1947 Panel Truck Frame swap with ’88 k2500

[Second Series]

Thanks Old57, I saw the pedal in your build and thought it looked beefier than other options, and at a good price.
I brought the Beast home last week, placed in a tent and began checking things out.
I moved the boxes of old parts out and started surveying things. I’ll make a list of what and when to do.
I finally heard back from the Radiator shop with an estimate so I’ll be getting the radiator soon. I’ll be able to test fit it myself. They will tack the brackets on, if it fits well, I’ll have them finish it. I took the driveshaft to get it extended 4 ½ inches. Progress continues.
I had refaced my speedometer, but discovered the high beam indicator lens was deteriorated. I found a refresh kit, so had to wait a week for that. After reassembly, the display would not read above 20MPH. I tore it apart again and discovered the spindle was independent of the speedcup. I glued the spindle and tried again. It took forever to get to top speed, and seemed to hang high before dropping. I tore into it again and found the speedcup binding. I removed the superglue, shimmed the speedcup and glued the spindle again, and again I didn’t get the orientation of the speedcup to stop correct. It didn’t rest firmly at 0. It was also binding again. I found that I could get just enough wiggle room to get clearance. I was able to loosen the screws of the speedcup assembly and spindle bracket and shift it enough to work. Once there was free movement, I looked at the stop tab. The speedcup tab was just past the stop tab, so I rotated it around and past the stop tab. I had to bend the stop tab up and then back to get the tab on the speedcup past. This put one revolution of tension on the spring. Now it didn’t read full scale, couldn’t overcome the spring tension. I tried to put it back and in the process of bending the stop tab, the tab broke off. I let the speedcup in it’s relaxed state, preset the spring by about 20 degrees, and glued a piece of wire as a stop. Upon reassembly, the old needle had a visible fracture, it broke. $8 and a week to wait, I glued the needle, and reassmebled. Now this old speedometer is working smooth and quiet.

[Second Series]

I got a call from the radiator shop. I went to get my custom radiator for a test fit, they helped me load it into my pickup, and I asked if they wanted some money. He said I’d be back to have them attach the brackets and paint it. It is a pleasure doing business with someone who believes in the honor system. Although he was surprised when I returned later that same day with the position of the brackets already figured out. The fab shop left a brace tacked to the front of the core support that needed to go, so I needed to come up with an upper core support. I cut a length of hat channel from a bed cross sill that was removed. Fired up the ol’ Oxy Acetylene rig and had at it. I don’t have much time welding, but it came out o.k. except for one blow through. I’ll finish those welds later, probably remove the core support for that. I did weld the lumber rack that is on my pickup with Oxy Acetylene and it’s holding up so far. The custom radiator fits well, the sheet metal won’t need to be altered. The latch panel had been previously cut to accommodate the old radiator mounted to the forward of the core support. This new radiator does stick up a bit, I may be able to lower it alittle, but I’m happy as it is.

[Second Series]

Progress is slow, but steady. I’m lucky to get 2 hours a week in on this. I noticed the rear shock brackets need to be moved back. The axle bumps and spare tire hanger need to be moved back also. The passenger side shock bracket is mounted to the frame where the frame transitions from wide to narrow. The bracket will need to be narrowed to move it back. I cut a V out of the bracket and welded back together. The driver side shock bracket is rear of the axle, so it won’t need to be modified. I will need to modify a cross brace though. I’ve removed the axle bumps, the other shock bracket, and the spare hanger. Once I got in there and started removing things, it looks fairly straight forward what needs to be done. Fortunately I am able to pull up the bed wood to gain access from above.

[Second Series]

Progess is slow, but continues. I got the drivers side rear shock relocated, and the axle bumps moved back too. I’ll use a piece of the old bed cross sill for the spare tire hanger. I’ve been looking at the Brake and Clutch master cylinders. The rod that connects to the pedals is not right for this application. The stock ’88 units have a long rod with eye on the end. The aftermarket pedal assemblies don’t have enough room for the length of those rods. I wanted to keep as much stock as possible, and keep the 10 ½” Brake booster. I see many use the cpp masters, I may go that route for the clutch. I need units with a short threaded connecting rod. I did find that the Nissan Quest uses a 10 ½” booster with short threaded rod, but haven’t looked if it would play nice with the GM master cylinder. I’m also looking at the drivers side door jamb. The door contacts to opening at the top front first. I’ll need to bend a hinge, bend the door out, or bend the door jamb in. I have some dimentions from the assembly manual and am devising a way to measure if the door jamb is out of spec. I have also been working on the speedometer drive. I will be using the original speedometer with this modern drivetrain, so I have connected a motor to the speedometer. I finally hooked it up to a ’90 chevy truck and tested it out, here's a link to a video I made:
https://youtu.be/K6YOm1WTpqg

[6DoF]

i really like the use of the original wood!

i'm a little worried about how steep of an angle that shock is at, it's really disadvantaged vs the axle travel.

[Second Series]

Thanks 6Dof, I was fortunate to be able to salvage the bedwood as it was protected being inside the panel truck all these years. I based the shock mount location off of my ’90 chevy truck, but didn’t check the angle, I don’t know why it would change, but I’ll have a look. The driver side shock is even steeper. I read about how the two are mounted at different angles.

[Second Series]

I got the spare tire hanger relocated. I picked up a Millermatic 135 and have been playing with that. It’s like a hot glue gun, and not as forgiving as the oxy-acetylene rig in my opinion. I made the brackets for the tire hanger, and cleaned up the core support. I’ll use the Gmaw on the exhaust. I noticed a fuel line contacting a bracket, so I dropped the fuel tank to cut some clearance. I have a list of tasks that I am working through, but after the fuel line I kind of went off and started looking at everything that connects around the engine. Next on the list is the parking brake cable. I’m using the floor lever from the ’47. The ’88 had a foot operated lever on the driver side, the driverside rear cable is short, and the passenger side cable is long with a threaded adjustment. My plan is to put a short cable on the passenger side, and run both cables to a bracket on the passenger side. From there they will connect together with a cable or rod to the floor lever. Getting ahead of the list, I will cut and thread the brake and clutch linkages to fit the pedals. I set the transfer case lever in place, and found it to be under my leg. The ’47 is narrower. It may need to be moved back, after thinking about it, I may move it to the passenger side. I have been thinking about making a scissor type linkage. I’ll look at it some more. I also started to hook up fuel lines and brake lines. Painted the core support and set in place. I have been looking at schematics of the ’88. There is a bulkhead connector behind the fuse panel that I would like to eliminate. Some of the wires go from the cab through that connector and across the firewall only to re-enter the cab. I’m sure I’ll spend many more hours studying the wiring. Today I’ll hit the pick a part yard and look for bits and pieces.

[Second Series]

There are always different trucks to pick from each time I go to the pick it yard. I was thinking about how I was working for an hour for a part that I could get new for $10 and they’ll charge me $5. I thought about giving up with each bolt, but persisted. I got the front brake line that crosses from the driver side to passenger in the front. It has a lot of bends. I finally found a DRAC. It was in a ’91 suburban, maybe ’92. The RPO code label was gone, so I don’t know what the diff and tires were and don’t know what the DRAC was set for. I do have some charts and it looks close to what I need and is easily adjustable. I did a bunch of math to try to figure out what it is set up for and found the ratio is set to 0.800185, I’ll need it at 0.768707, so that may be close enough. I also got an A/C compressor. They charged me $4 for the DRAC so it was a good day. Here is a picture of the spare tire hanger in place. I mounted the crank bracket lower so it angles down and the access is below the rear bumper. The spare does hang at a slight angle.

[olcarguy]

Keep up the good work, Your getting there....Just like eating an elephant one bite at a time.....

[nvrdone]

hey second series - where is this pick yard you speak of???

[Second Series]

Originally Posted by nvrdone

hey second series - where is this pick yard you speak of???

I go to the pick n pull in Lynnwood, there is also one in Lakewood. I have also gone to Binford in Auburn. There is also a yard on Hwy 9 in the Cathcart area I have not been there, but I did buy a doorlock from the owner of Dreamers who lives in that area. He has a bunch of doors and truck parts, advertises on craigslist. There's also someone in Anacortes, and someone in Marysville on craigslist who look like they part out '50s chevy trucks. I've been wanting to check out the one in Anacortes.

[Second Series]

It looks like brake cables are listed by application, and only some list specs. I was scrolling through over a thousand brake cables looking for a 60” intermedite cable with ball on one end and threaded shaft on the other. I found one listed at 63”, but on the NAPA site it was 65”. I have some wiggle room with the bracket location, so I got that one. I replaced the passenger side cable with one for the driver side, and then it looked like the old driver side was an inch longer. I put a new one on the driver side, and found they were the same length, the old one’s spring was compressed so the end was out 1” more. I cut off a chunk of metal from the old frame and made a bracket. This drill press is as precision as I get…
I found the equalizer, and clevis at Morris 4x4. I don’t know why they couldn’t be found at any of my FLAPS. Then I just needed a nut for the intermediate cable, nothing I had lying around seemed to fit. It’s metric. After everything was in place I tightened the nut down all the way, but could still spin the tire by hand alittle. I added a spacer (Two oversized nuts) and got the cable even tighter. The wheels still aren’t impossible to turn, but I won’t know if it holds until I can park it on an incline. Afterwards, I found the ’55 truck intermediate cable is 61” and the ’63 truck cable is ~59” so I may try one of those, or I could use a metal rod and thread the ends. As it is I need the full throw of the brake lever. My ’55 has a lever between the intermediate cable and the rear cables. It’s not a fulcrum since it transfers pulling force to pulling force. It’s like a radius arm to multiply pulling distance. I may build something like that in the future if needed. For now I’ll move on to the the next task, but will definitely revisit this. At the very least the lever bracket will need to be painted.

[Second Series]

I may have been better off to follow my instinct when I was wrestling bolts in the pick-it yard. The brake line that I got just would not attach to the brake hose on the passenger side. It seems to be metric. So the ’88 gmc has SAE brake fittings and the ’95 chevy has metric brake fittings. I haven’t found any information on when the change was made. I searched for brake hose and found only SAE for the whole range of years, ’88 to ‘98. The brake line kits that I found don’t specify if metric or SAE, only that they work for a range of years 88-89, 90-94, and 95-98. I searched for an adaptor and made several trips to various stores. I found a M10-1.0 female to 3/8-24” female adaptor. With that I was able to verify the fittings that I have. I did order a M10-1.0 to 3/8-24” adaptor but it didn’t specify how it went. Another trip to the auto parts store when they came in only to discover it was backwards from what I need. In the end I purchased a Flaring tool. I used the fittings from my old line, and put them on the new to me line. Now the line is in place I’m ready to cut the rod to the brake booster, thread it, and connect to the pedal. I haven’t used a flaring tool before. I watched some videos, and read some web posts. I decided to try the cheepo tool. Did a couple practice flares to figure out some bugs. I set the tool in a vise and used visegrips to keep the two halves level. I had read that there could be problems if the two halves are not level. I also read to set the tube length to a chamfer on the die, but the cheepo die doesn’t have much on a chamfer. I pressed the die. The claws on this version don’t have a consistent flat area, so the press tries to lean. I press some and then flip it around and so on. The two bars don’t seem to clamp together leaving a gap. The 3/8 part is near the end. I found that clamping the end more first and then tightening the other end gave better results. The second pressing without die was pretty straight forward. The end result looks good to me. There was a ridge on each side where the bar gap was, so I filed that down. The true test will be with pressure in the line.

[olcarguy]

that flare looks about right.....I have found over the years that buying the cheep ass tools never pays, I bought top line flaring tools in both metric and imp a few years(30) ago and they still work like the day I bought them....and they have seen a lot of use.....

[Gregski]

great perseverance, and the square peg in the round hole Metric to SAE mating game is a ton of time wasted I've been there, thank you GM, ha ha

on the flare making, one tip I learned is that you don't need a cheater bar to tighten them in that little jig, just nice and snug and that's plenty, and debur debur, debur, and shoot some brake cleaner through the hard line after you made the flare to shoot out all the debry that fell in there that no one saw

and I just love this mono horn core support design!

[Second Series]

Thanks for the feedback olcarguy, I was hoping someone would comment on the flare. I prefer to use good tools, but from what I read and saw the flaring tools seem to be similar until you get to the $100s prices.

Gregski, I chose the cheepo flare tool because it didn’t have wing nuts, so easier to crank down. Thanks for the tip though! That core support was a bit of a shock to me when I first saw it they were making the welds look nice. The builder had been good about working with me each step of the way, but decided to just go with this. I tried to find a radiator solution that would work, but in the end the core support was reworked around the radiator.

[dsraven]

I have found that the "clamp" parts need to have a common gap and to end. Too much clamping force makes ridges in the tube. Just enough clamp to keep the tubing from moving. Then the round thing to start the flare, and finally the finish. Dont tighten the finish flare down to tightly or it seems to leak. Allow the final screwdown into the fitting to do a bit of tweaking on the flare so it can set it's own seat angle sort of.
That's just what works for me.

[Second Series]

I was wondering about the gap being even, or not. I did clamp it down hard and there were ridges. The first try was lop sided, so I cut it off and went again. The ridges caused some imperfection in the finished product, you can see in the picture on the front of the flare. I had read that if they leak to loosen and tighten a couple times to form the seal.

Moving right along with some possible tool abuse(I hate tool abuse). I purchased a couple dies and a die stock. I have no experience with threading rod. The brake and clutch rods have an eye at the end and are too long for the pedals, so the plan was to cut to length and thread them. I looked into my options and found few. I did read that it is not uncommon to modify the rod length when converting to power brakes in ‘60’s trucks. I watched a few videos and quickly learned that the hex dies are for chasing threads, round dies are for cutting. I had the hex, bummer. I watched a few more videos and found someone brute force some threads, no chamfer, no oil. I decided to not buy more tools and just go for it. Upside down under dash I worked the brake rod for about an hour. I couldn’t remove the clutch pedal, so I took out the bracket and the clutch rod fell out. That took about 10 minutes in a vise, but one side the threads were not deep. I think the clutch rod is out of round, but the nut and clevis threaded on o.k. I decided to remove the brake pedal bracket and paint both pedal assemblies. I’ll have to remove them again when I paint the firewall, but I need to bleed the brake and clutch for now.

[dsraven]

There are different depths of threads. Some fit tight due to not being cut as deep. Those work well for adjustment rods and things like that.

[Second Series]

I bled the brakes with no trouble. The clutch, different story. I did some on-line reading about difficulties with bleeding hydraulic clutches, I read the manual. I had a day and spent 3 hours trying to get something. I have a suction pump, so I tried using that to fill the line. The clutch line goes down from the master cylinder, and then up over the back of the engine, down the passenger side, and then to the slave cylinder. I tried pulling fluid at each end. Spent an hour here, a couple hours there when I had time. I had read about someone who removed the system and got it bled on the bench, and reinstalled. I tried this, removed the slave cylinder still connected to the line and had that out in front of the master. I finally got what looked like good results, fluid and some air bubbles coming out with each pedal press until no more bubbles. I put the slave cylinder back in, snaking the line behind the engine, only to find fluid dripping… A nick in the hydraulic line, probably from a grinder. New line installed and back to the endless pumping of the pedal, using suction. I removed the master and cut the end of the old line off to run into a can of fluid. It seemed like I was able to prime the master this way, so I put it back on. I even filled the line with a syringe. Now I was getting some fluid through the system and some air bubbles, but that lasted for about Three pedal presses. Now I decided to replace the cylinders. I connected the slave cylinder to the line and attached a hose from the bleeder to a jar of new fluid. With the bleeder open and the cylinder hanging so the bleeder was highest. Installed the master and bench bled with the short line I had made, then transferred onto the line. I pumped the pedal a couple times, looked under and saw the clear hose starting to fill. Pumped a bunch more, refilled the reservoir, and went under to look. Fluid and air bubbles were flowing, so this is the gravity bleeding I read about. Made it up top in time to add more fluid, and then back down to close the bleeder. I used a camera tripod to wedge the pedal down, and bled the rest of the air out. Then installed the slave and verified through the inspection hole that the cluch arm was moving. Good firm pedal, but… The firewall flexes a lot. I push down about an inch, then the firewall pops, flexes an inch, then the pedal can be depressed the rest of the way. I thought any flexing would be much more subtle. I have read about reinforcing the firewall for the brake booster, I guess I wanted to see what would happen, and my builder didn’t know about this issue. I’m thinking either add some ribs, or a plate, leaning more for the plate. Maybe .080 would be enough to spread the load. The brake pedal doesn’t seem to be much of a problem, it’s only resistance is the return springs in the rear drum brakes. The clutch pedal has to push the clutch disk, hydraulic makes it easier, but it’s still work.

I picked up a couple pieces of sheet metal last weekend from a friend. I need to see if they are wide enough. I’ll make templates out of cardboard, one for the firewall and one for the T-case shifter bracket.

I’m still finishing the back end. I think I found an off-the-shelf solution for the exhaust tailpipe. I’d like to get the exhaust in before closing the bed up. I’m in the process of identifying all the bed bolts, there are a few more holes to drill. It looks like I’ll have to put all the bolts in place before tightening any. Before I get to that there’s painting the rest of the bed strips. And I’m looking at an off-the-shelf Gray paint to match the interior Gray. I’d like to touch up the bad spots, and hit the area that meets the bedwood, before the wood is in place.

I have been buying Grays as I find them and decided to do a comparison. I put up a poll in the Paint section. Here: http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=822840

That jagged scrap creates a shadow so today I cut each color and pasted on the background, the background is a section in the interior cargo area. I like 3,4, and 7 with 3 being the closest.

1. Krylon Fusion Matte Deep Gray 2914
2. Krylon Matte Vintage Gray 2910
3. Rust Stop Stone Gray Satin Ace1197094
4. Rust-Oleum Satin Coastal Gray 312819
5. Rust-Oleum Gloss Charcoal Gray 7784-830
6. Rust-Oleum 2X Satin Charcoal Gray 350373
7. Rust-Oleum Gloss Smoke Gray 7786-830
8. Krylon Color Maxx Matte Deep Gray 5550
9. Krylon Fusion Satin Pewter Gray 2744

I also have a plan for the Dash and cab interior. I have no metal painting experience, but I have been reading a lot and am happy with the test piece.

[Second Series]

I have been putting in time as I can. I was not satisfied with the Gray paint comparison, so I sprayed the Grays on part of a rear door. I found that the #1 on my list Krylon Fusion Matte Deep Gray 2914 is a good match. I took a picture of it, but it appears off in the picture. The paint an the rear door is in natural light. I found that the new paint looks different under different light sources, and it also photographs different in different light sources. The Deep Gray looks like a perfect match to the original paint, but both paints look different when photographed. I may be better off not touching up, and just paint everything. My plan is to paint the Gray around the bed before installing the wood, now I’m satisfied with the paint selection. I have painted the rest of the bed rub rails and have been figuring out what bolts are needed. The cross sills were replaced with 1x2 so the bolt lengths will be different. I got the bolts for the perimeter and have painted the heads Gray(pictured). I wanted black bolts for the rails, and decided grade 5 black oxide bolts is the way to go. I could only find black painted grade A carriage bolts locally, so I ordered some from McMaster-Carr. It may be overkill, but I think it will work good. I had ordered an exhaust tailpipe from a parts store. The ’88 GMC had the y-pipe go to 3”, catalytic convertor was 3” in/out, a length of 3” to the muffler 3” in/out, and a 3” elbow exit in front of the rear tire. Some trucks from this era had a muffler with 3” in and 2) 2 ¼” out with the two pipes crossing and both exiting rear of the right rear wheel. The description of the tailpipe is 2 ¼” with 3” inlet, or something like that. When I went to pick up the tailpipe it had no 3” inlet, and it had some funny bends since the pipes cross over each other. I declined to take it. Later, I identified a 3” tailpipe , and even later I found another 3” tailpipe with mandrel bends. I finally went to order the pipe with mandrel bends, and it was no longer available. I asked about the other one and it was available at $60, but shipping from back east for another $60. The clerk then suggested one they could get locally for $20. I asked if it was 3” and was assured it was. Went to get it the next day to find it at 2 ¼”, but the bends were correct and it had the bracket in the right place. Finding an adaptor for 3” to 2 ¼” was equally amusing. I ended up downloading a Nickson catalog to get the part number, listed as a new part. I went to the Flaps where they did not find it listed. With the part number they were able to find it and I had it the next day. The shop had cut the exhaust system up, so I cut pieces off the ends of the cat, and was able to get the system together. Yesterday I spent an hour and drilled 2 holes for mounts. When I have time I will hit it with the GMaw. I thought about the ease of just clamping everything, but it feels kind of loose in places, and where’s the fun in that. I need to put in more time welding.

[Second Series]

After drilling the holes I painted the raw metal black. Yesterday I attached two exhaust hangers, and check the clearance of the spare tire, looks good. Next step is to weld.

[Second Series]

I need to put in more time welding, but I think the exhaust system should work with the crusty welds I put on it. I also welded some on my Toy P’up exhaust before going on vacation, that seems to be o.k. Back from vacation I have been working on the firewall flex by the clutch pedal. I made a cardboard template before I cut a piece of 1/8” sheet metal. Kind of went down a rabbit hole here when I realized the firewall should be painted now. There was some matting left on the passenger side, a heatgun and power scraper helped remove that.

The patch job that the restoration shop did looks great on the engine side, not so good on the inside. I’ll put matting over this so I left it as is.

I test fit the stiffener plate and found the firewall was not flat. I don’t know if that’s how they are, or if it warped when the steering column hole was relocated. I added a bolt to the corner to draw it tight.

I decided now is a good time to paint the inside of the dash. I started with a wire cup brush on a drill and got the firewall and kick panels. A wire cup brush and sanding disk on a dremel fit up under in the tight spaces. This has got to be the most miserable task of the build. Upside down grinding rust above.

[Second Series]

I applied Ospho to everything.

Rusty Metal Primer.

Painted with the Dark Bronze, the imperfections stand out.

I cut some roofing tar paper to place between the firewall and stiffener. I thought it needed something as a buffer from physical wear and noise. The pedals back in and no more flex. I still need to adjust the pedal angle, but will get to that later.

Now I’m on to painting the cargo area, all the inside grey.

[Second Series]

I went over the driver side cargo area with a scrub pad, and applied Ospho for the rust. The Ospho was a sticky mess on the paint so I used a cleaner degreaser. Then taped around the edges and applied two coats of spraypaint. I like how it turned out, I’ll go on to the passenger side this afternoon. The picture shows the passenger side as it is, and the driver side after paint. After the sides, I’ll do the rear area and then the front. After the Grey, I’ll do the rest of the Bronze including dash if I get to it while the weather is still warm.