RnD Fabrication- Manufacuring Error/Warranty Problems/Dirty Dealing

[theastronaut]

I bought a radiator from RnD fabrication after finding Sparky's posts here on the forum in the vendor section. The radiator was for a '51 GMC with a 5.3 swapped in and an automatic transmission. In every picture (on here, ebay, and RnD's website) the radiator was shown as having a filler neck welded onto the back of the upper tank on a 90* tube, similar to the original radiator's filler neck. The neck has to be there to clear the upper radiator cover. There was nothing in the item description that stated that the filler neck would be in any other location. The warranty policy stated that manufacturing defects would be covered for one year, and that any damage from shipping would need to be reported within ten days. Upon reciveing the radiator I inspected it for damage (there was none) and boxed it back up until it was needed. I bought the radiator along with a ton of other parts at the beginning of the restoration.


Here is the picture that is in all of RnD's listings with the filler neck in the correct location, and also a link to the vendor ad here.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=628628




Here is a picture of the radiator I recieved. The filler neck is in the wrong location, under the upper radiator cover where it can't be accessed. The upper cover also wouldn't drop into place due to it hitting the filler neck. Cutting the shroud would be the only way to use the radiator; the ad stated that no cutting would be necessary.




I emailed Sparky to attempt to resolve the issue since it was obviously a manufacturing defect and supposedly covered under the one year warranty. He offered to send us a filler neck for $35 plus shipping. I replied saying that I shouldn't have to pay to fix a warranty issue; Sparky replied "if you'll cover the $10 in shipping, I'll cover the cost of the replacement neck. Fair enough?" I replied and said that "fair" would be for RnD to honor their warranty. I didn't recieved a response, so I posted here on the vendor listing in an attempt to continue communication.


This is where the shady dealing started. Sparky changed the item description, policy, and warranty descriptions so that the radiator was no longer covered under the warranty, stating that I didn't notify them of the problem until after the ten day period listed in the warranty/policies.


Sparky's response:

Per our site's terms and conditions, it is noted that it is the customer's responsibility to notify us within 10 days of receiving the radiator with any issues they have with the port locations / fill neck locations / etc. We were notified about this concern at the 5 month mark, well outside the required timeframe. We do our best to work with customers when concerns arrive, and are willing to help even though it's well outside that timeframe. Also, placement of items is not covered under warranty, as that is reserved for component failures (leaks / broken welds / etc). I'm more than happy to send you the neck, and I'll even cover the cost of shipping as I know my response time has been slower as of late due to workload. If that works, let me know and I'll send it out shortly.

That didn't sound right to me, so I did a google search and pulled up cached pages of RnD's website. I found that RnD had changed their item description, warranty, and polices to exclude our problem form being covered under warrenty even though nobody would ever order a radiator with the filler neck in a location that isn't servicable without cutting the original sheetmetal.


Here are the original item description, warranty, and polices pages. According to these pages the improper filler neck would have been covered under warranty. These pages were edited well *after* I originally contacted them about the problem. This is a cached page (dated 2/2/18) that anyone can view via a google search. I first contacted RnD about the problem on 1/17/18, well before they edited their website.


No mention of "default filler location" on top of the upper tank.




The current/edited item description, stating that the default filler neck is on top of the upper tank (where it's impossible to fill??). No one would order a radiator made this way... I feel like this was edited just to get around fixing the filler neck under warranty.





The original warranty description (cached page again). No mention of needing to report manufacture's defects within ten days.




The current/edited warranty description. Notice that filler neck location is now listed as not being covered.




I don't have a problem with a company changing their warranty, policy, or item descriptions... just don't do it to get out of fixing what is obviously a manufacture's error that should be covered under the original stated warranty/policy. Thats' dirty. Currently RnD's item description states "This is a bolt-in swap, no cutting or sheet metal modifications required" and "Standard layout is with fill neck is on top"... you be the judge if this makes any sense, since the cap is UNDER the upper radiator cover as seen in the pic I posted. You'd have to cut the upper cover to access the cap.


RnD never attmepted to fix the problem other than offering to send us a filler neck. Filler necks don't simply bolt on... offering a new neck is not a fix to the problem. They also made no response when I called them out on editing their warrany, policy, and item description to get out of fixing the radiator under the original warranty (which was still posted in their ebay listing at the time, so it should have been current).

I ended up having the radiator fixed at a local radiator shop which cost us $90 bucks.





I won't be doing any business with RnD in the future, and I hope others will think twice before ordering a radiator from them. After looking up reviews for RnD on google I'm not the only one to have customer service issues when there were problems.

I'm also disappointed that a vendor on this site can handle a situation in such poor manner and still be allowed to advertise here.

[flashed]

Thanks for the heads up , I need a radiator for my 70 but will look elsewhere now .

[jhrusk]

Thanks for the heads up on this. Good to know as I have considered ordering from them.

[Steve Cole]

It seems other members here have had very bad dealings with them as well.

Can we not get these bad vendors banned from this site? How many more people have to get screwed over?

We need a "feedback rating" system like EBay uses or something!

[theastronaut]

Originally Posted by Steve Cole

It seems other members here have had very bad dealings with them as well.

Can we not get these bad vendors banned from this site? How many more people have to get screwed over?

We need a "feedback rating" system like EBay uses or something!

I PM'd Josh a couple times to let him know RnD doesn't take care of their mistakes. Unfortunately I never heard back from Josh and RnD is still able to post their radiators here.

[Steve Cole]

Originally Posted by theastronaut

I PM'd Josh a couple times to let him know RnD doesn't take care of their mistakes. Unfortunately I never heard back from Josh and RnD is still able to post their radiators here.

That is a shame. Sorry for your bad dealings with those guys.

[SparkyRnD]

We have a very very small number of unhappy customers in 10 years (7-10), with tons of happy customers. I made a fair offer to you after an extended period of time after receiving your order, and then you started threatening that if you didn't get your way you were going to give me negative reviews online. I am always willing to take care of my customers, and am a very reasonable person, but wont continue with people who resort to threats or leaving negative reviews.

[95 S_Trucker]

Originally Posted by SparkyRnD

We have a very very small number of unhappy customers in 10 years (7-10), with tons of happy customers. I made a fair offer to you after an extended period of time after receiving your order, and then you started threatening that if you didn't get your way you were going to give me negative reviews online. I am always willing to take care of my customers, and am a very reasonable person, but wont continue with people who resort to threats or leaving negative reviews.

Being reasonable would have been giving the buyer a full refund and a return shipping label to send it back, or giving the buyer the correct radiator and a return shipping label to send the other one back.

It is not the buyers fault the radiator you sent did not match the description on your website.

It is not the buyers fault you were trying to scoot around on your own warranty.

You should not be falsely advertising.

[theastronaut]

Originally Posted by SparkyRnD

We have a very very small number of unhappy customers in 10 years (7-10), with tons of happy customers. I made a fair offer to you after an extended period of time after receiving your order, and then you started threatening that if you didn't get your way you were going to give me negative reviews online. I am always willing to take care of my customers, and am a very reasonable person, but wont continue with people who resort to threats or leaving negative reviews.

You originally offered to send us a filler neck at a cost of $35 plus shipping to fix your mistake that was obviously covered under the original one year warranty, before you edited it to get around fixing it.

If you believe that's a "fair offer" then that's all anyone needs to know about your business practices. Also, it's sad that you feel like you needed to throw the word "threatened" in there, making it sound like you are the victim here. I said that I'd post an honest review because people need to know the truth of how you treat your customers when you mess up. If the truth happens to be negative then that's your own fault.

[SparkyRnD]

We discussed it and realize theastronaut had a legitimate problem. We reached out and took care of the cost of fixing the neck issue.

[theastronaut]

Sparky emailed us and said he realized we had a legitimate problem with the filler neck, apologized, and sent a refund to cover our cost of having the neck fixed locally. I appreciate you making things right!

[mdelosrey]

Just my opinion, the "realization" should have been fairly immediate. Its not a very complicated matter. Item description and picture is incorrect, replace with correct item. I understand mistakes are made but deliberate hesitation in correcting an issue is a negative sign for me. There are options out there, I'm in search of a LS swap radiator and will pull the trigger once I find a company that has the best customer service.

[DADS1971]

Vendors need to realize that the products they sell are most of the time not immediately installed on the vehicle. An obvious manufacturing mistake should have been corrected immediately by returning the radiator for a replacement that was correct. A lot of vendors have pictures of products that are not exactly what you are buying. They should explain what they are selling and not mislead the buyer. If you say it should fit a certain vehicle and it doesn't, the vendor should make it right. A friend of mine bought a major manufacturers radiator and it came bent. The top tank was crooked from the bottom tank. They sent a new radiator and told my friend to keep the bent one. My friends and I in our club went through hurricane Katrina and we had a vendor say they would rebuild a steering column free of charge and they sent a new one instead. We did have one vendor tell us they couldn't rebuild their own column and to buy a new one, no discount or anything. (Flaming River) Just research who you are dealing with. Big companies have a better relationship with their customers and usually no problems. Sorry for the long post, but this topic hit a sore spot.

[my kids toy]

I emailed them just this week to get price on shipping and price on a bung welded in for temp with the relay kit, and I did not want the steam vent welded in, they wanted to charge $25 to weld a bung in but did not want to knock anything off for not welding the steam port in, I then told them for $80 more I could get a entropy, they came back and bad mouthed entropy and said they use epoxy and plastics and their welds were far superior. after seeing this post I am glad I did not buy from them.

[1971Stepside]

I was going to order a radiator from R n D for my LS swap, but I tried to get an answer on their fan amperage pull. I was also ordering my wiring harness and they wanted to know for the relays. It took way too long to get an answer. I ordered the Entropy and now I'm glad I paid the little extra to do so.

Like someone stated. These projects take a while to build. I don't want to have an issue a year from now and wonder if I can even get an email response back to a question.

[SparkyRnD]

You had emailed us on Saturday the 15th (note that we're a small shop, and closed on the weekends). I replied to you on Tuesday the 18th with the amperage pull (had to get that info from our supplier, which I requested on Monday, and they responded to me on Tuesday at 2pm). I'm sorry that you felt that was way too long to reply, but 1.5 business days shouldn't be considered a long amount of time. But I'm glad you got taken care of, even if it was elsewhere.

[1971Stepside]

Yes and no. I initially requested the specs for the fans on the 11th. You did respond back on the 11th concerning the connections, but no specs for the fans. I had stated in that initial email that I was trying to order my harness and felt I communicated the urgency in obtaining that information. If I did not I apologize. I felt that you should have known the specs of your product from the start and could have supplied that quickly. I did not know you were having to go back to your supplier to find out what you were selling. I don't want to cast stones if they aren't warranted. Best of luck Sparky.