47-55.1 Suggestions on mounting gauges

[51 3600]

I have finally started on wiring. Went to mount the gauge clusters and found that the cases of the clusters hit the brake pedal mounting bracket that runs from fire wall to dash. Seems I would have to grind that bracket down to get the clusters in but that part of the bracket is pretty narrow already. Grinding thinner (and it would be a lot thinner) doesn't feel like a safe solution to me. Any suggestions?

[PDW HOTRODS]

That's the way it goes, when you modify one thing often times you need to modify other thing to make it all work. If you can take off a little to make it work then do it. I you need to take off a lot I wouldn't. Do you have a welder? I would cut the brake bracket a few inches from the dash and turn it to mount to the existing factory bracket. I wouldn't grind too much off to weaken it without adding somewhere else. Don't take chances on brakes or steering.

[dsraven]

do you have a few more piocs from different angles and possibly zoomed ot some to see the whole area? also possibly mark the new parts that weren't there before the brake pedal upgrade. it's been awhile, for some of us, since we have seen the inside of an AD truck.

[leegreen]

Is it possible that you put the master higher on the firewall than the bracket was designed for?

They are normally installed as you show, can you get it under the factory bracket for a bit more room?

[dsraven]

I know you shouldn't have to, but maybe remove the bracket and fab up one similar but different enough to mount and clear the pods? possibly if the flat bar was laid flat instead of vertical it could be bolted on in the same place. it could have the twist closer to the pedal pivot rod and a reinforcement there would probably not interfere with anything. make a new one so if it doesn't work you still have the original to work with?

[51 3600]

Sorry for the late reply. Couldn't get on the site yesterday. Something about server problems.
Thanks for the responses. The bracket is located and installed as designed.

The following pic of the underside shows the button head bolts that the bracket is attached by. I liked the idea of modifying it to attach underneath the dash but as you can kinda guess it would have to go down and swoop up under the dash then around the steering column mount to attach where the buttonhead bolts are. That would challenge my skills.



As suggested twisting the bracket or adding a flat bar so the bracket becomes horizontal at the attachment point might work. Other thoughts I had were making a upside down u shaped bracket that attached at hole A on the original AD stiffener then down on each side to the brake bracket. Then cut off the unneeded portions. Don't know if hole A has some other purpose I'll need later.



Easiest for me would be to weld tabs (red) to the bracket on either side then bolt it in holes B (available on both sides) then cutting off the XXX sections. Question is, even though dash has a stiffener there will it be strong enough to support the brake bracket.



Long post, sorry. I'd appreciate you thoughts.

[dsraven]

if those brake mounting brackets were swapped side to side would they fit under the dash sheet metal and bolt up to the larger bolts between the sheet metal and the flat plate sandwiched between the column clamp and the dash? possibly it was assembled with the left side on the right side and vice versa? the brackets would go under the dash to mount instead of behind the cluster.

[51 3600]

That's a thought. I'll have to make a template and check it out.

[leegreen]

I did quite a bit of surgery in that area. Maybe there are some ideas here.

I cut out the factory indent where the shifter passes under the dash and welded in a piece of exhaust tub to create a larger and centered recess for a modern column.
In this picture you can just see the column mount points below the wraps of blue rope holding the column up


next I welded a tab to the dash & exhaust tube recess to catch those column mounts. I hacked up a C10 pedal box to plate to firewall and pick up the same mount point as tab welded to dash and column mount. Its good and solid. I have since replaced the c10 3 speed manual column shown here with a 3rd gen Camaro tilt column - it bolted in exactly like the C10 column.



I have no regrets about the work to raise the column in the dash, without that a modern column will want to be right in your lap as the dash holds it quite a bit lower. It worked out very comfortable. I'll add that I worked out seat mounts, column and pedal all at the same time to work together

[mr48chev]

I'm starting to wonder if the brake pedal bracket isn't supposed to take the place of the dash support. The stock dash brace is broken a lot of the time simply because the drivers use the wheel to pull themselves up in the truck or pull themselves forward to reach the dash controls. With that it is actually a steering column support far more than a dash support.

I'd pull the stock brace out and see if the brake brackets cleared the gauges and then if that works think about making a couple of flat bar or rod braces that ran from the dash to the original bolts on the firewall as added support.

[leegreen]

There is a hot rod magazine article online showing it installed same as 51-3600 has it

[jweb]

You need to remove the stock brace. Both of these instructions mention that.

https://www.performanceonline.com/pr...qHdSagCAMVshEf

https://content.speedwaymotors.com/D...ckajM1JGwwJGgw

[51 3600]

I believe the bracket jweb refers to mounts only on the fire wall and does not extend to the dash. The one I have is designed to fit an AD the way I have it. Removing the stock brace won't help as the bracket will still mount in the same location, same holes. The distance of the bracket to the dash won't change.



There is a possibility, which I haven't checked, that if I take the bracket out, put the gauge clusters in, then the bracket it might work. Part of the problem with the bracket in place is getting the clusters over the cluster mounting screws that are attached to the back of the dash. I really didn't want to take booster, bracket, etc. out, try the clusters in, put the bracket back, find out it doesn't work, take the clusters out, put the bracket back in, then do whatever I have to do to make it work. Ugh! You know what I mean?
I hate doing things twice or three times. Yeah, I know, expect it. Still don't like it.

[mr48chev]

You may have hit it spot on right there. Order of assembly. If a person hasn't taken something back apart on their project because something else had to go on first you really haven't done a lot. That precludes the easy way of reaching the bolts though.

[jweb]

Both of the brackets I posted instructions for attach to the dash. By removing the stock brace the bracket will sit lower. Unfortunately I couldn't find any instructions or photos that show the dash side.

It may not fix your issue but the lower height of the bracket when it's not on top of the stock brace should help.

Your idea of installing the gauges before the bracket may be the best solution either way. They're no fun installing when you're laying on the floor and having more room with the booster bracket out would be nice.

[mr48chev]

Instructions for those are vague or as far I could find on CPP yesterday non existant on the web. I don't know what their big secret is but in the past i have often bought specialty parts because the manufacture posted detailed instructions online that allowed me to decide that was what I wanted.

[51 3600]

Update.
So I did what was necessary removing the master cylinder, brake booster and the brake pedal bracket. Removed the stock firewall to dash brace, then fit the brake pedal bracket back in. Confirmed gauge clusters still wouldn't fit. Had a beer.
I remembered that when I bought the brake pedal bracket a long time ago the vendor shipped me the wrong one, similar to the one jweb posted. They told me to keep it and sent the right one. I wasn't sure what I did with the wrong one, kept it, sold it, whatever. Decided I'd better look. After hunting through the garage, in the house, in cabinets everywhere I found it tucked away in the attic.
As you can see in the pics I temporarily bolted it in place and put the stock brace back in and cluster problem gone. One question remains. This brake pedal bracket does not reach (attach) to the dash. Is that ok or do I need to fab a bracket to connect the two? There is a stiffener plate between the brake booster and the firewall so that plus the back plate on the bracket stiffens the mounting area significantly.
Thanks for all the input.

[leegreen]

I probably would, it would bug me if I did not. I have seen many setups no stronger than what you show there. But I bet you can grab that bracket as is and flex the firewall. If you tied it into the dash you would not be able to.

[dsraven]

its a lever hung on sheet metal. you push against it with some of the biggest muscles in your body. metal fatigue can cause cracking around the stronger points that support it. you decide, but its there and not closed in yet. i would brace it to the steering column mount area like you had originally planned. at least to the stamped metal bracket thats there. it would tie it all together and be strong should you put more starin on the steering wheel getting in, or whatever. some flat bar and a drill is likely all thats needed, not really a bunch of fancy bends needed.
do it right the first time. lol.

[51 3600]

I made a plate that attaches the brake pedal bracket to the dash stiffener that runs the length of the dash. It's only 1 inch away from where the column attaches. Calling this do-over done. Thanks again to all.

[dsraven]

nice to have that behind you i bet. did you get any pics?

[my56chevytruck]

Originally Posted by 51 3600

I have finally started on wiring. Went to mount the gauge clusters and found that the cases of the clusters hit the brake pedal mounting bracket that runs from fire wall to dash. Seems I would have to grind that bracket down to get the clusters in but that part of the bracket is pretty narrow already. Grinding thinner (and it would be a lot thinner) doesn't feel like a safe solution to me. Any suggestions?

Attachment 2433593

go back about 1" and weld a support piece to the back of the brake bracket and the dash support then cut off the section that is obstructing your gauges

[51 3600]

Finally had a chance to post the finished pics of the bracket. Pretty simple, just a flat plate joining the brake pedal bracket to the rail across the bottom of the dash.

[dsraven]

that outta do the trick