283 and a Slight Hop Up

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

Scooter, Edelbrock says the Performer eps offers 5 h.p and 9 ft.lb over the original. http://www.edelbrock.com/media/news/...ve/070908.html looks like the tube model came out later, maybe thats why I "missed the boat"

Great! Thank you for the heads up!

[scott657]

Let us know what cam you decided on. Crane suggested a nostalgia cam comparable to the 327/300 HP cam for my 283 build

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by scott657

Let us know what cam you decided on. Crane suggested a nostalgia cam comparable to the 327/300 HP cam for my 283 build

Interesting! I will check that out for sure! Thank you for the heads up!

[scootermcrad]

These Hedman headers seem to get good reviews around here:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/h...FQFkhgods5cHyQ

I can get these coated for pretty cheap through my day job for a more resilient finish.

I have a line on a 200-4r that is complete out of a Blazer for CHEEEAAAP! Going to head out Saturday to pick it up. I'm sure it will need a go-through, but the price is right even for a core.

Man... I really appreciate all the help here! You guys have been so helpful!

[WOLFMANmike]

Originally Posted by scootermcrad

These Hedman headers seem to get good reviews around here:
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/h...FQFkhgods5cHyQ

I can get these coated for pretty cheap through my day job for a more resilient finish.

I have a line on a 200-4r that is complete out of a Blazer for CHEEEAAAP! Going to head out Saturday to pick it up. I'm sure it will need a go-through, but the price is right even for a core.

Man... I really appreciate all the help here! You guys have been so helpful!

No problem brother that is what makes this place the best . Is the willingness to help others

[AcampoDave]

I went with a Hayden heavy duty thermal fan clutch pt # 2747

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

I went with a Hayden heavy duty thermal fan clutch pt # 2747

Thanks! Good info!

[AcampoDave]

Any updates?

[scootermcrad]

Hey guys! Sorry for the absence. I do have an update. I'm finally getting around to this. Mostly I've just been collecting parts and putting out other fires in my life.

I pulled the engine apart yesterday and overall it didn't look too bad, just a little sludgy. Cylinders will need a clean up pass in each and Power Pak heads are in great shape. Didn't drop the crank yet. Crossing my fingers there's no surprises. I know the history of the engine and wouldn't expect any.

I have done a lot of thinking about how this truck will be used. I've pretty much decided not to worry too much about doing any kind of heavy towing with this truck. Maybe the occasional small trailer, but nothing serious. Going to stick to whatever I can fit in the bed, which would be gravel, dirt, lumber, etc., within it's limits. The truck will end up being daily driver capable, and still going for that late 60's vibe.

I've collected a handful of parts for the build, already. Edelbrock Performer intake and carb (I think it's a 1406. Need to look again), original Mr. Gasket C10 full headers (thanks to my good buddy Kasey!). I may have already mentioned the TH200-4R. That too.

I've decided that I'm going to just stick with the Power Pak heads. I have them, they're complete and in good shape for rebuilding, and it doesn't seem like there's a huge advantage for me to swap to 305 heads for the final plans I have for the engine.

Definitely going to do a cam swap, since I'm going to be in there. I like the feedback I've hard on Summit's cam and lifter kits. I'm thinking the 1102 or maybe even an 1103, if the stock rear gearing will be a decent match for the setup. Any repercussions to stock pistons, stock valve springs, or any other considerations for these cams?

For the distributor, I'm thinking of keeping the stock type dizzy and installing a Pertronix conversion. Seems like they work well, priced well, can keep the stock style, and would handle anything I would be throwing at it.

So that's where I'm at! Time to get the rest torn down and reach out to some machinist contacts for block and head work.

[GMDad]

That #3896962 cam is a good choice. It first came out in the 1974 Z/28. Sold lots of them at the dealership. The earlier 327/350 HP cam #3863151 was a little more radical and it worked excellent in the small cube motors.

[cg285]

Originally Posted by GMDad

That #3896962 cam is a good choice. It first came out in the 1974 Z/28. Sold lots of them at the dealership. The earlier 327/350 HP cam #3863151 was a little more radical and it worked excellent in the small cube motors.

back in the late 60's early 70's i sold bookoos of the 3863151 to the local speed shop where they were sold as performance cams but not under the gm number.

[AcampoDave]

Are you putting the oil fill tube in the intake? If you do, and you put a breather cap on top, you can hide a p.c.v valve in the old style street breather hole by putting a rubber grommet in the block. Then you can use old school valve covers and still have efficient engine ventilation.

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

Are you putting the oil fill tube in the intake? If you do, and you put a breather cap on top, you can hide a p.c.v valve in the old style street breather hole by putting a rubber grommet in the block. Then you can use old school valve covers and still have efficient engine ventilation.

YES! Oil fill tube and early script valve covers. Good thinking. That was something I was wondering about. Thanks!

[scootermcrad]

Just checked my other cast iron 4 bbl intake manifold, and indeed a 327 intake for q-jet.

[andyh1956]

A Q-Jet & a 4-Jet aint the same carb. I've never seen a 283 with a Q-Jet so can't comment. Although I did once have a Holley Spread Bore on one, didn't like it.
And also stay away from the Carter WCFB.
This be what I'm talking about.
http://www.carbkitsource.com/carbs/t.../4G-index.html

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by andyh1956

A Q-Jet & a 4-Jet aint the same carb. I've never seen a 283 with a Q-Jet so can't comment. Although I did once have a Holley Spread Bore on one, didn't like it.
And also stay away from the Carter WCFB.
This be what I'm talking about.
http://www.carbkitsource.com/carbs/t.../4G-index.html

I'm aware they are different. I'm not using a Rochester 4-jet. Just saying the 327 intake I have is listed as using a Q-jet for that application as well as the Carter WCFB.

Is a 62-63 327 intake a better option for this build than the Edelbrock Performer, then? I have both.

EDIT: I just checked the carb I have. It is not an Edelbrock Q-jet. It is the Carter AFB style Edelbrock Performer 1406. Big difference. My mistake. It had been awhile since I looked at it. I won't be able to use that on the 327 manifold. I would like to use the Carter AFB (Edelbrock), if I can. Maybe I'm weird, but I like those carbs and I have it, soooo....

[scootermcrad]

Sorry if these are stupid questions. Just trying to understand. Seems easier to spec out an engine where you just want all the HP you can get, but when it comes to building a modest engine on a modest budget, part selection seems to be more critical so I'm getting a well balanced engine for this truck.

[andyh1956]

scooter what everbody is trying to do is help you build your engine to do the job you want it to do, namely push your big heavy truck down the road as efficiently as possible.
A 283 is a short stroke, high reving low torque engine.
The same tricks people apply to a 350 won't build an engine to do what you want on a 283.
You say "The Most Power", well "Power" comes in at different RPMs on different size engines. With your 283 you want to keep all the power it makes at lower RPMs.
What's the casting #s on your intake? What cfm is your carb? Stockish 283s like around 500 cfm, not over 600.
In my lifetime I've had well over a hundred 283s, anything from stockers to full race engines in 3200 LB cars, but had to run a 4.88 rear axle. Heck I even sleeved a 302 down to 3 7/8" & made a 283 from it. They are really good engines.
If you need a manifold to fit the carb I think one of the old C3B Edelbrocks may be a good choice, I wouldn't use a single plane. I think I have an old Offy 360 around someplace, if I can find it you can have it.

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by andyh1956

scooter what everbody is trying to do is help you build your engine to do the job you want it to do, namely push your big heavy truck down the road as efficiently as possible.
A 283 is a short stroke, high reving low torque engine.
The same tricks people apply to a 350 won't build an engine to do what you want on a 283.
You say "The Most Power", well "Power" comes in at different RPMs on different size engines. With your 283 you want to keep all the power it makes at lower RPMs.
What's the casting #s on your intake? What cfm is your carb? Stockish 283s like around 500 cfm, not over 600.
In my lifetime I've had well over a hundred 283s, anything from stockers to full race engines in 3200 LB cars, but had to run a 4.88 rear axle. Heck I even sleeved a 302 down to 3 7/8" & made a 283 from it. They are really good engines.
If you need a manifold to fit the carb I think one of the old C3B Edelbrocks may be a good choice, I wouldn't use a single plane. I think I have an old Offy 360 around someplace, if I can find it you can have it.

I certainly appreciate the responses! Thanks! And I certainly wouldn't ever think that a 350 and a 283 would be built with similar components.

The dual plane Edelbrock Performer is a 2101, which I was thinking was comparable to the Offy 360, you mentioned. The cast iron 327 I have laying around is a 3783244. (62'-63' 327)

I believe the Edelbrock carb I have is a 1405/6 (600 cfm). I need to look at it again to make sure it's not a 1404 (500 cfm) carb. I'm concerned the 1405/6 might be too much.

[AcampoDave]

Scooter, see how much interest a little old 283 has generated here. I bet if the thread was "350 and a Slight Hop Up" we wouldn't be at 4 pages already! I don't know if you already have a performer intake on your shelf or not, but I use the Performer EPS on my 283. It's made for a square bore carb and now you can get it with the oil fill tube provision too. I like mine and I simply painted it to match my block to keep a more stockish look. My cam is the economical Summit 1102 style grind....it seem to work well. I know people say it's outdated now, but I prefer to call it "tried and true". I did Google the cams The Captain mentioned and I was intrigued. Since I'm by know means a cam expert, (and he seems to know his stuff) I wonder if he could elaborate a bit more on them as now he's got my curiosity up too....Captain?

[James903]

I have been thinking of using a 1102 and new valve springs as well. Engine has good compression and oil pressure so I figured I real have nothing to lose

[Captainfab]

My recommending of one of those two cams was mainly in response to the recommendation of the GM cam by another member. A lot of guys that like the 283's seem to like everything old school and that's fine. It is my experience that a lot has happened in cam grinding technology in the past 50 years. For nearly the same price as the GM cam alone, a guy could buy the XE256H cam AND lifters and get a better cam to boot. That cam may not be the optimum cam for the OP's 283, but it would be better than the GM cam IMO. I have never built a 283, so I can not speak from that experience as others that have posted in this thread.

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

Scooter, see how much interest a little old 283 has generated here. I bet if the thread was "350 and a Slight Hop Up" we wouldn't be at 4 pages already! I don't know if you already have a performer intake on your shelf or not, but I use the Performer EPS on my 283. It's made for a square bore carb and now you can get it with the oil fill tube provision too. I like mine and I simply painted it to match my block to keep a more stockish look. My cam is the economical Summit 1102 style grind....it seem to work well. I know people say it's outdated now, but I prefer to call it "tried and true". I did Google the cams The Captain mentioned and I was intrigued. Since I'm by know means a cam expert, (and he seems to know his stuff) I wonder if he could elaborate a bit more on them as now he's got my curiosity up too....Captain?

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by Captainfab

My recommending of one of those two cams was mainly in response to the recommendation of the GM cam by another member. A lot of guys that like the 283's seem to like everything old school and that's fine. It is my experience that a lot has happened in cam grinding technology in the past 50 years. For nearly the same price as the GM cam alone, a guy could buy the XE256H cam AND lifters and get a better cam to boot. That cam may not be the optimum cam for the OP's 283, but it would be better than the GM cam IMO. I have never built a 283, so I can not speak from that experience as others that have posted in this thread.

I really appreciate the input, man! Do you feel like the cams you have suggested would help maintain some bottom end? I'm not stuck on an old school grind by any means, I'm really just listening to people's suggestions at this point, since I don't know enough to say, "I need XX lift at XXX duration... blah blah". So I'm really leaning on you and everyone else to educate me a bit on what is best for this little guy.

THANKS AGAIN!

[scootermcrad]

Originally Posted by AcampoDave

Scooter, see how much interest a little old 283 has generated here. I bet if the 9thread was "350 and a Slight Hop Up" we wouldn't be at 4 pages already! I don't know if you already have a performer intake on your shelf or not, but I use the Performer EPS on my 283. It's made for a square bore carb and now you can get it with the oil fill tube provision too. I like mine and I simply painted it to match my block to keep a more stockish look. My cam is the economical Summit 1102 style grind....it seem to work well. I know people say it's outdated now, but I prefer to call it "tried and true". I did Google the cams The Captain mentioned and I was intrigued. Since I'm by know means a cam expert, (and he seems to know his stuff) I wonder if he could elaborate a bit more on them as now he's got my curiosity up too....Captain?

Dave,
Yeah, the manifold I have, 2102 (http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/...ds/sb/2101.jpg) also is setup to run the fill tube, I just have to mill a hole for in the boss. They just leave the boss "blank" to give you the option for the tube. I'm sure it's very similar to yours. It will be cleaned up and painted as well.

Some seriously interesting cam discussions here! It's really appreciated. My knowledge is VERY limited. I've built a 350, which had many more goodies, so I've washed it out of my mind completely and haven't been thinking "well, in my 350 I did..." Treating this as a whole different animal. I'm intrigued for sure.

So speaking generically, what is it in a cam that I want to look for to maintain some bottom end? More lobe separation? More/less duration? Obviously we know what lift does. It's interesting to hear the term, "more modern grind". Is that based on taste and trends or is that actually related to what we've learned about making power?

I have a clean slate here, folks. Pistons will be replaced for the cleanup bore (turns out they are actually 10 over already!). My machinist guy looked at it yesterday and says we will more than likely be going out to 30 over std.

Heads are being looked at right now. He's going to rate the stock springs that are in there and keep them if they're good, but if we feel like it's worth it to grab a pack of springs to compliment the cam choice, now's the time to get this done.

Going to read back through the cam suggestions, but I still don't feel like I know how to make an educated decision between them. They all look great, to me. HA! I just want to make sure I'm not losing too much bottom end.

[scootermcrad]

Chatting with the Summit tech they are also recommending the K000032

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-k00032

Thoughts?