budget build.. frame layin 83.. quest?

[bigbadjohn84]

I have a '83 SWB. I have researched numerous places. everyone has the same answer, but they don't have the $2,500.00 to give me for the "drop member". I have been reading on "pancaking" the front crossmember 1 and 1/4". I was thinking about a pancaked front crossmember and doing a 2 in Z. I want to be able to use a factory high hump carpet for my interior in the end. I want to retain a stock appearance to the floor. I have a high hump ready to go. anyone have any input on this. I am planning on cutting the Z at an angle so that when it moves up it will move the front suspension forward a little to center the wheels when laid out. I just want to lay out on some 20's and possibly retain factory air.. anyone did this combo? any pointers would be great.. thanks! reason why this is a budget build, is because as it stands, I have $30.00 in the whole thing at the moment lol! just a toy

[SCOTI]

I did a crossmember notch on my 68. I cut it for 1 3/8" & when I went to trim the c.members front lip/u-bolts for steering clearance, I got a big suprise. I had to grind off a BUNCH.... so much so that I opted to add .250" spacers for a final notch of 1 1/8" (which required less material ground off). I had read where some guys did 1.5" notches w/no problems. I figured the 1 3/8" notch would allow for a little extra clearance but it just wouldn't work w/my combination of parts.

That being said, a 1" notch w/the 2" 'Z' sounds like your best bet. It should get your rails on the ground w/the right dropped spindles & tire height. Trans tunnel clearance is dependant on the size of your trans (since some trannys are physically larger) but others have done a 'Z' w/a mildly re-worked tunnel that wasn't noticeable from the interior. The bigger trannys (th400/4l80e) will require more effort on the tunnel but should still go un-noticed.

Be sure & figure in your final tire height when planning. It's easier to do a 2.5 or 3" Z while your doing things vs. trying to figure out how to get that last .500" lower after you just completed the 2" 'Z'.
Dont forget . . ... post pics of your build!!

[daverod]

I just did my front cross member cost like $80 and 2 1/2 hrs. Lowered it 1 1/2"

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by daverod

I just did my front cross member cost like $80 and 2 1/2 hrs. Lowered it 1 1/2"

Any problems w/the steering clearance (drag-link & tie-rod end vs. c.member & u-bolts) as it swings through its arc of travel?

[daverod]

I'm sure I might have to do somthing. I don't have my dropped spindles yet so I don't know. I never looked at the other threads (the ones I got the idea from) to see what they ran into. Somthing to read this afternoon. The other trucks were different years then mine. It might be a good thing I have extra cross member.

[bigbadjohn84]

the biggest tire I would probably run in the front would be no more than 28". I may stagger the height a little from front to rear, but nothing drastic. I will prolly run my factory steelies till I get everything tied in, paint and body, etc, there is virtually NO body work to be done. the truck is absolutley straight as far as I can see. I'll be block sanding and priming a while though to get it xtra smooth. the engine and trans combo will prolly stay as is, factory 700R4 and 305 that was all rebuilt professionally a few years back, cranks and runs beautiful. I plan on using a 3" drop spindle, coupled with bags of course. what issues does it cause with steering combo? would I be better off notching and putting in a rack and pinion like from a mustang that I see so many of these "kits" do? how do you find adjusters to go from the mustang ends to the Chevy spindle?

[SCOTI]

The clearance issue is when the drag-link & tie-rods swing in their arc as the steering box turns. You have to grind part of the c.member lip & trim down the outer lower control arm cross-shaft u-bolts to prevent contact @ the inner tie-rod. Apparently some combinations of parts don't have as much issue as others.... which parts you have will determine the outcome.

If you feel comfortable setting up a R&P correctly, that would prob be the better way to go as it could eliminate potential bumpsteer issues. The other alternative is to do a 3" 'Z' & drop the motor down a little lower (modify the motor mount towers) for extra trans tunnel clearance. The 3" Z would only require the typical u-joint steering connections & maintain OE steering geometry.

[daverod]

Thanks Scoti. I'm looking forward to some more grinding.

[bigbadjohn84]

would a 3" Z lay out the frame with drop spindles and 28" tall tire? I am running a 700R4 in a 83 model. it has the "low" hump right now. I was hoping I could utilize the high hump from another truck. any experiance with moving the Z at an angle to center the wheels? the kits do that for you. just brainstorming here

[SCOTI]

I plotted out a Z cut @ an angle to move the spindles C/L forward while raising it @ the same time. I was about ready to start cutting when I decided to go w/a Dropmember. Nathan actually came to TX to deliver a few of them & hang out @ the GoodGuys show for a couple of days & took my frame back home w/him. Since then, I've bought 2 more DM's . .....

[bigbadjohn84]

hmmm.. $2,500 though.. for just the front crossmember, or am I wrong? just wanna keep things simple, and within reason. I mean if I get tired of this one, haha for once I'd like to get my money back lmao!!

[SCOTI]

Depends on how 'creative' you are when choosing parts. Stock arms & stuff will cut costs in a hurry but won't 'look' as nice. Base c.members are about $1200 plus shipping & you'll need the R&P. The crossmember comes w/everything needed for the install: motor mount towers, trans c.member, hardware for installing the R&P, frame gussets, R&P notches, tie-rod adapters, upper bag mounts, & lower bag plates for stock GM arms.

Time is money too. The Dropmember is well engineered & a quick install (I did my 1st one start to finish in an afternoon in my driveway). The DM also offers better geometry vs. OE @ the now much lower height.

A Z will get you there & is what I was going to do but the DM offers more than just saving money IMO.

[bigbadjohn84]

thats true. in the long run, I'd like a good handling and riding setup. may be an old rat rod, but Id like it to function with all the comforts

[Dinos63]

I have 3 d/m on the road and they work great, but i also have had a pancake cross member thats work well too, i had only to notch my upper drivers side control arm for the steering but if you are on the budget you have some more to do beside just installing d/m you may have to change your trans cross member,drive line,brake lines ,and maybe some exhaust

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by Dinos63

I have 3 d/m on the road and they work great, but i also have had a pancake cross member thats work well too, i had only to notch my upper drivers side control arm for the steering but if you are on the budget you have some more to do beside just installing d/m you may have to change your trans cross member,drive line,brake lines ,and maybe some exhaust

True on the other stuff that needs to be done. I didn't mention the driveline & exhaust because more than likely it would also need to be modified if he Z's his frame & notches the OE c.member. His truck is an 83 w/the prop valve located on the front splash apron. With some slight tweaking (around the R&P notches & driver side upper a-arm mount), I was able to re-use my 73-up brake lines w/the DM.

[bigbadjohn84]

just throwin the ideas around. I have a sweet picture in my head of the way I want it.. al it takes is a lil time and money.. that and blood sweat and tears lol... I have a good start. free is the best part. other than a totally rust free body and this morning I put a hot battery in it and a new ignition switch (previous owner lost the keys) fresh gas, and it runs GREAT!! thing has been sitting for AT LEAST two years if not more out in the elements. he stripped the doors, windshield, back glass, and took the bed off and started stripping it to bare metal like a dummy. he had no idea what he was doing. he got tired of looking at it in his yard and told me to come get it!! doesn't get much sweeter than that. so a drop member or a bagged suspension may be in it's future.. I just keep looking at the huge AC box in this thing, I am trying to figure how to lay out and still keep my AC. if I can't, Ill static drop the thing on some nice wheels.. how do you post pics on here? they are on my computer, do you have to have a photobucket account?

[bigbadjohn84]

this is how it stands at the moment.. bed looks worse than it is, a few hrs of media blasting and rust inhibitor, its straight though
[/IMG]

this is what I want it to look like in the end
[/IMG]

but all the trucks I see that look like this, have no AC in most cases unless it is some sort of under dash vintage AC set up..

[JohnC]

I would go with a Vintage Air system. It should solve your engine bay issues, and it really cleans things up.

[bigbadjohn84]

thanks. yea. I don't wanna buy a complete kit. I am going to eventually change to a 5.3 or 6.0 and I will have to have custom lines made anyhow to go into some sort of bulkhead in the firewall. one day at a time.. working on the bed now. gonna be lots of blocking and priming goin on..

[jmedero]

the best advice I got when I started my Nova project several years ago was to stop, figure out EXACTLY what I wanted to do. I had gotten 2 engines, 2 hoods and alot of wasted time and $$. Do your research and figure out what you want to do. By my count a chopped xmember, bags, spinles, and valves is going to run me about $1,000 to get some quality stuff. Then you still have to do the back. If your not sure about bags and the cost then save that $$ for the paint and engine swap. Just plan so you dont waste $$ like I have in the past. A good plan is worth its weight in GOLD!!

[bigbadjohn84]

yea. I've learned A LOT from past projects... geeze.. I've got over 5K in my 89 motor and trans alone.. I haven't even started body work and paint on it. it will be done first. I am just in the plotting stages of the 83 build. gonna be a while. I am thankful for all the input and ideas I can get though