, Heck I am fine with buying a shortened truck as long as it is safe. To the OP's problem, though, he wanted to buy or at least thought he was buying a survivor. Soon it will be like the muscle car market where every thing is an SS or GT or whatever. People will go to great lengths to pass of an unoriginal truck as a factory job for the sake of a few extra bucks. I still love the truck. Good luck to you straightening everything out.

[jocko]

Originally Posted by Canuckvetter

I know the truck well. I watched the build from ground up. Rockers and cab corners replaced. True short box frame, though 71 I think. Tail gate is original. The guy who applied the patina here in Edmonton does over the top work. Box is almost too perfect. No dents or scratches. Beautiful truck. Fast with that 68 327 with old school camel hump heads. The M20 in that truck is a Muncie 4 speed out of a car.
My pics of the truck are shots when the truck was first running. I sold him the 8" Blazer rims. The builder bought back the wheels and caps for his next build. A true 503 green short box step side.
The builder built the truck for his personal driver. He sold it when a guy buying a short box frame off him just had to have the truck.
Truck is a real head turner where ever it goes. Enjoy the cruises.

Interesting Canuck. Nice to finally know the ground truth. So, when you say the builder does great work - is it a replacement actual/original shortbed bed that was patina'ed to match the rest of the truck and bolted to a 71 swb frame or is that the original long bed that has been masterfully cut down, and then the patina re-mastered to cover the welds? Yes, I agree, whatever the case, incredible work.

Darren - would truly love to actually lay eyes on this SPID. I've never seen an M20 on a truck SPID, interesting. Does the truck have front disk brakes (i.e. stock 71)? I'm not clear on whether you found the frame VIN or not - did you? Am assuming only a partial of the serial # if you did, was it a match? (sorry if I missed it if you already stated that in the thread). This is truly one of those Magnum P.I. cases, appreciated you sharing.

Most importantly, how did the seller actually describe the truck? If you were checking all these things, surely it was discussed? Personally, if it was presented as a true swb truck - I WOULD be pissed. Yes it's extremely well done and will always be a cool truck. But, posts that highlight only that fact somewhat miss the the issue - the issue is whether or not you overpaid if this was mis-represented. Having said all that - if you'd have paid the same price you paid for it knowing what you know now, would you still have bought the truck? If the answer is yes, then all this is just history digging, which is still fun - but the truck is definitely very cool, if you're good with what you paid, I think you can just enjoy it now that you know all the history.

EDIT: Oh, and one more thing, that is one very cool looking garage you're keepin that truck warm in.

[leddzepp]

If the frame isn't cut and the bed isn't cut, it's a true swb truck. If you need a spid to feel good about it board member chipflyer can make you one. It's a great looking old truck, drive it and enjoy it

[Coley]

...wish I had the bodywork/welding skills to pull off that kind of a conversion....the guy that did it definitely knows what he is doing.
Regardless...you have what you have....a really nice 327/shorty...enjoy it, drive it...forget the history, its just a bunch of paperwork.

All good & Nice Truck!
Coley

[special-K]

I still wonder how it has the LWB VIN on the SWB frame. Otherwise, I was thinking the bed looked in the pictures like fake patina...except inside. My so called '67 GMC SWB BBW project is a totally built from parts of various years truck that will appear to be a '67...at first. The frame is '71 SWB, cab is '72. IF I ever sell it (IF I ever get it built!) I will be right up front on what it really is. What it really is is a SWB 67-72 Chevy/GMC. Funny, too, because I have a hot little '68 327/M22 to motivate it. I like everything about this Dark Turquoise '67 SWB. I see a very tastefully done custom.

[ho70]

What am I missing? It is a true short box frame so it was not shortened. A trans from a car was added and the rest are true parts for what they are, a cab, an original shortbed bed and a 327. The builder put it together like lego, one piece at a time and did the paint to look like 'patina'. Nice truck. Us Canadians do good work ehh

[jocko]

a "true" shortbed would have been born with a 7 in the model number and born with 115 wb on the SPID - whether that kind of originality matters to thread posters (myself included) is irrelevant, what matters is whether or not it matters to the OP (it seems to) and how the truck was presented to him - i.e. truthfully or not. So, for all the folks saying it's 'now' a true shortbed so enjoy it and get over it, let me ask this - how would you be feeling right now if you personally saved up your hard earned cash for an ORIGINAL, by birth, shortbed (because it mattered to you, the buyer - as it seems to have mattered to the OP), bought it, and found out the seller may have intentionally withheld info (and I still don't know that is the case in this case, interested to hear how the discussion went while the inspection was actually taking place in person - did it even come up)? Would you just be telling yourself, ah, it doesn't matter? I don't think so. I completely understand the perspective - believe me, yes, these are "just" trucks and a built short bed is every bit as awesome as an original one - BUT, in today's market, true originality commands the highest selling prices. So, if the OP bought it with the actual historical knowledge he now has, he wouldn't be asking these questions - it sounds like it was not disclosed. And if the price was higher because of the originality perception, then that's a big party foul on the seller's part. Yes, buyer beware in all cases - we all live and die by that little quip. But sounds like the OP did all he could to confirm in person and still got told it was an original shortbed. Bottom line, if the model #, SPID wb, etc - i.e. any supporting paperwork - are not legible or they're ALL missing, then there is no way to confirm original swb birth without a build sheet - this truck proves that it's all guesswork beyond that - and the selling price should not be the same as one presented as an original, the paper matters. Even cowl grease pencil marks can be fudged.

Yes, this all sucks, I WISH the truck world had not evolved to become the 1st Gen Camaro world, but let's face it, it has. If you buy a conversion, frame swap, cab swap, homebuilt, or anything like that knowingly - that's great, the "just enjoy it" approach absolutely applies. If you buy an original at today's price for an "original" and find out it's not, then that does kinda stink - whether it's the buyer's or seller's fault doesn't matter much at that point, it just sucks - but it would piss me right off to find out that the seller may have scammed me. (Again, I DON'T know if that happened in this case - the BUILDER did a great job - sounds like the BUILDER was not the SELLER in this case, it's been flipped a bit as the builder kept the white wheels when it sold). Anyway, as much as I hate to say it and hate to be the voice of dissent, prices are affected by originality - and in today's market it matters. That doesn't mean at all that a swb frame swap is less of a cool truck - not at all, it's the price differential between that and an original swb truck that matters when buying today. I believe the OP is looking for ground truth and not a "it's cool anyway" or "it's an original anyway" to make him feel better. It sounds to me like the originality mattered to him. It IS a very cool truck - there's no dispute. But if he spent $XXXX MORE than he would have spent on a known frame swap truck BECAUSE he thought it was original, then he's probably not very happy after reading Canuckvetter's very helpful post. Again, responsibility is the buyer's as always, and some sellers simply DON'T know the lineage of what they are selling, which is fine too - but if a seller misleads, then that gets to me. Again, that may not be the case here - won't know until we hear more for the OP.

[leddzepp]

True originality doesn't command the highest prices though...although some people think it should. There have been many trucks posted up here that sold at auction for big money for "looking" original. One swb super that sold at mecum even had a suburban vin tag

[1971_CST_C10]

Hi Guys, here is the Spid to show the info inc the M20 option. Even if it's not the original M20 but is one out of a 68 camaro then thats good enough for me at least its an M20.
The guy that sold it to me is a great guy and never stated it was a real shorty, just here is what she is and this is whats for sale. I bought it to have a patina'd truck in a shorty and the bonus is that its an M20 truck. Shifts so nice and easy and the 327 has some pep to her. I have no complaints really as it was not sold to me as a true shorty and I thought I had looked enough to see. It's all good and I will enjoy the heck out of it, love the buddy seats as well. yes the short bed is in excellent shape, would like to find an original white rear bumper especially for a 67 as it wrapped around the rear box a bit. somewhere along the way it now has a chrome one from like a 71/72 which is a straight cut bumper and looks out of place but a great bumper.
Darren