"Z" the frame or section crossmember

[bagged69c10]

Im not sure what size my tire is exactly, Ill check tonight, they are a little smaller than a stock dodge 20. So dont use upper plates? Ive heard not to use lower plates but I thought you were suppost to use the uppers?

[1low1967]

heres some of my handy work

[fastbagged68]

If you ditch the top plate you will have to get a cup for the upper mount and cut it to lay out your crossmember. Other option is to get a smaller 20" tire. If your tire is about the same size as whats on a dodge ram 20 it is a 275-55-20 = 31.9 " Drop your tire size to 28" and I guarantee it will lay the crossmember.

[loweredd]

Originally Posted by fastbagged68

If you ditch the top plate you will have to get a cup for the upper mount and cut it to lay out your crossmember. Other option is to get a smaller 20" tire. If your tire is about the same size as whats on a dodge ram 20 it is a 275-55-20 = 31.9 " Drop your tire size to 28" and I guarantee it will lay the crossmember.

Dont worry about the crossmember, Z the frame, and be done with it. Mine layed out with a 32" tall tire.

[bagged69c10]

How much did you Z yours?

[loweredd]

Measure, Measure, Measure, Measure, Measure, Cut, Weld.

www.loweredd.com

Go to Frame Z

[bagged69c10]

I think my tires are 275/45/20 or 275/40/20.

[loweredd]

Originally Posted by bagged69c10

I think my tires are 275/45/20 or 275/40/20.

275/45/20 is what is on mine. They will lay NO PROBLEM. Just get to the shop and start cutting already man!!!

[bagged69c10]

My shop also happens to be my driveway so I really need to make sure I know what Im doing before I tear into it.

[DM310]

then do this. buy a extra crossmember and chop it. when you are done you can take a day to swap it out then you can see if its good enough. if not then z the frame.

[BK]

mines z-ed 4", got the idea from loweredd, just buck up and do it, its easy, and you can be way low on big rims, mine should lay on 22's with small tires until i decide to biuld a full frame.

[SCOTI]

How many miles have you each put on your vehicle since you did this "piece of cake" modification?

[SkyBlue72']

YES, I also want to know how many miles have you all put on your vehicles with either a z'ed frame or a chopped crossmember or both?

[loweredd]

Originally Posted by SCOTI

How many miles have you each put on your vehicle since you did this "piece of cake" modification?

Are you implying I cant weld?

Before I had the 20's on there during the winter, I probably put 5000 miles on it.

Why do you ask?

[loweredd]

How is this NOT a piece of cake modification? It's just about the same thing as putting in a rear notch!

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by loweredd

Are you implying I cant weld?
Before I had the 20's on there during the winter, I probably put 5000 miles on it. Why do you ask?

No. I'm not implying anything. I asked simply for verification of actual road testing after completion of this mod.
I was mainly curious of any pitfalls that might have been discovered.

Originally Posted by loweredd

How is this NOT a piece of cake modification? It's just about the same thing as putting in a rear notch!

I wouldn't say it's just about the same. Thats oversimplifying the amount of work involved.

A 'c-notch' doesn't mandate:

• complete disection of the frame rails

• removal of suspension pieces

• removal of sheetmetal (depending on the year of the vehicle)

• additional fabrication because of the notch

'Z-ing' the frame:

• requires complete disection of the frame rails

• requires removal of @ least some suspension pieces

• requires the removal of the front sheetmetal (or if creative, you must @ least unbolt some of it)

• requires further modifications to other affected areas (steering linkage, radiator connections/shroud, trans tunnel)

All that plus you don't have to triangulate for a c-notch (unless installing a step-notch) but it's pretty important for 'z-ing' the front suspension.

This isn't a slam on you personally. I just don't want someone w/limited skills to cut up their truck thinking this is a "piece of cake" mod. It requires some amount of skill to pull off. 'C-notches' can be installed by those w/limited skill (some don't even require welding & will bolt in place).

[bagged69c10]

I talked to a local shop over the weekend and they said that Zing the frame is easier. They have done the crossmember in the past but now they just Z it. Oh yea Im also on a tight budget.

[KdawgS10]

A 'c-notch' doesn't mandate:
complete disection of the frame rails
removal of suspension pieces
removal of sheetmetal (depending on the year of the vehicle)
additional fabrication because of the notch

I belive he was tlaking about a 8 peice step notch.


and yahoo can put in a 2" C

"complete disection of the frame rails"
yes you do. if thier is any other way of doing let me know.cuz evry time I go to put in a 8" notch on a 4" frame it ends up cut in half



"removal of suspension pieces"

hmm..... unless your just doing bag over leaf you usally take ot the alxe and leafs. and if you ARE installing a rear notch your usually changeing somthing.
blocks/4link/taking out leafs.

"removal of sheetmetal (depending on the year of the vehicle)"


I dont know what your working on but on EVRY truck its 100% easyer to work ont he rear with out the bed on. and its usually harder to get the bed off then it is the front clip.

andf what about the gas tank in the rear? I allwaysd take out the gas tank. I have never liked the idea of welding around a tank.



"additional fabrication because of the notch"


evry time I have ever done a notch. I have allways boxed the frame/bag brackets/ shock relocating. or some other fabricating of that efect.

cutting hole int he bed floor/brake line rerouting/wire rerout/exast

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by KdawgS10

...I belive he was tlaking about a 8 peice step notch.

You believe he was? Thanks for clearing that up for me since he didn't type step notch.

and yahoo can put in a 2" C

???

"complete disection of the frame rails"
yes you do. if thier is any other way of doing let me know.cuz evry time I go to put in a 8" notch on a 4" frame it ends up cut in half

Perhaps you should re-read my post. I clearly & concisely stated 'c-notch'. No mention of an 8" notch.

"removal of suspension pieces"
hmm..... unless your just doing bag over leaf you usally take ot the alxe and leafs. and if you ARE installing a rear notch your usually changeing somthing.
blocks/4link/taking out leafs.

What if it's just a coil spring truck? Does the rear axle need to be pulled? No, it doesn't. Air over leaf doesn't require disconnecting the rear axle or brake lines either.

I dont know what your working on but on EVRY truck its 100% easyer to work ont he rear with out the bed on. and its usually harder to get the bed off then it is the front clip. ...... andf what about the gas tank in the rear? I allwaysd take out the gas tank. I have never liked the idea of welding around a tank.

On some trucks, a 'notch' (c-notch), can be installed w/o removing the bed. It might be easier w/the bed off, but it can be done w/o removing sheetmetal. Not all trucks have the gas tank near where a 'notch' is installed. But, even if you have to remove the bed & gas tank, it's less work than pulling a front clip, suspension, & drivetrain. All that work is part of what makes 'Z-ing' harder to do.

evry time I have ever done a notch. I have allways boxed the frame/bag brackets/ shock relocating. or some other fabricating of that efect.... cutting hole int he bed floor/brake line rerouting/wire rerout/exast

There are several 'notch' kits available through the aftermarket that don't require boxing the frame & can be bolted on (or welded if that's preferred).

Originally Posted by SCOTI

This isn't a slam on you personally. I just don't want someone w/limited skills to cut up their truck thinking this is a "piece of cake" mod. It requires some amount of skill to pull off. 'C-notches' can be installed by those w/limited skill (some don't even require welding & will bolt in place).

I wanted to be sure my post wasn't taken as a slam, hence the first sentence in the quote above. I suppose my mistake was instead of pointing out the obvious, I should have asked Loweredd to be more specific about his statement.
Maybe the statement should read "it's no harder than fabricating & welding in a rear step notch".

[KdawgS10]

he ment step notch. even you know that. your just trying to make a stink out of a word he missed.




and I ment


anyone with a sawsall can put in a 2" C notch.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by KdawgS10

he ment step notch. even you know that.

No, your assuming again. He said 'notch', I thought notch. If he would have said "step notch', that would have 'upped' the degree of difficulty.

and I ment anyone with a sawsall can put in a 2" C notch.

Yes, a c-notch is easier to install than a step notch. We both agree on this one. Can we move on now? How about contributing instead of criticizing?

[loweredd]

OK Guys, let's not bite each other's heads off. I DID mean step notch, not c notch. Sorry for not clarifying that.

That frame looks good 1low1967!!

I understand SCOTI not wanting someone to go and hack up thier truck and not be able to get it back together, but this IS just as easy as putting in a rear STEP NOTCH. At least it was for me. I put in a 10" notch, and that was almost more work than Z'ing the front.

[SCOTI]

Originally Posted by loweredd

I understand SCOTI not wanting someone to go and hack up thier truck and not be able to get it back together, but this IS just as easy as putting in a rear STEP NOTCH. At least it was for me. I put in a 10" notch, and that was almost more work than Z'ing the front.

Ok, that makes sense.

Originally Posted by loweredd

That frame looks good 1low1967!!

I agree 100%. Nice looking job.

[DM310]

all this talk about Z'ing the frame makes me want to do it now. So now I decided to Z the frame 2", so along w/ my 1.5" crossmember drop that will be 3.5". I will do it this weekend and take pics

[1low1967]

Good to hear. I did 3 1/4 on mine... Remember measure 100 times cut once...Good luck and can't wait to see the pics