Fixin Dixie - 66 Short Bed Fleetside

[msg]

A few more hours of tinkering. I went ahead and welded up the other side just to be sure. Also I bought some square nuts that were nickel plated I think, so I took the sanding disc and ground the coating off all round then welded them in place. I have painted them with POR15 2 coats after I took this pic. Once it dries Ill start tacking it in, probably tomorrow.



On the front passenger pillar I remembered Vinceg had suggested welding the nuts to the patch panel that doesnt come with them. It was in a separate thread I had started when I was going to start making repairs to the cab and wanted advice. Here is a link to that thread.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=718071

Here is Vinceg's suggestion:

Originally Posted by Vinceg

Also when you get to the point of bolting all the metal together in that area tack weld your nuts to the sheet metal inside the rockers. Ask me again how I know? When you need to loosen the bolts for adjustment and you have not secured the nuts getting in and tightening them with the outer rocker on is impossible. I had to cut an access in the inner from behind just to make adjustments.

So with that I made the addition as suggested.



A couple of the bolts are missing (or deteriorated-cant remember) so I bought a few at home depot and cut them down and used the grinder to chew up that end post to help it guide into the panel from behind easier.

The original bolts I clamped into a vise and wire wheeled the crud off to be able to reuse them.



More later...

[Vinceg]

Looking good msg! Nice work it's awesome to see your progress. I'm looking forward to seeing how your rockers line up once you get those doors mounted. I don't know how many times I felt overwhelmed thinking about working through all the rust repair myself. Your thread will help many in the future. I thank you for taking the time to do such a good job documenting your work.

[JohnJ@RideTech]

Coming along nicely!

[msg]

Originally Posted by Vinceg

Looking good msg! Nice work it's awesome to see your progress. I'm looking forward to seeing how your rockers line up once you get those doors mounted. I don't know how many times I felt overwhelmed thinking about working through all the rust repair myself. Your thread will help many in the future. I thank you for taking the time to do such a good job documenting your work.

Originally Posted by JohnJ@RideTech

Coming along nicely!

Really appreciate the feedback! At first I felt overwhelmed too, still do a bit at times...but I find if I just keep plugging away I focus on the now vs the when. So since last post, I noticed that the front pillar was missing two spot welds to keep it in place so I drilled out 2 spots and welded it.
Then I finished painting the rear pillar I modified.



Then I got it in place, what I found helped was threading the 2 bolts in to secure it to the inner rocker and then clamped it all together and started welding it up. Here is how it looks now, oh and since the back side of the pillar was accessible since the cab corner is still out I added some extra strength. Ill just leave it since Ill never be looking at it.



Then I placed the outer rocker on to see how it might fit and did a happy dance.



So now a question, in order to mount the door It seems like I need to remove the bracing. Any way or reason not to remove the bracing and fit the door?

[Vinceg]

Nice work. There is no reason for the brace's at this point. Once you have the bolts in the inner rocker your good to go. Tighten down your bolts and everything will be secured to the inner rocker. Mount the door and see how the gaps are and line the rocker so the gaps are the same front to back. Once the rocker is on you can work on the cab corner. Line the bottom of the corner to the bottom of the rocker. Looking good!

[msg]

Originally Posted by Vinceg

Nice work. There is no reason for the brace's at this point. Once you have the bolts in the inner rocker your good to go. Tighten down your bolts and everything will be secured to the inner rocker. Mount the door and see how the gaps are and line the rocker so the gaps are the same front to back. Once the rocker is on you can work on the cab corner. Line the bottom of the corner to the bottom of the rocker. Looking good!

Thanks Vince, I had planned to move onto hanging the door and remembered that I botched that door repair a while back. So I need to redo it, this time with a full door skin vs the base. What happened to me was I had lower door rust and thought I could just cut across the base amd replace it, but I had applied too much heat and because of how low the repair was I couldnt get to the base of the door on the inside to planish. Here is the thread on that.
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=690647

Even though the base edge of the door would be the same when I repair it, I think the right approach is get the door fixed first and then hang it. Sound right to you guys?

Until then I went ahead and started a firewall/windsheild/dash rust repair that for a while I wasnt sure how I would approach it. I just knew that to cut holes and try and fix things without removing that air vent side panel was not gonna work. But then I thought maybe I can just cut out a section big enough to deal with the trouble spots and not have to drill out all the spot welds around that entire panel. The area I cut should be accessible from behind to planish as I use my mig spot for spot. The top of the panel to the left has an opening so I will be able to stick my arm through there and hold the dolly while I smack it from the top as I go to keep it straight.

First issue I was having was that I have been using a harbor freight spot weld remover hole saw tool and I usually have trouble with that. Even with a punch to mark a pilot hole to sit the tool in it always seems to get away from me. Or I end up drilling too far and go right through both panels. So I read this thread about spot weld cutters

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=727222

In that thread MP&C and Martin cover tools and methods and for me I think that the Wivco is worth a shot. So I ordered one but it wont be here for a few days. Until then I looked at MP&C's approach of using the grinder, but since I need to salvage the top piece I'm cutting I used my dremel with a tiny disc instead of a 3 inch disc. Worked out good.



After I got that top portion off I taped off an area of the under side that was rusted out where the seams meet and cut it out. Then of course there is an area in the windshield channel that decayed into the back of the dash, so I used the dremel and cut it out, hoping that I can get it patched up properly. That whole area where this rusted out in that seam really bugs me, it looks like the seam is supposed to act as a channel for the rain to run down and ultimately rot out. I guess seam sealer failed?



From the inside there is a brace that I went ahead and removed cause its all rusted from behind. So I have since wire wheeled, de-greased and used metal ready to prep it. In fact all the rusty spots I did this too as well and plan to POR15 them up next.

[Vinceg]

Wow you do have your hands full! That is going to take some patience dealing with that area. Also sorry about the doors. I learned a lot from my mistakes as I went also. Just think at how good at all this stuff your going to be when it's all done. When you think that some of these areas were unprotected bare metal it's impressive that they held up as well as they did. Be careful with that POR-15. I went with a weld through primer when I was working in areas that needed protection and still had welding required. IMO the POR-15 is a better protection but I found that burning it gave me really bad headaches. I also worried about what it might be doing to my welds. The bottom of the door can be a bit of a tricky repair because of the relation to the rocker. A guy did a door repair on my brother's 69 c10 with out looking at the door gap (door was removed and on a stand) with the rocker. Long story short he has a huge door gap in the bottom of his passenger door. It really sucks when your paying what you think is a pro and they butcher your stuff. Have you tried mounting the doors to see how the gap was before you cut out all the cab structure? I'd mount the door and just see where everything is at at the moment. If it looks good proceed with the rocker instal. Then when you redo Your door repair you will have something besides measuring to line it up with. I hope what I'm trying to say makes sence. Just finished working nights not a lot of sleep.

[msg]

Originally Posted by Vinceg

Be careful with that POR-15. I went with a weld through primer when I was working in areas that needed protection and still had welding required. IMO the POR-15 is a better protection but I found that burning it gave me really bad headaches. I also worried about what it might be doing to my welds..

Makes sense to me, in fact I had intended to look into the weld through primer approach but all I found were aerosols and I was hoping for a brush type. I found this and ordered some. $25 plus tax at Sherwin Williams Auto. I wasnt getting headaches just way too much flareups/flames!!! And that was POR15 that was over a week in application not still drying. I hope the work Ive done isnt impacted too much, I did at least drill a clean spot on the face of the lower panel when welding the spots, but dang it still flared up and smoked a bunch.

https://www.semproducts.com/blog/41-...perweld-primer

Ill try tonight to get some patch panels made to replace what I cut. I might need to call on some favors this weekend and get the doors installed and test out.

[MP&C]

Some helpful hints....

Looking at some of your weld dots, many look to be sitting proud with minimal "wetting", or in other words, close to being a cold weld. It looks like you could stand to bump the heat up a bit, I normally check the back side to insure full weld penetration. If you still see the joint between the panels on the back side, bump up the heat some more. Next, your heat setting is based on that sheet metal in front of you. Leaving the weld bead there without planishing and GRINDING it down to the surface is acting as a heat sink. Think of it this way, thicker metal requires more heat, by leaving the weld bead sitting there, it is about 3 times or more the thickness of the metal itself. This is why many of your weld beads look cold, not enough heat for the thickness of the metal.

My suggestion, (looking forward) is to set your heat based on a full weld penetration, then grind down weld dots after planishing and before new welds so the heat still sees sheet metal thickness and not a pile of weld that will cause a cold weld. Getting late and I gotta get up early so I'll look at the door / rocker deal tomorrow evening....

[msg]

Originally Posted by MP&C

Some helpful hints....

Looking at some of your weld dots, many look to be sitting proud with minimal "wetting", or in other words, close to being a cold weld. It looks like you could stand to bump the heat up a bit, I normally check the back side to insure full weld penetration. If you still see the joint between the panels on the back side, bump up the heat some more. Next, your heat setting is based on that sheet metal in front of you. Leaving the weld bead there without planishing and GRINDING it down to the surface is acting as a heat sink. Think of it this way, thicker metal requires more heat, by leaving the weld bead sitting there, it is about 3 times or more the thickness of the metal itself. This is why many of your weld beads look cold, not enough heat for the thickness of the metal.

My suggestion, (looking forward) is to set your heat based on a full weld penetration, then grind down weld dots after planishing and before new welds so the heat still sees sheet metal thickness and not a pile of weld that will cause a cold weld. Getting late and I gotta get up early so I'll look at the door / rocker deal tomorrow evening....

Much appreciated Robert! I'll keep a closer eye on the settings and be more diligent on the dot for dot grind & planish method.

[msg]

Worked over the weekend and made repairs to the driver side windshield area and firewall. Started off with the dash to pinchweld spot, got some cardboards and drew a template and then took the snips and cut a patch from some scrap. Got it bent the way I needed and tacked it in.



Then finished it up. There was a gap I was curious about and posted a thread asking whether it should be filled in or not, or if its supposed to be there. Just looked like trouble to me. Heres the pic I had in the thread...



Then I just decided to hammer it all tighter at the pinchweld and weld it up



Next was the bottom inner firewall section. Its actually two panels spot welded together, so I started on the bottom layer by taking more cardboard and metal scraps and getting to it.



Then I did the best I could with Roberts mig welding method, but the area was very hard to work in.



Towards the top of that patch where it runs up and into the pinchweld, I havent yet finished it out. I think it might be best to weld the seam up to keep the rain from having more access points to get in and cause trouble. I guess seam sealer would be fine too. Anyways, more later.

[MP&C]

Originally Posted by msg

......Then I placed the outer rocker on to see how it might fit and did a happy dance.



So now a question, in order to mount the door It seems like I need to remove the bracing. Any way or reason not to remove the bracing and fit the door?

One method of making a "door friendly" brace system is to use cut off pieces of angle in the door jamb area to get you farther inside the cab, then add the cross braces to the inner portion. Position the angle so it doesn't interfere with a door closing...




If you want to bolt the door back up for positioning panels, add your new bracing first and then remove what you have now that is interfering.




Now as to the rocker panel. the unfortunate part of using a cab dolly is that all your adjacent panels are missing. The cab corner is gone, so we have nothing to match up the rear of the rocker, the fender is not installed so same for the front. The door is missing to adjust gaps. You could hold the fender up temporarily, it would help to get a more accurate location for the bottom of the rocker so that it better aligns during reassembly. If the opposite cab corner is still intact (or your previous profile templates were marked with bottom of rocker location) you could use that as a measurement for the rear of the rocker. If both cab corners are removed, you may have better luck comparing to the front of the truck bed (except step side) And just like everything else made reproduction, nothing is perfect. If you decide the rocker may need some "tweaking", it's much easier to do if it's still loose and you can access the back side.

[msg]

Originally Posted by MP&C

One method of making a "door friendly" brace system is to use cut off pieces of angle in the door jamb area to get you farther inside the cab, then add the cross braces to the inner portion. Position the angle so it doesn't interfere with a door closing...If you want to bolt the door back up for positioning panels, add your new bracing first and then remove what you have now that is interfering.

Thanks for this Robert, but I may have slipped up on the driver side. I removed the bracing since the door posts were completed and the bolts were installed before I cut the bracing off. On the passenger side Ill be giving the angle iron a try.

Originally Posted by MP&C

If both cab corners are removed, you may have better luck comparing to the front of the truck bed ..If you decide the rocker may need some "tweaking", it's much easier to do if it's still loose and you can access the back side.

Unfortunately both cab corners are removed. I had planned to hang the fender and get the front part of the rocker aligned. Looks like Im gonna be needing some luck getting the door and rear cab corner lined up and gapped properly.


Until then, here is my update. My time has been spent trying to get the driver side firewall/windshield area finished up. I had switched to the SEM weld thru brush able paint vs using POR15 to cut down on the flare ups and smoke clouds in the garage. Maybe its overkill but did it anyway. Got it all welded up and planished as best I could in the tight spot it was in.




I prepped the inside of that whole area down to the kick panel vent with a degreaser, Ospho, then water to neutralize. Then I mixed up the epoxy primer and brushed on 2 coats, but on the edges I used the SEM stuff. I brushed it all into the kick panel side vent cavity. Then after waiting a day I was going to use some seam sealer on the overlapped part I repaired. It was a tube of seam sealer I had used back when I made repairs to the bedside panels, but the tube was already solid. So that sent me on a search for what seam sealer to use. After reading some threads on this site I decided to go with a 2K instead and ordered it along with a dispensing gun. Now Im just in a holding pattern til it gets here.



In the meantime I had to make rust repairs to the top portion I cut out. I had a scrap piece that had the right angle I needed so I cut from it, and with the help of some magnets I tacked the repair parts I cut with the snips and had hammered to get the right arc needed.



While waiting on seam sealer I dealt with the gas tank spot where someone I guess used some screws to try and pull a dent out. I hammered outward/upward from the inside with a large rounded flat head screwdriver and also the rounded end of a combination wrench. Then hammered and dollied and welded in the holes.

[graymage]

looks like a lot of work, takes a lot of talent, good job

[Alberta65]

I feel you pain friend looks like you are making some big progress in the battle on rust! Keep fighting the good fight my friend I'm subscribed

[msg]

Originally Posted by graymage

looks like a lot of work, takes a lot of talent, good job

Thanks Graymage, it takes a very understanding wife too. Ive spent way too much time in the garage but I am determined, to a fault sometimes.

Originally Posted by Alberta65

I feel you pain friend looks like you are making some big progress in the battle on rust! Keep fighting the good fight my friend I'm subscribed

Thanks for subscribing Alberta65! Rust is so mean. I'll do my best to keep up the fight!

Since last entry I have been continuing the fight. Went ahead and repeated the cut out resto on the passenger side this time. There was a good bit of rust that opened up the upper dash that I felt I had to make the cut. But, what I did different this side was so not worry about the overlap seam and just patch the panel area as continuous. That saved me the effort of 2 panels that overlap and the seam to deal with. So I took cardboard and found some more scrap metal and cut out a patch.



I didnt take any pics of the in progress part, but here is what it ended up looking like and then I painted it with epoxy primer. I also fixed the rusted out windshield seam area.



Also the part I cut out of the firewall had some rusted out spots along the flange so that had to be fixed.



But this is what took most of this weekend, the windshield wipe motor mount opening. I really wasnt looking forward to this, the spot is hard to maneuver in. Pretty holed up with rust so it had to be done. I tried the self tapping sheet metal screw approach but dang.. it didnt help me like I had hoped. Ultimately I had to cut out the section, get the cardboard out and trace out a patch.




The center hole was a concern, I wanted to make sure it was aligned right and the right sized hole. I think I got it right, the hole I was surprised that I was able to use the snips to get cut out. You can see the little staggered pattern that the snip for snip motion created.

Now its a second coat to apply of epoxy primer on the left side in the air vent area as well, then I will try out the 2k seam sealer stuff I bought and then weld up the cut out areas I did. Thats all I have for now, later on.

[msg]

Had to take some time off to deal with a few life curve balls. Started things off with the driver side, I really wanted to get the rocker panel started so I put the door on and its fitting pretty good.








There is though an issue with the lower right corner of the door bowing out.
If I apply some pressure with my hand it tightens up to be more flush, but I recalled from the original pics I took of alignments before I disassembled that this was already a prob.



Original pics






I may start another thread on what to do about the bowing, I hope I can tighten up these panels as I go.

The rocker panel though once I got the door hung wouldnt fit under the door no matter how I angle the door and tried to slip it up underneath.

The issue with that rocker also is the length is a bit too long. I was looking at pics to see if the base of the door width should be the same as the width of the rocker panel so the gaps line up right. Looks to me like that is whats is supposed to happen, so I am thinking to cut the rocker in half and take nearly 1/4 of an inch out of the center. Hopefully it will help the fit and match the width of the door better. Hate to do it really, what a PITA.!!!

[Vinceg]

Hey msg,
Good to see that your back at it. Hope all is well. As far as your rocker goes. Don't cut it in half just yet. The rear portion where it attaches to the rear pillar looks good. The front on mine was the same. I had to slit that upper rocker portion and hammer it in nice and tight. Just the upper portion. This is where your going to want to get some self tapping screws. Fit the rocker into place. Hold it in place with the screws. Put your door back on. Check your gaps on the door all the way around. In your pictures it looks like your door is adjusted back (closer to the rear of the cab) this will make the rocker look longer than it should. With the door on find something to support the front fender. Fit it in place. It should line up with the rocker along the bottom. It should be touching the rocker and at the same time line up the front door gap. I don't know how many times I had this stuff on and off my truck while I was doing mine. Your door also looks like it might be a little on the low side. This could give you problems rubbing on the rocker itself. Once the door and fender are in place you will be able to see how the rocker is for length. I cut one of mine thinking it was to short. I added about 1/2 inch. When I put the door and fender back on my lines were a mess! I had to take the 1/2 inch back out. I was fitting it to the cab and my cab had sprung a bit due to not properly bracing it before I started cutting things out. You really need to kinda get a feel how all the parts fit together as a whole. Sorry to be so long winded.

Vince

[msg]

Originally Posted by Vinceg

Hey msg,
As far as your rocker goes. Don't cut it in half just yet. The rear portion where it attaches to the rear pillar looks good. The front on mine was the same. I had to slit that upper rocker portion and hammer it in nice and tight. Just the upper portion. This is where your going to want to get some self tapping screws. Fit the rocker into place. Hold it in place with the screws. Put your door back on. Check your gaps on the door all the way around. In your pictures it looks like your door is adjusted back (closer to the rear of the cab) this will make the rocker look longer than it should. With the door on find something to support the front fender. Fit it in place. It should line up with the rocker along the bottom. It should be touching the rocker and at the same time line up the front door gap. I don't know how many times I had this stuff on and off my truck while I was doing mine. Your door also looks like it might be a little on the low side. This could give you problems rubbing on the rocker itself. Once the door and fender are in place you will be able to see how the rocker is for length. I cut one of mine thinking it was to short. I added about 1/2 inch. When I put the door and fender back on my lines were a mess! I had to take the 1/2 inch back out. I was fitting it to the cab and my cab had sprung a bit due to not properly bracing it before I started cutting things out. You really need to kinda get a feel how all the parts fit together as a whole. Sorry to be so long winded.

Vince

Thanks for the tips Vince! I will be onto the door/rocker again soon because I finally got the 2 cut outs on the upper front portion of the cab repaired!!!! The driver side needed that seam sealer applied first on the overlapped panel I did on that side that I was covering back up. I used the 3m heavy bodied seam sealer 2 part epoxy. Had to invest in the gun to apply it, but Ill be getting use out of it along the way.

[msg]

I tried to avoid making the cut to the rocker panel but its width was 1/4 inch too long. So I cut it and removed 1/4 inch and tacked it back together and did what Vince suggested and too the snips and cut the curved portion of the rocker panel that flows into the pillar so I could smack it in place a bit better.



Then I hung the door back, and I taped some 1/8 inch thick paint stick scraps into the door jamb to help set the gap. The edges line up pretty good from the door edges to the rocker panel edges.







But then I found that there is a pretty good distance where the base flange of the rocker to the cab floor flange that it supposed to wrap around. Maybe as I get to tacking it in place and i get about 1/8 gap between the door base and the top of the rocker, then as I try to pinch/clamp the base of the rocker to the cab floor edge that the gap wont be so bad. But it sure looks like a alot to me. Around a half inch too low. Anyone got some experience with this?



Also, I knew I would eventually need the fender to get everything aligned. Its funny how about 3 years ago when I last worked on this fender I had so much to repair I caved on the mangled dent that the PO had used some screws to pull it out the best he could and then body filed over it all. I thought at the time that I would do the same. But after looking at it I had to fix it. And the epoxy primer paint run I did.



Thats all I got for today. Ill see what I can do with this rocker panel deal tomorrow.

[rusty76]

Looking good. Keep at it.

[superfly66]

Great job, Makes me want to start on the sheetmetal now!

[msg]

Originally Posted by rusty76

Looking good. Keep at it.

Originally Posted by superfly66

Great job, Makes me want to start on the sheetmetal now!

Thanks guys! I figured out why the rocker panel was taller at that front end. I cut a profile of the original rocker and placed it on the repop and its definitely taller, and the reason is in the manufacturing the brace was misaligned and threw it off. So I cut out the brace, cut a new end brace from scrap and epoxy primered it fit in place. Since the panel was taller from the manufacture mishap I had to clamp it down to the bench and use the metal bar from the brake I have and took clamps to use to bend it up and get it back where it should be.

Then I welded it up. Now the rocker is fitting way better!

[msg]

While I was waiting on the epoxy primer to cure up on repairs I was making to the rocker and fender I decided to get the passenger door repair started. This time I removed most of the front door panel and was able to weld up the hole I cut out thinking I could use it as access to hammer/dolly the botched weld up I did a while back. Once I had the hole patched I epoxy primered the interior some more. Then I taped up areas that I wanted to apply seam sealer to just as a precaution. Then I started applying the sound deadener Noico product I bought. Ive read this helps the rattle of the metal panels so I applied it to where it made sense. The Dynamat sample they sent was interesting by comparison, side by side the Noico was a little thicker.



Hopefully that will help the sound on the interior, which at the rate Im going will be 2019

Then I got the rocker installed, I had to do as you mentioned Vince and cut along therdges of the horn looking part at the front. Used the self tapping screws, but I ended up needing to drill the pilot hole first. Didnt self tap Like I hoped. Once I got the rocker tacked in I got busy on the cab corner and knocked it out. Not perfect but works.



Getting closer! I just need to finish welding the base of the rocker to the inner rocker at he base then I think Ill finish up the passenger door.

[The Rocknrod]

Impressive skills MSG.