1000+ HP, anyone?

[truckster]

The upcoming Corvette ZR1 will boast 1,064 horsepower. Expect to pay a pretty penny for it, though:

https://www.motortrend.com/news/2025...t-look-review/

[weq92f]

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Couple takeaways...

Dual clutch 8 speed tranny
It's boosted
Only 800 lb-ft of torque
Tires: An All season set would cost 1600 plus install. A decent performance tire would cost 2100 + install. The optional Cup 2R rubbers would run 2600 + install.
Prototype ran 9.7 second quarter mile...faster than the previous ZR1

From the article:

At full chat, the engine runs on 20 psi of boost with so much air pumping through the cylinders that the exhaust exiting the four tailpipes pushes the car with 37 pounds of thrust.

I wanna see one of these moving on thrust alone! Put in neutral and redline the engine.

-Kevin

[D.B]

The 1064hp is on pump gas. Try E85 and the numbers could be 1400hp+.

[Sheepdip]

Can only use about 30% of that horsepower on the street where 90% of these will end up.

[Accelo]

I am unsure how anyone could get one. The current Z06 production is sold out for five years. MSRP starts From $110,100 for the Z06. Dealers are asking $160 to $170K for an optioned one. This ZR1 has to be for people with an extra $500K plus in their checking account. Still half-price when compared to the other Super Cars out there. None of my friends have yet to offer me a ride in their new Lambo. Sad story!

[Ironhorse]

Does anyone else besides me remember years ago in late 1969 - early 1970 the uproar from both the Gubment and nation wide insurance companies about the on-going "horse power wars" during the muscle car days? They all were screaming that factory offerings of 375, 400, 425, 450 horse power cars was just too much for the average driver to safely handle and control. Thus started the de-tuning of cars which included moving to unleaded gasoline, lower compression, smog pumps, etc.

Now here we are 50 years later and factory cars with 800 - 1,000 horse power no longer seems to be a problem for Mr. & Mrs "average driver" WTH changed!! I know drivers haven't gotten better thru the years. I see that everyday in traffic, cutting in front of moving traffic across three lanes to make a turn at the next exit. Leaving no reaction time/distance between vehicles on the road. Road rage, bumper to bumper commonplace on highways at speed. Speed limits are ignored, maybe they are just a suggestion anymore.


Just the other day in the local evening news a driver was stopped driving in mid-day traffic while doing 106 MPH in a 60 MPH cross town, no stop light, roadway. What am I not seeing here with this new "horse power wars" situation. ??????

[weq92f]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Does anyone else besides me remember years ago in late 1969 - early 1970 the uproar from both the Gubment and nation wide insurance companies about the on-going "horse power wars" during the muscle car days? They all were screaming that factory offerings of 375, 400, 425, 450 horse power cars was just too much for the average driver to safely handle and control. Thus started the de-tuning of cars which included moving to unleaded gasoline, lower compression, smog pumps, etc.

Now here we are 50 years later and factory cars with 800 - 1,000 horse power no longer seems to be a problem for Mr. & Mrs "average driver" WTH changed!! I know drivers haven't gotten better thru the years. I see that everyday in traffic, cutting in front of moving traffic across three lanes to make a turn at the next exit. Leaving no reaction time/distance between vehicles on the road. Road rage, bumper to bumper commonplace on highways at speed. Speed limits are ignored, maybe they are just a suggestion anymore.


Just the other day in the local evening news a driver was stopped driving in mid-day traffic while doing 106 MPH in a 60 MPH cross town, no stop light, roadway. What am I not seeing here with this new "horse power wars" situation. ??????

.

I think what may be overlooked is that during 60s and 70s muscle car era, the cars being produced and sold to Joe Blow were far more pedestrian than today's super cars, high end models of production vehicles, special built machines or those that are sold to the public from manufacturers as race cars or track ready. The main difference between today and back then is that for someone to purchase a 700 or 1000 HP machine, the cash outlay or liability is absolutely enormous. Typically Joe Blow, your regular family man or student couldn't possibly afford to get their but in the seat of one of these scary fast, over powered vehicles without knowing what's on the line (say he rents an exotic in Vegas for a day and has to read the fine print).

If a guy does purchase a new ZR1 for example, his insurance rates are going to be in line with what it would cost to repair/replace that vehicle. Think very large premiums on a vehicle that MSRPs between 130k and 150k.

Plus...the insurance agencies are today much different with way more expensive policies being written and the majority of those are total daily driver/beaters.

I think it's just a different animal altogether.


-Kevin

[1slo64]

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

Does anyone else besides me remember years ago in late 1969 - early 1970 the uproar from both the Gubment and nation wide insurance companies about the on-going "horse power wars" during the muscle car days? They all were screaming that factory offerings of 375, 400, 425, 450 horse power cars was just too much for the average driver to safely handle and control. Thus started the de-tuning of cars which included moving to unleaded gasoline, lower compression, smog pumps, etc.

Now here we are 50 years later and factory cars with 800 - 1,000 horse power no longer seems to be a problem for Mr. & Mrs "average driver" WTH changed!! I know drivers haven't gotten better thru the years. I see that everyday in traffic, cutting in front of moving traffic across three lanes to make a turn at the next exit. Leaving no reaction time/distance between vehicles on the road. Road rage, bumper to bumper commonplace on highways at speed. Speed limits are ignored, maybe they are just a suggestion anymore.

Technology, so many computers and programs control what can be put to the ground. You no longer have to be a good driver to control these modern vehicles.

[72c20customcamper]

Originally Posted by weq92f

.

I think what may be overlooked is that during 60s and 70s muscle car era, the cars being produced and sold to Joe Blow were far more pedestrian than today's super cars, high end models of production vehicles, special built machines or those that are sold to the public from manufacturers as race cars or track ready. The main difference between today and back then is that for someone to purchase a 700 or 1000 HP machine, the cash outlay or liability is absolutely enormous. Typically Joe Blow, your regular family man or student couldn't possibly afford to get their but in the seat of one of these scary fast, over powered vehicles without knowing what's on the line (say he rents an exotic in Vegas for a day and has to read the fine print).

If a guy does purchase a new ZR1 for example, his insurance rates are going to be in line with what it would cost to repair/replace that vehicle. Think very large premiums on a vehicle that MSRPs between 130k and 150k.

Plus...the insurance agencies are today much different with way more expensive policies being written and the majority of those are total daily driver/beaters.

I think it's just a different animal altogether.


-Kevin

Actually Corvettes aren’t all that expensive to insure . It’s all about risk . When I had an insurance agency people were shocked when their new little civic was twice the price of their Camaro or other similar car like a Camry . But at the time the civic was the car for ricers who weren’t all that good at driving . And were involved in more accidents per 100k vehicles

And you can get classic insurance on a new vette since I reality people don’t buy them as a primary driver . A lot if the downsizing of HP in the 70s was more because of the lack of gas and the new emissions standards . I work in a gas station during both gas shortages in the 70s . Nobody wanted a muscle car when high test was 50 cents a gallon at least for an everyday vehicle . Now you can 700 plus HP and full emissions control and get high 20 to 30 mpg

Just for giggles I got a price on a 2025 corvette on my Hagerty policy value 150k 100 deductibles 250/500 liability used for pleasure $2095 for 1 year

[Ironhorse]

My posting to the thread was not so much concerned with the cost of insurance but more to the change in attitude concerning high horsepower engines. I came home from Vietnam in April of '70 and gas was in the $0.26 to $0.28 per gallon range for 89 octane leaded fuel. There was no US gas shortage until it came about in 1973 with the first oil crunch when OPEC was formed. It is true that the muscle cars fell victim to the higher fuel prices later after the 69-70 production times but the de-tuning and lower compression was the government's push to bring down the horse power available to the masses.

I would still like to know why the change in allowing 800 plus horse power engines in vehicles today regardless of the new tech incorporated in the vehicle when a mere 450 horsepower could not be allowed to continue in production cars from years ago? Again, WTH changed with allowing the horse power ratings made available from the factory today?

[72c20customcamper]

Thinking it’s not that anything changed . My Chevelle gets about 10 mpg if I take it easy on it . Back in the day when gas was going up that was unacceptable. Fast forward now I can have a faster car with twice the HP and get milage that a Honda Accord of the late 70s got . Still high HP cars aren’t really the norm today . Sure high end vehicles tend to be higher horsepower but they aren’t a high percentage of cars on the road . Technology made it possible to have both .

Who is allowing it ? High horsepower wasn’t outlawed it just wasn’t feasible with the old tech and still get lower emissions and high mpg .

[truckster]

Originally Posted by 72c20customcamper

Actually Corvettes aren’t all that expensive to insure . It’s all about risk . When I had an insurance agency people were shocked when their new little civic was twice the price of their Camaro or other similar car like a Camry . But at the time the civic was the car for ricers who weren’t all that good at driving . And were involved in more accidents per 100k vehicles

And you can get classic insurance on a new vette since I reality people don’t buy them as a primary driver . A lot if the downsizing of HP in the 70s was more because of the lack of gas and the new emissions standards . I work in a gas station during both gas shortages in the 70s . Nobody wanted a muscle car when high test was 50 cents a gallon at least for an everyday vehicle . Now you can 700 plus HP and full emissions control and get high 20 to 30 mpg

Just for giggles I got a price on a 2025 corvette on my Hagerty policy value 150k 100 deductibles 250/500 liability used for pleasure $2095 for 1 year

I pay four times as much for my 95 Z/28 as I do for my 72 Blazer...

Originally Posted by Ironhorse

I would still like to know why the change in allowing 800 plus horse power engines in vehicles today regardless of the new tech incorporated in the vehicle when a mere 450 horsepower could not be allowed to continue in production cars from years ago? Again, WTH changed with allowing the horse power ratings made available from the factory today?

Free market, maybe?

[72c20customcamper]

Originally Posted by truckster

I pay four times as much for my 95 Z/28 as I do for my 72 Blazer...

Again loss history . I’m sure the accident rate for a 72 Blazer is far lower than the 95 Z28 . I very rarely see a Blazer on the road I do see mid 90s Zs and Firebirds . There is one a kid drives a mid 90s Camaro in town that looks like he uses the braille method to drive .

[RenoKeene]

1000+ HP is for bragging rights only. Might get half that to hook-up on the street and a real chance of losing control when the other half kicks in if you haven't pushed the proper buttons in the correct order.

[weq92f]

Originally Posted by RenoKeene

1000+ HP is for bragging rights only. Might get half that to hook-up on the street and a real chance of losing control when the other half kicks in if you haven't pushed the proper buttons in the correct order.

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Many of Mustangs (et al) I see online crashing while doing an exit from a car show or just showing off have some things in common. 1) the traction/stability control was disabled and 2) the driver shifts into second at WOT while rear tires already spinning and this usually sends the car right or left into places it wasn't meant to go! Keeping a car on the road while spinning rear tires gets more and more difficult as speed increases. The shift happens usually when 1st gear is about maxed out in terms of vehicle speed (15-20 MPH) and the tires begin to spin at a much faster rate quickly yawing the vehicle one way or the other. This is when the driver either under or over corrects which further complicating things...usually beyond recoverability given the circumstances.

Number 2 and number 1 on this video illustrate this.

https://youtu.be/cVyBaX6sCd4?si=s7EK0edhAXAEMBC4

-Kevin