saginaw overdrive - The 1947 - Present Chevrolet & GMC Truck Message Board Network

shelby987 · 01-21-2006, 11:14 AM

I have heard a rumor about a saginaw or NP transmission used in the 80's that had an overdrive, does anyone know anything about this transmission? It is suppose to be a 4 speed transmission with the same dimensions of the saginaw/muncie transmissions....can anyone tell me about these transmissions (specifically wondering if I could replace my 3 speed with this....will I have a problem with the output shaft in my dana 20?)....hear they might have a 10 input and a 27 output...what does the stock saginaw have?
Also, performance wise, I am pretty happy with my 3 speed gearing....does anyone know what that actually is? Would it likely be the same for the first 3 gears of the NP overdrive?
Thanks

jacobs · 01-21-2006, 11:54 AM

Chevrolet offered a 3 speed Saganaw overdrives in both pickups and passenger cars until I believe the late 60's. They were rare but available. In pickups, rear differential ratio was 4.11's in the 1/2 tons. I believe you could even adapt the overdrive to a passenger car Saganaw 4 speed with minor machining.

LMN8UR · 01-21-2006, 11:25 PM

Go to " http://www.drivetrain.com/ " They list the New Process A833/MY6 4 Speed (RWD) Manual Transmission Parts as an option for Chevy trucks from 1981-89.

I heard that they are direct bolt on's. . . Just shifter mods.
Good luck finding one, and if you find two, LET ME KNOW!

**Bob B.** · 01-21-2006, 11:30 PM

The A833 overdrive was used in Dodge Ram pickups those years, too. I wonder if the Dodge version is the same as the G.M. version. This transmission is an overdrive version of the old Dodge Charger/Plymouth Road Runner 4 speed.

LMN8UR · 01-21-2006, 11:42 PM

I've heard the splines are different on the Dodges.

Brad · 01-22-2006, 12:07 AM

Another boardmember said he got an A833 out of a Chevy diesel truck.

I have a Saginaw od trans. It appears complete, but I'm not totally sure. I'll be selling it in the near future once I find out what it's worth, clean it up and post pics. There are several people in line that have contacted me in the past so I'm not sure how to approach selling it yet. It'll be at least a month down the road.

Brad · 01-22-2006, 12:24 AM

Some various info I've collected over the years:

"You might also try a A-833 Mopar. Gear ratios are 1=3.09, 2=1.67, 3=1:1, 4=.73:1. This transmission is also known as a GM 89mm and is made by New Process."

Muncie gear ratios: SM-318 2.94:1 1.68:1 1.00:1 Rev. 2.94:1
The Saginaw has either a 2.85:1 first or a 2.95:1 first depending on the application.

Also, I have an article in Adobe on how to convert a Saginaw transmission into an overdrive using the 3speed od. Not sure how to post it. I also have an article on the A833 and how to install it in a Chevy. It mentions using the Dodge version and says nothing of there being a Chevy version. Again, it's too big to post. I can't email these articles out to a bunch of people, but if someone can help post it, I'll send it to them.

LMN8UR · 01-22-2006, 12:30 AM

Brad, Email it to me "lmn8u@comcast.net" and I can put it in my comcast online storage and I will post a link here for whom-ever may want to see it. -Jim

whitesswj · 01-22-2006, 12:32 AM

send it to my email. steven@starvingyouthpastor.net and i'll put it in my webhosting and put a link in a reply so folks can download it.

sswj

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brad

Some various info I've collected over the years:

"You might also try a A-833 Mopar. Gear ratios are 1=3.09, 2=1.67, 3=1:1, 4=.73:1. This transmission is also known as a GM 89mm and is made by New Process."

Muncie gear ratios: SM-318 2.94:1 1.68:1 1.00:1 Rev. 2.94:1
The Saginaw has either a 2.85:1 first or a 2.95:1 first depending on the application.

Also, I have an article in Adobe on how to convert a Saginaw transmission into an overdrive using the 3speed od. Not sure how to post it. I also have an article on the A833 and how to install it in a Chevy. It mentions using the Dodge version and says nothing of there being a Chevy version. Again, it's too big to post. I can't email these articles out to a bunch of people, but if someone can help post it, I'll send it to them.

whitesswj · 01-22-2006, 12:33 AM

sorry i was just too slow for the job.
sswj

Green Machine · 01-22-2006, 01:00 AM

Yes I did the A833/NP440 conversion to our 1970 C10. Our 1970 originally had the 250 6 banger and three speed manual. We decided to use a V8 in the "correct" forward postion and use the A833/NP440 4 speed. I located an overdrive tranny, bellhousing and factory Hurst shifter from a junk yard. Ours is from a 81 or 82 Chevy C10 truck with V8. They were also used in vans, but try to get the truck one because the shifter may be different. We removed the 6 banger crossmember and used an automatic crossmember under the tail of the tranny along with the correct front V8 mount towers. If you were just normal swapping out a 3 speed for this, it should hang off of the bellhousing just fine with no rear support justlike the original, on a 2wd.

On a 2wd, the drive shaft used on the A833/NP440 is the same length and spline (28 ?) as the the 3 speed and Turbo 350 so a direct bolt in. The input is standard 10 spline. You will need to verify if the bearing retainer on the tranny is the same diameter as the bellhousing, I think 67 and older had a smaller hole, 68 up (truck) should be ok but need to check. Thi tranny easily clears the low hump floor also.

On a 4wd, I dont know how your current tranny attaches to the transfer case, that would be an area you would have to check out. Since the 4wd sits 3 inches farther back, the shifter I have for the 2wd would likely hit the seat.
Maybe that same tranny was used in 4wd in the newer trucks, that might have something for the 4WD. The years to check would be 80-81 thru 86-87 don't remember exactly. Your castiron bellhousing likely doesn't have threaded holes for the bottom 2 tranny bolts, and neither does the tranny I have, so you may have to use bolts on the bottom two. As far as I can tell it still uses the "standard" GM tranny bolt pattern, oh and it has an all alumnum case and looks like a pretty beefy tranny. You can tell how much larger that tranny is, I had to "modify" my exhaust crossover to clear that tranny, it cleared the 3 speed just fine before.

Gear Ratios
1 2 3 OD
3.09 1.67 1.00 .73

Hope that helps some.

**special-K** · 01-22-2006, 02:02 AM

These transmissions were 2wd only.No bolt-in for your 3spd/model20 combo.

LMN8UR · 01-22-2006, 12:19 PM

Here are some links to the above mentioned Tranny articles.

Saginaw OD

Grabbing Gears Beyond High.pdf

Also I noticed ther are two NP 833 on Ebay as of last night. (Of course ya need to save one for me!

)

shelby987 · 01-22-2006, 06:47 PM

would it be possible to use the tail shaft from my 3 speed and make the transmission fit in a 4wd?
Can anyone confirm or deny that the saginaw 3 speed has 27 (or 28) splines on the output if its mated to a dana 20?
Thanks

farside847 · 01-23-2006, 12:16 PM

If you guys do this take tons on pics and post them. Id love to see how you do it~!

woodridge · 01-23-2006, 02:07 PM

I have an 883 out of a 82 K-10 set up for a 208 transfer case if this helps anyone.

01-21-2006, 11:14 AM	#1
shelby987 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Just outside Durham, NC Posts: 894	saginaw overdrive I have heard a rumor about a saginaw or NP transmission used in the 80's that had an overdrive, does anyone know anything about this transmission? It is suppose to be a 4 speed transmission with the same dimensions of the saginaw/muncie transmissions....can anyone tell me about these transmissions (specifically wondering if I could replace my 3 speed with this....will I have a problem with the output shaft in my dana 20?)....hear they might have a 10 input and a 27 output...what does the stock saginaw have? Also, performance wise, I am pretty happy with my 3 speed gearing....does anyone know what that actually is? Would it likely be the same for the first 3 gears of the NP overdrive? Thanks __________________ 1969 SS 350 Camaro Sold 2008 1970 3/4T K20, stock height with 33's, 250 I6, 3 on the tree, and locked front and rear 4.10's 1980 Chevy Malibu 2 dr Sold 2007 1993 Olds. Cutlass Ciera Wagon Traded 2006 2003 Saturn L200 w/5pd. D/D My list spans 5 decades with One common thread.....GM!

01-21-2006, 11:54 AM	#2
jacobs Registered User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: 9000' Mountain Man Posts: 326	Re: saginaw overdrive Chevrolet offered a 3 speed Saganaw overdrives in both pickups and passenger cars until I believe the late 60's. They were rare but available. In pickups, rear differential ratio was 4.11's in the 1/2 tons. I believe you could even adapt the overdrive to a passenger car Saganaw 4 speed with minor machining.

01-21-2006, 11:25 PM	#3
LMN8UR Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Midlothian, VA Posts: 148	Re: saginaw overdrive Go to " http://www.drivetrain.com/ " They list the New Process A833/MY6 4 Speed (RWD) Manual Transmission Parts as an option for Chevy trucks from 1981-89. I heard that they are direct bolt on's. . . Just shifter mods. Good luck finding one, and if you find two, LET ME KNOW! __________________ 72 Chevy C-10 Custom LWB 383 Stroker - Edlebrock Air Gap intake and 670 CFM Holley Street Avenger carb. Hooker Comp Headers w/ X-Pipe and 2.25 duals TKO-500 & 3.08:1 rear I Love HEMI's, they're soft & chewy!

01-21-2006, 11:30 PM	#4
Bob B. Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 1,363	Re: saginaw overdrive The A833 overdrive was used in Dodge Ram pickups those years, too. I wonder if the Dodge version is the same as the G.M. version. This transmission is an overdrive version of the old Dodge Charger/Plymouth Road Runner 4 speed. __________________ 1967 GMC CM-2500 Camper Cruiser, 351E V-6, NP 435 4 speed, Dana 60, and factory A/C. 2012 GMC K-3500 WT regular cab, 6.0L Vortec, 6L90.

01-21-2006, 11:42 PM	#5
LMN8UR Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Midlothian, VA Posts: 148	Re: saginaw overdrive I've heard the splines are different on the Dodges. __________________ 72 Chevy C-10 Custom LWB 383 Stroker - Edlebrock Air Gap intake and 670 CFM Holley Street Avenger carb. Hooker Comp Headers w/ X-Pipe and 2.25 duals TKO-500 & 3.08:1 rear I Love HEMI's, they're soft & chewy!

01-22-2006, 12:07 AM	#6
Brad Out of the carpool lane. Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Clark Co, WA Posts: 5,672	Re: saginaw overdrive Another boardmember said he got an A833 out of a Chevy diesel truck. I have a Saginaw od trans. It appears complete, but I'm not totally sure. I'll be selling it in the near future once I find out what it's worth, clean it up and post pics. There are several people in line that have contacted me in the past so I'm not sure how to approach selling it yet. It'll be at least a month down the road. __________________ 1968 C-10 SWB, 5.7 Vortec/700R4/3.73 posi, Torch Red 1968 Camaro, 250/Powerglide, all original (No, I'm not gonna drop a 350 in it!...Jeez!) 2000 Honda VFR in the faster yellow! 2008 Husqvarna TE-610 1967 C-10 SWB 'Six Appeal'-Gone but not forgotten...

01-22-2006, 12:24 AM	#7
Brad Out of the carpool lane. Join Date: Jan 2000 Location: Clark Co, WA Posts: 5,672	Re: saginaw overdrive Some various info I've collected over the years: "You might also try a A-833 Mopar. Gear ratios are 1=3.09, 2=1.67, 3=1:1, 4=.73:1. This transmission is also known as a GM 89mm and is made by New Process." Muncie gear ratios: SM-318 2.94:1 1.68:1 1.00:1 Rev. 2.94:1 The Saginaw has either a 2.85:1 first or a 2.95:1 first depending on the application. Also, I have an article in Adobe on how to convert a Saginaw transmission into an overdrive using the 3speed od. Not sure how to post it. I also have an article on the A833 and how to install it in a Chevy. It mentions using the Dodge version and says nothing of there being a Chevy version. Again, it's too big to post. I can't email these articles out to a bunch of people, but if someone can help post it, I'll send it to them. __________________ 1968 C-10 SWB, 5.7 Vortec/700R4/3.73 posi, Torch Red 1968 Camaro, 250/Powerglide, all original (No, I'm not gonna drop a 350 in it!...Jeez!) 2000 Honda VFR in the faster yellow! 2008 Husqvarna TE-610 1967 C-10 SWB 'Six Appeal'-Gone but not forgotten...

01-22-2006, 12:30 AM	#8
LMN8UR Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Midlothian, VA Posts: 148	Re: saginaw overdrive Brad, Email it to me "lmn8u@comcast.net" and I can put it in my comcast online storage and I will post a link here for whom-ever may want to see it. -Jim __________________ 72 Chevy C-10 Custom LWB 383 Stroker - Edlebrock Air Gap intake and 670 CFM Holley Street Avenger carb. Hooker Comp Headers w/ X-Pipe and 2.25 duals TKO-500 & 3.08:1 rear I Love HEMI's, they're soft & chewy!

01-22-2006, 12:33 AM	#10
whitesswj Embrace the Redneck Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Cabot, AR Posts: 1,334	Re: saginaw overdrive sorry i was just too slow for the job. sswj __________________ '01 Camaro *Son, you just can't get there from here...*

01-22-2006, 01:00 AM	#11
Green Machine Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Estherville, Iowa Posts: 3,371	Re: saginaw overdrive Yes I did the A833/NP440 conversion to our 1970 C10. Our 1970 originally had the 250 6 banger and three speed manual. We decided to use a V8 in the "correct" forward postion and use the A833/NP440 4 speed. I located an overdrive tranny, bellhousing and factory Hurst shifter from a junk yard. Ours is from a 81 or 82 Chevy C10 truck with V8. They were also used in vans, but try to get the truck one because the shifter may be different. We removed the 6 banger crossmember and used an automatic crossmember under the tail of the tranny along with the correct front V8 mount towers. If you were just normal swapping out a 3 speed for this, it should hang off of the bellhousing just fine with no rear support justlike the original, on a 2wd. On a 2wd, the drive shaft used on the A833/NP440 is the same length and spline (28 ?) as the the 3 speed and Turbo 350 so a direct bolt in. The input is standard 10 spline. You will need to verify if the bearing retainer on the tranny is the same diameter as the bellhousing, I think 67 and older had a smaller hole, 68 up (truck) should be ok but need to check. Thi tranny easily clears the low hump floor also. On a 4wd, I dont know how your current tranny attaches to the transfer case, that would be an area you would have to check out. Since the 4wd sits 3 inches farther back, the shifter I have for the 2wd would likely hit the seat. Maybe that same tranny was used in 4wd in the newer trucks, that might have something for the 4WD. The years to check would be 80-81 thru 86-87 don't remember exactly. Your castiron bellhousing likely doesn't have threaded holes for the bottom 2 tranny bolts, and neither does the tranny I have, so you may have to use bolts on the bottom two. As far as I can tell it still uses the "standard" GM tranny bolt pattern, oh and it has an all alumnum case and looks like a pretty beefy tranny. You can tell how much larger that tranny is, I had to "modify" my exhaust crossover to clear that tranny, it cleared the 3 speed just fine before. Gear Ratios 1 2 3 OD 3.09 1.67 1.00 .73 Hope that helps some. Attached Images __________________ 1968 C10 307 3spd Long Fleet ------ http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=201103 1970 C10 305 Super T10 Long Fleet --- http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=202285 1971 C20 383 TH350 Dana Posi ----- http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=206894 2001 GMC Sierra 1500 C3 6.0 Last edited by Green Machine; 01-22-2006 at 01:25 AM.

01-22-2006, 02:02 AM	#12
special-K Special Order Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Mt Airy, MD Posts: 85,851	Re: saginaw overdrive These transmissions were 2wd only.No bolt-in for your 3spd/model20 combo. __________________ "BUILDING A BETTER WAY TO SERVE THE USA"......67/72......"The New Breed" GMC '67 C1500 Wideside Super Custom SWB: 327/M22/3.42 posi.........."The '67" (project) GMC '72 K2500 Wideside Sierra Custom Camper: 350/TH350/4.10 Power-Lok..."The '72" (rolling) Tim "Don't call me a redneck. I'm a rough cut country gentleman" R.I.P. ~ East Side Low Life ~ El Jay ~ 72BLUZ ~ Fasteddie69 ~ Ron586 ~ 67ChevyRedneck ~ Grumpy Old Man ~

01-22-2006, 12:19 PM	#13
LMN8UR Registered User Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Midlothian, VA Posts: 148	Re: saginaw overdrive Here are some links to the above mentioned Tranny articles. Saginaw OD Grabbing Gears Beyond High.pdf Also I noticed ther are two NP 833 on Ebay as of last night. (Of course ya need to save one for me! ) __________________ 72 Chevy C-10 Custom LWB 383 Stroker - Edlebrock Air Gap intake and 670 CFM Holley Street Avenger carb. Hooker Comp Headers w/ X-Pipe and 2.25 duals TKO-500 & 3.08:1 rear I Love HEMI's, they're soft & chewy!

01-22-2006, 06:47 PM	#14
shelby987 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Just outside Durham, NC Posts: 894	Re: saginaw overdrive would it be possible to use the tail shaft from my 3 speed and make the transmission fit in a 4wd? Can anyone confirm or deny that the saginaw 3 speed has 27 (or 28) splines on the output if its mated to a dana 20? Thanks __________________ 1969 SS 350 Camaro Sold 2008 1970 3/4T K20, stock height with 33's, 250 I6, 3 on the tree, and locked front and rear 4.10's 1980 Chevy Malibu 2 dr Sold 2007 1993 Olds. Cutlass Ciera Wagon Traded 2006 2003 Saturn L200 w/5pd. D/D My list spans 5 decades with One common thread.....GM!

01-23-2006, 12:16 PM	#15
farside847 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Bay Area, California Posts: 995	Re: saginaw overdrive If you guys do this take tons on pics and post them. Id love to see how you do it~! __________________ 1971 Chevy C10 Shortbed Stepside, 307v8 3-on-the-tree

01-23-2006, 02:07 PM	#16
woodridge Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Maynardville, Tn Posts: 3,030	Re: saginaw overdrive I have an 883 out of a 82 K-10 set up for a 208 transfer case if this helps anyone. __________________ SEMA Network- Protect our Hobby! 71 C30 in pieces, starting to come together. Click here for A Place For Tennessee Truck Enthusiest To Meet



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