Diesel Power Options

[Edahall]

Originally Posted by special-K

I've run 6.2s and 6.5s for over a quarter century. I'm a cast in stone GM man. But,I'd take a Cummins engine in a Chevy or GMC any day. They have their popularity from being tried and true. The 6BT was in service before Dodge ever put one in their crap buckets. What's played out is all the diesel performance hype. All these young chumps with smoke stacks and attitudes. I went diesel for torque,economy,low maintenance,and longevity. What do you need over 500hp for in a truck for? A diesel truck is for towing your gas powered race car. I grew up with high performance gas motors and that still what I love. I can blow away a pumped up diesel on my 110hp Harley and I'll take "that" sound of two cylinders @7,000 rpm over the moan of a diesel pickup any day. I think a 4bt is a wise transplant to bring a classic truck into practical daily use. You'll never get 28 mpg out of a V8 diesel. And,you can add more hp w/o hurting it. I've had them all...stock 6.2s,stock 6.5TDs,6.2 w/Banks Sidewinder,and 6.5TD Peninsular Marine 18:1 intercooled 325hp. I still have one each of the first two listed and love them for being what their intended purposes were and still are. I have also taken a 6.2 and added a fresh air intake,enlarged air filter housing/filter,and 3" exhaust which really woke it up. I am happy with the stock 6.2 power. I think headers are a great idea and hope to get some for my '85 Jimmy...then a 3" exhaust system. I figure that's added power that also helps the health of the engine by allowing exhaust gases to escape faster keeping the head temps down.

You sum it up very well. The 6.2 was an excellent engine for it's intended purpose of providing excellent fuel economy in a light duty pickup. Keep in mind, when the 6.2 introduced in 1982, it had a power rating of 130 hp @ 3,600 rpm / 240 lb·ft @ 2,000 rpm. The red 82 block probably also had the strongest bottom end amongst all the GM production 6.2/6.5's due to it's high nickle content. Later on, power became a higher priority than fuel economy so GM increased the precombustion chambers size on the heads several times over the years and slapped on a turbo to give it more power. By the time the 6.5L ended production, power was up to 215 hp. However, both fuel economy and long time reliability plunged. Instead of strengthening the weak bottom end, they thinned it out in 1997 to install piston oil squirters. Unfortunately, bottom end cracks is what plagues this engine. However, keeping the power output down to where it was originally designed for and always keeping on a good harmonic balancer does help a lot to keep these engines alive.

That said, my 1982 6.2L Suburban still has the original motor and is pushing 500k miles. It has been such an excellent motor that it's going to outlast the Suburban.

[Edahall]

Originally Posted by Cheng

I'm going to be looking for a Turbo 6.5L with Mechanical Injection from 92-93.

I was never going for amazing power levels, I just need a little bit more to pull the boat around town and get it up the boat ramp more comfortably.

Starting every traffic light in granny gear (L) and having to wind out the engine in second gear before shifting into third so it doesn't lug makes me uncomfortable.

Having looked at it i think a 92-93 6.5L with the early NV4500 will provide what i am looking for.

What's your reason for changing out the 6.2L in your truck to a 6.5L? There are very few differences between the two. What gives the 6.5L more power over the 6.2L are larger precombustion chambers on the heads and a turbo. You can definitely make these 2 modifications to your existing 6.2L and come out with very similar power levels to the 6.5L.

If you do decide to install a 6.5L, check carefully for bottom end cracks in the webbing area before buying. I've rejected too many otherwise good engines because of this.

[nekkidhillbilly]

i dont think your going to blow away a truely pumped up diesel on a harley. not unless your harley does 12-11 sec 1/4s and will run 138 mph just saying.

[Cheng]

Special-K what did you think of peinsular diesel's product and customer service.

I talked to them about a new P400 engine 260HP and just interested in your thoughts about them.

[Cheng]

Edahall - I think i might be cheaper to find a complete 6.5 turbo engine thn buy the turbo arts seperate.

I'll just keep my eyes open for the full setup and hope to get lucky.

[special-K]

Originally Posted by nekkidhillbilly

i dont think your going to blow away a truely pumped up diesel on a harley. not unless your harley does 12-11 sec 1/4s and will run 138 mph just saying.

Well,like I said,I have. And,I turn 11s in the 1/4 mile. I've never raced a diesel truck on the track. My point is,I ride a motorcycle (and hot rods) for fun and enjoy driving and hauling in my diesel trucks. I have a K3500 work truck that pays my bills and a fun off road toy (Jimmy) that is just as great on the hiway getting there. I love my diesels,but there was a time in the '90s I went a spell driving nothing but diesels,I had three then,and I really missed driving my good ole '72 Chevy with Quadrajet,Headers/dual exhaust,cam,etc. I love winding out a gas motor and don't ever want to live w/o it. I'm building a hot little '67 shortbed 327/4spd/posi truck and when that's done I may go with a diesel in my '72 K2500.
Anyway,back to square bodies with diesels. I remember the first guy on The Diesel Page who put a Cummins in a CUCV 1008 with an overdrive transmission and I thought that was the ultimate truck. When it comes to diesels I look at it the way heavy trucks are...you choose your drivetrain under whatever truck you like. Dodge and Ford never built a diesel truck...only GM. Those guys had to get someone else to build theirs after GM came out with one in a pickup. That's the perspective you need to put the 6.2 in. GM came up with a solution. Ford and Dodge had to come up with something.

[JPalmer81]

Good thread Cheng! I am looking at getting some good power out of my newly acquired 88 Chevy 1 ton with the 6.2L, and gonna do some research on it, but i am thinking that for under $1000, i could put headers and 3" pipes through some 3" glass packs and get great power increases and better fuel economy. Being new to diesels myself, i have been reading article after article on this. Also, going with 6.5L injectors and turning up your injector pump will help too. Banks claims 60 more horses and 115 more ft/lbs, but i think that might be stretching it a little, just according to what ive read. Some of you that have done it can chime in here. Sounds like Special-K knows what he is talking about, and i like what he says about the headers and exhaust. IMO, i would save your money, unless u just like to hear the whistle of the turbo, but for your money i think the Header/Exhaust combo is ur best bet.

[manimal]

I dont think you're going to see much of a performance gain in the 6.2 with headers. They dont move that much air. Check out http://www.dieselplace.com/

[86c20]

i think that you should also look into the detroit 453t same power as a 6bt but it is a gm motor and it is 2 stroke also so there is a cool factor there and it has been done a few times. just my .02

[JPalmer81]

Originally Posted by 86c20

i think that you should also look into the detroit 453t same power as a 6bt but it is a gm motor and it is 2 stroke also so there is a cool factor there and it has been done a few times. just my .02

I've seen some of these builds on youtube, and i gotta say, they are frickin awesome!!!! the sound of an old detroit is unmatched by anyone!!! and i am sure you could get a heck of alot of power out of one of those beasts. there is a nice detroit motor up here in anchorage on craigslist: http://anchorage.craigslist.org/pts/2902266801.html would love to have this to make some sick truck with!!

[JPalmer81]

Originally Posted by manimal

I dont think you're going to see much of a performance gain in the 6.2 with headers. They dont move that much air. Check out http://www.dieselplace.com/

I appreciate your suggestion, and i went to the page u refered me too and couldnt find too much on it, so i started my own thread on it!! i would love to have a turbo, but $2400!!!!! i mean c'mon, that is steep!!

[86c20]

jpalmer that motor is not a 2 stroke that is the big brother to the 6.2 it was part of the fuel pincher line they had at the time. i have seen one done in a burben 1 ton but it is a 2000lb motor lot of weight for 200hp and 500tq if i remember righ a 453t is 200ish hp and 600tq??? and weighs about 800lbs or go for the big boy the 6v53 and have 300hp and 800+tq but that is 15-1800lbs. but you can get the bellhouseing for a gm trans both sm465 and the mid rang trans. i am starting to get the parts to do my swap

[68Timber]

Originally Posted by JPalmer81

I appreciate your suggestion, and i went to the page u refered me too and couldnt find too much on it, so i started my own thread on it!! i would love to have a turbo, but $2400!!!!! i mean c'mon, that is steep!!

I got a used turbo and RH manifold for $175. Shop used 6.5 turbo parts to bolt on the 6.2.

[nekkidhillbilly]

Originally Posted by special-K

Well,like I said,I have. And,I turn 11s in the 1/4 mile. I've never raced a diesel truck on the track. My point is,I ride a motorcycle (and hot rods) for fun and enjoy driving and hauling in my diesel trucks. I have a K3500 work truck that pays my bills and a fun off road toy (Jimmy) that is just as great on the hiway getting there. I love my diesels,but there was a time in the '90s I went a spell driving nothing but diesels,I had three then,and I really missed driving my good ole '72 Chevy with Quadrajet,Headers/dual exhaust,cam,etc. I love winding out a gas motor and don't ever want to live w/o it. I'm building a hot little '67 shortbed 327/4spd/posi truck and when that's done I may go with a diesel in my '72 K2500.
Anyway,back to square bodies with diesels. I remember the first guy on The Diesel Page who put a Cummins in a CUCV 1008 with an overdrive transmission and I thought that was the ultimate truck. When it comes to diesels I look at it the way heavy trucks are...you choose your drivetrain under whatever truck you like. Dodge and Ford never built a diesel truck...only GM. Those guys had to get someone else to build theirs after GM came out with one in a pickup. That's the perspective you need to put the 6.2 in. GM came up with a solution. Ford and Dodge had to come up with something.

new diesels are animals though my 04 runs 13s just with a chip still can pull 16k and gets 20 mpg. and gm didnt build the 6.2 or 6.5 diesel detriot diesel built it or had a big hand in it. even the duramax is only half built by gm. ford actually prob built theres since they own international nad have since the 80s. not sure its a good thing since there track record is junk.

[nekkidhillbilly]

again im not dissing th e 6.2 or 6.5 and would own one but i would a ctd also. duramax be the best diesel ive drove. to bad its not in a square truck.

[manimal]

GM did build their own diesel,it was the 350 olds diesel. Also they designed the 6.2/6.5. Ford and Dodge had to design their trucks around an already existing engine. Ford owned Cummins also.

[68Timber]

This isn't meant to be gas on the fire, I hope the discussion stays civil. I picked up a 6.5 turbo for my 6.2 and was trying to find the stock output of a 1999 6.5. Anyway, I found this build and thought I'd share: http://www.thedieselpage.com/finale.htm

[ElGracho]

Originally Posted by nekkidhillbilly

... and gm didnt build the 6.2 or 6.5 diesel detriot diesel built it or had a big hand in it. even the duramax is only half built by gm. ford actually prob built theres since they own international nad have since the 80s. not sure its a good thing since there track record is junk.

From its inception in 1965 until the Penske spinoff in 1988, Detroit Diesel = GM.

Ford does not and never has owned International or Navistar.

Ford does not own Cummins either. They had ~10% ownership in Cummins through a stock purchase for a short time.

Ford has been building it's own Diesel engines for a couple years now, not using International built Powerstrokes mostly due to the problems with the 6.0 liter.

So yeah, GM saw the market for the light duty pickup with a diesel engine and built and sold a whole bunch of them. Like many have said, if used for what they were designed for, the 6.2 liter diesels are a great powerplant.

[nekkidhillbilly]

your right they shared partenership like gm and isuzu did with the duramax platform. i understand where your comming from its like when someone takes a buick olds pontiac caddilac and jerks out the engine for sbc 350 yeah its cheap and makes power cheap but no nostalgia. kinda dissapoints you. however say swapping a duramax is like swapping buick 300 for a 455. as for detriot in 1988 thats pretty much knocks out the 6.5.

[turbo350]

Fyi there is a squarebody with a 6.2 and Banks turbo kit f/s on CL I think somewhere in Montana, or Wyoming.

[andrewmp6]

Yeah the 6.7 powerstroke is all ford now,If you want a laugh the l600 and f600 ford trucks of the late 80s and early 90s ran a 12 valve cummins in them.

[nekkidhillbilly]

i remember the school buses that had them