Help-Hood problems

[Kim57]

This ism on my 57
I posted earlier about the trouble trying to make my hood tilt forward and the rear corners rubbing when opening so i was going back to the stock hinges.
Well I bought some repopped hinges and installed them.
As my original mounts were gone from the fire wall I mounted them to my hood and put the hood on the truck and marked where the bolts needed to go.
Got everything installed nice gaps all around and when I open the hood it goes back and the back edge hits the cowl before coming up.
I did have to add about a 1/4" to the rear of the hood to make all the gaps nice when it was even with the front fenders.
It doesn't matter how much I adjust the hood in any direction I can't stop it from hitting the cowl.
I am about as frustrated as I have ever been on this truck right now.
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Sorry for the long post.
Kim

[MARTINSR]

You added to the length of the hood? That's without a doubt going to be the issue. Why did you do that?

Brian

[dsraven]

have you tried moving the hinges up on the firewall? sounds like the hinge pivot point is off compared to stock. curious if that would fix it except the hood would be too high.
first, do the doors fit the openings on the rear edge? did you have to add to the rear edge of the doors?
next do the fenders fit the doors on their rear edge? did you have to add there?
just trying to figure out why the hood needed extra length. it could be a few small things that add up. if the fenders ended up too far forward due to additions in other places behind them, then that would explain why the hood needed extra length. do you still have the stock hinges for a test to see if the new hinges are outta whack? know anybody nearby who could lend you a set, or maybe a hood just for test fitting?

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

You added to the length of the hood? That's without a doubt going to be the issue. Why did you do that?

Brian

Had to add to the rear of the hood because when I lined it up to the front of the fenders I had a huge gap. Had the fenders as far back as they would go to line up with the cab.
I'm thinking the addition is my problem just trying to figure out what to do to fix it without starting from scratch.

Originally Posted by dsraven

have you tried moving the hinges up on the firewall? sounds like the hinge pivot point is off compared to stock. curious if that would fix it except the hood would be too high.
first, do the doors fit the openings on the rear edge? did you have to add to the rear edge of the doors?
next do the fenders fit the doors on their rear edge? did you have to add there?
just trying to figure out why the hood needed extra length. it could be a few small things that add up. if the fenders ended up too far forward due to additions in other places behind them, then that would explain why the hood needed extra length. do you still have the stock hinges for a test to see if the new hinges are outta whack? know anybody nearby who could lend you a set, or maybe a hood just for test fitting?

I'm thinking the pivot point is the problem.
Got everything else lined up good. Lined the fenders up with the cab and everything else needed adjustment to fit.
Don't have the old hinges and don't know anyone with originals.
Thanks for the help guys.
Kim

[bowt1ed]

Shim between upper hinge bolt and firewall. This will push and rotate the pivot point.

Cheers, Jim

[dsraven]

kim, could you go back to the tilting hood idea? beef up the mechanism or engineer it so it lands the same every time without rubbing? just wondering because the hood fits everything properly when it is closed, right?

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by dsraven

kim, could you go back to the tilting hood idea? beef up the mechanism or engineer it so it lands the same every time without rubbing? just wondering because the hood fits everything properly when it is closed, right?

This is one option I'm considering.
If I can eliminate the rubbing on the back corners when opening I will do it.
I have a couple ideas I'm working on that I hope will work.
Still have all the work I've done so no problem trying to get it to work.
Kim

[MARTINSR]

Ok, I know nothing about your build, but I will tell you, from my experience, the lengthening of the hood is the whole issue. First off, the pivot angle didn't change. The distance from the hinge pivot point to the rear of the hood is what changed.

You "fixed" the wrong thing, you "fixed" the correct part and what was making the hood gap too large was left unfixed. Why was the gap large, it wasn't large from the factory, what changed that? What ever changed it is what SHOULD HAVE been corrected. I am thinking the rad support was modified or the mounting of the rad support was modified dropping the front of the fenders down, which brought the back of the hood forward.

THAT is what needs to be corrected, you modified the hood and that is the problem.

Brian

[dsraven]

how about some teflon rubbing blocks that keep the hood edges pulled in at the rear until clear of the cowl? some sort of T shaped affair on the hood that fits into a U shaped receptacle and when the hood is pulled forward it automatically slides free of the U. teflon is easily routered with a wood bit, or maybe a hood latch that latches as the hood is slid back instead of hinging down. I assume the hood slides back as it closes but the front of the hood remains up a bit, then when the hood is all the way back the front part slams down into the latch? what it the hood simply lays flat all the way back and latches horizontally? would that keep the hood from rubbing if it didn't hinge up at the front to clear the latch?
have you ever seen a car, like a '90's pontiac grand am, that had the seat belt attached to the door frame? on the top of the door and in the jamb there is that T bolt and bracket idea that meshes to keep those 2 parts intact should they be required in an accident. maybe something like that, with stock GM parts, could be used at the rear of your hood while using the tilt mechanism you already have. less time fabbing something up that way, if it doesn't work it was cheap to try. if it does work then you win.
anyway, just a few thoughts.

[capnduane]

I have a spare original '55 hood and a set of hinges, if you need to borrow or get measurments. I'm in Moreno Valley

[MARTINSR]

I want to elaborate on what I said a bit. The pivot angle off the hinge has stayed the same. The distance the hood raise or drops as it goes up at the cowl stayed the same while the length of the hood is further back. THUS the distance at the tip raises or drops differently, and it's now hitting.

I don't believe there is a thing you can do outside of making the hood tilt forward, or starting over and correcting the original problem and shortening the hood back to stock length.

Brian

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by dsraven

how about some teflon rubbing blocks that keep the hood edges pulled in at the rear until clear of the cowl? some sort of T shaped affair on the hood that fits into a U shaped receptacle and when the hood is pulled forward it automatically slides free of the U. teflon is easily routered with a wood bit, or maybe a hood latch that latches as the hood is slid back instead of hinging down. I assume the hood slides back as it closes but the front of the hood remains up a bit, then when the hood is all the way back the front part slams down into the latch? what it the hood simply lays flat all the way back and latches horizontally? would that keep the hood from rubbing if it didn't hinge up at the front to clear the latch?
have you ever seen a car, like a '90's pontiac grand am, that had the seat belt attached to the door frame? on the top of the door and in the jamb there is that T bolt and bracket idea that meshes to keep those 2 parts intact should they be required in an accident. maybe something like that, with stock GM parts, could be used at the rear of your hood while using the tilt mechanism you already have. less time fabbing something up that way, if it doesn't work it was cheap to try. if it does work then you win.
anyway, just a few thoughts.

I've seen one tilt hood with an aftermarket kit and it had rubbing blocks to keep it from scratching the paint. The problem is the shape has the wider rear of the hood going into the narrower fender area.
I've got an idea to keep the hood from dropping in the rear when I raise the front. Just working out some minor details on it now.
I will update this thread if i get it to work.
Kim

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by capnduane

I have a spare original '55 hood and a set of hinges, if you need to borrow or get measurments. I'm in Moreno Valley

Thanks for the offer.
Kim

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

Ok, I know nothing about your build, but I will tell you, from my experience, the lengthening of the hood is the whole issue. First off, the pivot angle didn't change. The distance from the hinge pivot point to the rear of the hood is what changed.

You "fixed" the wrong thing, you "fixed" the correct part and what was making the hood gap too large was left unfixed. Why was the gap large, it wasn't large from the factory, what changed that? What ever changed it is what SHOULD HAVE been corrected. I am thinking the rad support was modified or the mounting of the rad support was modified dropping the front of the fenders down, which brought the back of the hood forward.

THAT is what needs to be corrected, you modified the hood and that is the problem.

Brian

Rad support hasn't been modified and the fenders were mounted so the body lines match what is on the doors going straight and not angled down.
The hood has been sectioned at the front but I made sure the rear ws where it was supposed to be.
Did it with the hood mounted and tack welded to the fenders.
I know I did something wrong just not sure what.

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

I want to elaborate on what I said a bit. The pivot angle off the hinge has stayed the same. The distance the hood raise or drops as it goes up at the cowl stayed the same while the length of the hood is further back. THUS the distance at the tip raises or drops differently, and it's now hitting.

I don't believe there is a thing you can do outside of making the hood tilt forward, or starting over and correcting the original problem and shortening the hood back to stock length.

Brian

You may be right about starting over. Going to do everything I can to avoid that.
I wouldn't think a 1/4" would make that much difference as there is more adjustment in the hinges than that.
Thanks for your input.
Kim

[Kim57]

35 inches from firewall to core support, but I have a 1/8 piece of aluminum covering the firewall but still use the original mounting spots, so it might be
35 1/8". Also measured 2 1/4 inch from the flat edge of the ledge molding where the cab welds to the firewall (?) to the top mounting bolt. I'm using billet hinges so that measurement is a little iffy.

Got this from another thread I started just to check mine.
My core support is 35 1/8 inches so I don't have a clue as to why my hood was short.
Maybe I was just too anal about the gaps and lining up in the front and shot myself in the foot creating more work than I needed.
Kim

[dsraven]

hey Kim, just keep plugging away at it, you'll figure it out. we've all seen your work. nothing sub par yet.

[MARTINSR]

Originally Posted by Kim57

Rad support hasn't been modified and the fenders were mounted so the body lines match what is on the doors going straight and not angled down.
The hood has been sectioned at the front but I made sure the rear ws where it was supposed to be.
Did it with the hood mounted and tack welded to the fenders.
I know I did something wrong just not sure what.


You may be right about starting over. Going to do everything I can to avoid that.
I wouldn't think a 1/4" would make that much difference as there is more adjustment in the hinges than that.
Thanks for your input.
Kim

AHHHHHH, Sectioning the front of the hood did EXACTLY the same thing as lowering the rad support! LOL Your hood being sectioned at the front in effect "closed" the hood further down! It is rotating the hinges forward EXACTLY as if the rad support were mounted lower.

That being said, think about cutting the hood reinforcement from the hood where the hinges mount and rotating it back up where it belongs. I am thinking this will put the pivot angles back to where they should be. I would personally simply put them right back to where they were, tack welding them in place and see how it works. But if you were to simply drill and put a nut a back where it was to bolt the hinge arm, that could work too, but I am thinking you would be gambling on if you are moving them both the correct amount as they would move different amounts. Now mind you, I am a body dude who cuts and welds chit together to figure out the math needed to move those two would be for someone a hell of a lot smarter than me. Thus, my advice to cut the piece out that includes both mounting points and rotate it so it is exactly as it was before you sectioned the hood.

Brian

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by MARTINSR

AHHHHHH, Sectioning the front of the hood did EXACTLY the same thing as lowering the rad support! LOL Your hood being sectioned at the front in effect "closed" the hood further down! It is rotating the hinges forward EXACTLY as if the rad support were mounted lower.

That being said, think about cutting the hood reinforcement from the hood where the hinges mount and rotating it back up where it belongs. I am thinking this will put the pivot angles back to where they should be. I would personally simply put them right back to where they were, tack welding them in place and see how it works. But if you were to simply drill and put a nut a back where it was to bolt the hinge arm, that could work too, but I am thinking you would be gambling on if you are moving them both the correct amount as they would move different amounts. Now mind you, I am a body dude who cuts and welds chit together to figure out the math needed to move those two would be for someone a hell of a lot smarter than me. Thus, my advice to cut the piece out that includes both mounting points and rotate it so it is exactly as it was before you sectioned the hood.

Brian

This may be my problem.
I didn't even think about the change in the angle of the mounting holes for the hinge on the hood.
The font hole is going to be slightly lower than the rear, not much but maybe enough to cause the problem.
Kim

[Kim57]

A little up date for those interested.
Worked for a few hours shimming the hood all kinds of ways and nothing worked to keep it from rubbing. When I got nice gaps the hood would always drop at the rear and then go back slightly before going up and rub. It is a very slight rub but a real problem.
I did find that if a put something at the corners so it doesn't drop the hood goes up without going back and no rub. Actually keeps a nice gap as far as I can tell by myself.
SpeedBumAuto has the Eddie Motor Sport billet hinges and says they look to go up without dropping when opening. Will have to give those some thought.
I will say the hood is a pain to put on and off alone.
Kim

[MARTINSR]

I am not big on the reverse opening hoods, but that would solve your problem, done deal.

Brian

[Stepside Jim]

Kim, if it helps any, I bought aftermarket hood hinges. I still have them in the boxes.

Why in the boxes?? The old originals looked ok, the pivots were a little worn, figured I get new ones, done deal.

I installed them, I think they were the counter part brand, I 'd have to check, anyway, as you found, mine also dropped before raising, just enough to touch the paint.

I cleaned the old originals, bolted them in, and still working fine.

Your not the only one with this issue, find some originals.

[Kim57]

Originally Posted by Stepside Jim

Kim, if it helps any, I bought aftermarket hood hinges. I still have them in the boxes.

Why in the boxes?? The old originals looked ok, the pivots were a little worn, figured I get new ones, done deal.

I installed them, I think they were the counter part brand, I 'd have to check, anyway, as you found, mine also dropped before raising, just enough to touch the paint.

I cleaned the old originals, bolted them in, and still working fine.

Your not the only one with this issue, find some originals.

I was thinking the re-pops may be a little thinner material and flex some or just off in the design slightly and causing the problem.
I modified the mounting holes trying to get them to work so they're mine to keep.
I will get them to work with a tab hidden on the fender in each corner or I may just bite the bullet and buy the billet ones.
Kim

[Kim57]

Well I got it figured out. Did a bunch of googling and decided to lube the hinges.
Feel pretty silly for not doing it in the beginning.
Was afraid to because other threads said the hoods wouldn't stay open.
Well it seems the hinges bind real bad and the lube helps them a lot.
Wish the counter guy knew that info when I discussed their operation and bought them. Would have saved me a big headache.
Hood goes up without going back and hitting my cowl now.
It does stay up but will come down pretty fast when closing so have to be careful when under it.
Will have to consider the billet hinges as they have ball bearings instead of a friction fit of metal against metal.
At least now I can move on to finishing the body work on it.
Thanks for all the help guys.
Kim

[dsraven]

thats awesome. good to hear. maybe some billet down the road but for now it works. now, on to body work.....yippee.

[MARTINSR]

WOW, damn I hope you didn't listen to me and work a bunch before you figured it out!

Brian