NV4500 Conversion ?

[DBear]

Need some help here....I am gonna swap a NV4500 into a 68 K20, which right now has no driveline. My NV4500 came out of a 94-95 chevy truck. It has a transfer case still hooked to it (drivers side drop) which I think is a 241 or 208 maybe??? This wouldn't work since my pumpkin is on the pass side right? What are my options here? Should I switch out the front axle or get another transfer case? If so, is there any transfer cases that will just bolt up to this chevy NV4500, which would keep me from having to buy adapter kit?? Thanks in advance guys.

[lukefalls]

I don't know what kind of wheeling you do. If you use the 4wd for snow and back roads, then keep the transfer case that the 4500 already has. If you do hard wheeling, swap it for a 205 or better.

Advance Adapters sells a conversion tail shaft for the 4500 that will mate it to a GM NP205. For that matter, they make a tail conversion for any 205. Its expensive though.

I'd recommend that you swap front ends. Find either a Dana 44 (3/4 ton 8 lug) or Dana 60 from a 78-79 Ford F250/350. The 60 is hard to find, but well worth it. That is what I did. The 44 is not bad. Its got thicker tubes than a GM Dana 44 and much bigger brakes. Both will bolt right in to your GM. MAKE SURE that you get the spring plates with what ever axle you get. A Ford Dana 44 can be had for around $150.00, depending on condition. I've seen 60 prices as low as $1200, but 87+ GM guys want them for a SAS.

[DBear]

Originally Posted by lukefalls

I don't know what kind of wheeling you do. If you use the 4wd for snow and back roads, then keep the transfer case that the 4500 already has. If you do hard wheeling, swap it for a 205 or better.

Advance Adapters sells a conversion tail shaft for the 4500 that will mate it to a GM NP205. For that matter, they make a tail conversion for any 205. Its expensive though.

I'd recommend that you swap front ends. Find either a Dana 44 (3/4 ton 8 lug) or Dana 60 from a 78-79 Ford F250/350. The 60 is hard to find, but well worth it. That is what I did. The 44 is not bad. Its got thicker tubes than a GM Dana 44 and much bigger brakes. Both will bolt right in to your GM. MAKE SURE that you get the spring plates with what ever axle you get. A Ford Dana 44 can be had for around $150.00, depending on condition. I've seen 60 prices as low as $1200, but 87+ GM guys want them for a SAS.

So, I can buy a Ford dana 44 and just use this trans case? Will the leaf springs bolt up? I will need 8 lug....are they easy to come by?

[DBear]

Originally Posted by lukefalls

I don't know what kind of wheeling you do. If you use the 4wd for snow and back roads, then keep the transfer case that the 4500 already has. If you do hard wheeling, swap it for a 205 or better.

Advance Adapters sells a conversion tail shaft for the 4500 that will mate it to a GM NP205. For that matter, they make a tail conversion for any 205. Its expensive though.

I'd recommend that you swap front ends. Find either a Dana 44 (3/4 ton 8 lug) or Dana 60 from a 78-79 Ford F250/350. The 60 is hard to find, but well worth it. That is what I did. The 44 is not bad. Its got thicker tubes than a GM Dana 44 and much bigger brakes. Both will bolt right in to your GM. MAKE SURE that you get the spring plates with what ever axle you get. A Ford Dana 44 can be had for around $150.00, depending on condition. I've seen 60 prices as low as $1200, but 87+ GM guys want them for a SAS.

This might be a dumb question....if I find a 78-79 ford, it would to be a 4x4 right?

[lukefalls]

Yes, the Dana 44 will bolt right up. Its the same spring width. NOT ALL 78-79 Fords are 4x4. You'll know if its 4x4. The 2wd trucks are a type of IFS call Twin Traction Beam (TTB). The 4x4 will have a similar looking axle to what you've got, but the differential is on the other side.

The biggest difference in the Ford Dana 44 and you GM Dana 44 is the location of the differential.

***NOTE: You DO NOT want a 78-79 Ford F150 Dana 44*** Its only 5 lug. You don't want a Dana 44 from anything older than a 78 Ford. It has to be 78 or 79

[DBear]

Originally Posted by lukefalls

Yes, the Dana 44 will bolt right up. Its the same spring width. NOT ALL 78-79 Fords are 4x4. You'll know if its 4x4. The 2wd trucks are a type of IFS call Twin Traction Beam (TTB). The 4x4 will have a similar looking axle to what you've got, but the differential is on the other side.

The biggest difference in the Ford Dana 44 and you GM Dana 44 is the location of the differential.

***NOTE: You DO NOT want a 78-79 Ford F150 Dana 44*** Its only 5 lug. You don't want a Dana 44 from anything older than a 78 Ford. It has to be 78 or 79

ok, thanks bud. My NV4500 came with the bellhousing still attached, will it work with a small block chevy or chevy straight 6 (like the 292 or smaller).

[grayharville]

Im 99 percent sure you could snag a transfer case from a dodge with the nv4500 and it be pass. Side drop. It'll bolt right up to the chevy nv4500

Then you wouldn't have to swap axles and worry about the gear ratios not matching
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[lukefalls]

Careful with the Dodge stuff. Dodge uses a different output shaft. I have no idea what it takes to swap it to a GM shaft.

[ghettoluxury]

Your easiest option is to get a 208 that is married to a 400 turbo it has the same 32 splines shaft as your nv4500 and should bolt up to the transfer case adapter that is on the 4500. This will give you a pass side drop and let you retain your factory axle.

[DBear]

Originally Posted by ghettoluxury

Your easiest option is to get a 208 that is married to a 400 turbo it has the same 32 splines shaft as your nv4500 and should bolt up to the transfer case adapter that is on the 4500. This will give you a pass side drop and let you retain your factory axle.

Yeah....I did some homework and decided to go the 208 route. Went to look at one today but the guy was not realistic, he wanted 350.00 and didn't wanna budge. I thought that was real high but what do I know!
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[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by ghettoluxury

Your easiest option is to get a 208 that is married to a 400 turbo it has the same 32 splines shaft as your nv4500 and should bolt up to the transfer case adapter that is on the 4500. This will give you a pass side drop and let you retain your factory axle.

Exactly!

Or a Chevrolet 241 from a ’87-‘89 SFA square body style truck or Suburban with a TH400 or SM465. That will be a 32 spline and will bolt right up to the NV4500 like it was made for it. It is an expensive proposition bolting a NP205 to a NV4500. Went through that last year. I will absolutely just keep the 241 whenever I convert my Suburban to a NV4500.

[ghettoluxury]

Originally Posted by DBear

Yeah....I did some homework and decided to go the 208 route. Went to look at one today but the guy was not realistic, he wanted 350.00 and didn't wanna budge. I thought that was real high but what do I know!
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$350 is very high! I can get them for $150 around here.

[grayharville]

Tommy, I have a np208/th400 combo sitting here. Give me a call.
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[yousesteers]

I dont know about the Chevy NV4500 to a 205 transfer but if the splines count is the same and the transfer case has the round bolt adapter on the front it should work fine. I did this on my cummins conversion truck I am running the NV4500 behid the cummins and a NP 205 transfer case My set up is 29 spline but everything bolted up great I did have to take the rear seal out of the transmission and put gaskets in the adaptor plate the front seal on the transfer case will keep them from swapping fluids.

[jpmanyhearts]

ok so the np208 is in the square body's so what is in the 98 chevy truck ?

[Zane M]

Originally Posted by DBear

Yeah....I did some homework and decided to go the 208 route. Went to look at one today but the guy was not realistic, he wanted 350.00 and didn't wanna budge. I thought that was real high but what do I know!
Posted via Mobile Device

"Realistic" comes down to how bad you need it.
A 208 with the right spline count shouldn't be "rare", but it seems for every hundred you run across, 99 are the wrong spline count.

I recently paid 350.00 for a 208 to mate to my TH400 after my axle got shifted back and drove the front driveshaft into the Tcase, cracking it.

Sucked to have to pay a scalpers price, but I had to get this truck on the road ASAP.

[83GMCK2500]

Originally Posted by jpmanyhearts

ok so the np208 is in the square body's so what is in the 98 chevy truck ?

81-91 squares used NP205, NP208, and NP241 with passenger side front output. The 241 replaced the 208 in the late 80s (don't know exact year), it has better oiling, 6-pinion planetary, few other upgrades over the 208. (In late '90 and '91 these t-cases have VSS instead of cable drive)

88-95 GMT-400 trucks used a driver's side drop NP241, Borg-Warner 4401 or B-W 4470. The latter two found in K3500s. The B-W cases have PTO provisions.

96+ GMT-400 still had the NP241, an electric shift version the NP243, the two B-W cases, and later in the run they added the NP246, still a part-time electric shifted case, but it had an "Auto" function in the control. The Auto 4WD used a variety of inputs to control a set of clutches in the t-case that would engage/disengage front output as needed.

[jpmanyhearts]

ok so I am putting a 1998 chevy vortec into a 1968 chevy truck it has the nv4500 but I have a passengerside drop it has the drivers side drop I want to use all the electronics but if I do this I will need to cut the front suspension off the 98 and graft it onto the 68 also I like the idea of having ifs in the front so a friend of mine has a early 90s suburban frame hes going to give me but I will need to add 10 inches to the frame plus I will need to make mounts for everything man this is turning into a nightmare

[DirtyLarry]

Originally Posted by jpmanyhearts

ok so I am putting a 1998 chevy vortec into a 1968 chevy truck it has the nv4500 but I have a passengerside drop it has the drivers side drop I want to use all the electronics but if I do this I will need to cut the front suspension off the 98 and graft it onto the 68 also I like the idea of having ifs in the front so a friend of mine has a early 90s suburban frame hes going to give me but I will need to add 10 inches to the frame plus I will need to make mounts for everything man this is turning into a nightmare

You don’t need to go to such drastic measures to do a NV4500 in an old solid front axle truck. Using the GMT400 IFS frame is a horrible idea. Later model IFS chassis never look quite right when used under classic trucks as the track is too wide. The body mounts will be 10 miles off from being anywhere close to being usable. Using a frame like that sounds like a great way to ruin a nice ’68 truck if you ask me.

It is not difficult to find a 32 spline 208 or 241 from a square body style truck, Blazer, or Suburban with a TH400 or SM465. Those will bolt right on to the NV4500 with no adapters. Ideally, a 1989 NP241 from a Suburban is a great tranfercase as it is a 241 with the internal upgrades 83GMCK2500 mentioned, plus it uses a mechanical speedo cable instead of VSS. Starting in 1990 they went VSS (you don't need VSS for a 1998 5.7L or 7.4L Vortec swap when running a manual trans either). An ’85-’91 round pattern 205 would be ideal as well but they can be hard to find and probably overkill for what you need, especially given the fact you mentioned considering using a later model IFS chassis. If you are considering something hacky like that….you don’t need a 205.

Check out the NV4500 swap into my ’89 V2500 Suburban that was originally a SM465 4 speed manual. The NV4500 was a direct bolt in for this truck where I even reused the original 241 transfercase and driveshafts. The NV4500 swap starts on post 107.

[jpmanyhearts]

thank you dirty larry I guess I'm overthinking this a little when I had my 69 and my wife rode with me it was like a wagon she has degenerative disc disease so I was thinking that the ifs would give her a softer ride but I think your right it would look a little hokey under there and I'm thinking since its so long of a truck it will ride good with a straight axel. Ive also been getting a lot of input on an 89 transfer case so it just the 89 I'm looking for ? or the 89 is the second choice and im looking for a 86-88 ? also would it be possible to flip the front axel to make it a drivers side drop ?

[jpmanyhearts]

I think I located one its an 89 suburban a guy took it to pacific steel and recycling my friend will go by tomorrow and see if he can get it btw does it need to be manual or auto or does it matter ?

[83GMCK2500]

81-early 90 (I've seen cable driven speedos in early 90), overall. Your "first choice" is the NP241, followed by the NP208 (for the record I've got ~500,000 miles on an NP208 in a truck that was very well maintained and was used on a farm as it was needed, there isn't anything wrong with them, GM needed a t-case to fit into a higher GVWR category = enter the 241.) It is also worthy to note that both Dirty Larry and I keep saying Suburban as a source, when in fact Suburban, K5 and V-series pickups are all viable sources for a transfer case.

For a driver's drop there is a year range of F*rd configured Dana axles that are within a 1/2" of GM's spring perch spacing for 73-87(91), I am not familiar enough with the < 72' trucks to know if they will also fit in there. I don't yet follow why you want a driver's drop, as it opens up the worm can labeled "driver's side drop transfer cases are all electronic speedo".

Will you be lifting this truck? With regard to your wife's comfort there are several avenues you can persue to improve the quality of ride on the truck. Use OEM rubber bushings in all of the suspension, fresh rubber in the cab mounts, quality shock absorbers and leaf springs. You can have a new/modern set of leaf springs made that will ride considerably better than what GM built 40+ years ago. For 73-87(91) owners we can even swap in longer front springs which, among other things, offer a better ride. It may be possible for you as well.

Hope you don't mind that I answered, I see now that you had directed your questions at DirtyLarry.

[83GMCK2500]

Originally Posted by jpmanyhearts

I think I located one its an 89 suburban a guy took it to pacific steel and recycling my friend will go by tomorrow and see if he can get it btw does it need to be manual or auto or does it matter ?

Manual/auto in regards to transmission? Manual will be the direct swap 32-spline, auto (TH400) will be 32-spline, but auto (700R4) is 27 spline. You *could* get a 27-spline version and swap the input gear, I've done that and it is kinda fun to disassemble the t-case and inspect everything, & reseal it.

[jpmanyhearts]

heres a guy that has one from an 88 I think its an automatic ill ask but this will work correct ???

[DirtyLarry]

Sure that will work, but you will need to have a front driveshaft built and balanced with two 90 degree bends in order for it to reach from the driver’s side output on the tcase to the passenger’s side pinion on the front axle.

Notice anything odd about your picture vs. the NP241 in my ’89 Burb below? Whoever is selling that tcase obviously has it mismarked. Looks like an ’88 truck transfercase with IFS instead of an ’88 Burb which has a solid front axle. The front outputs are on different sides