What are the odds...

[incoma]

Weather got real cold here last night (at least for this part of the country) and we had a real good freeze. I remembered this morning that my 90 GMC was parked outside and didn't have anti-freeze in it... I'm sure you can see where I'm going with this.

Checked it when I got home today, and the radiator was 100% ice. some water leaking on the ground. If I only have to swap out the radiator I won't be upset...it was almost due for a change.

Couldn't see any freezeplug issues. Have any of you cracked a block or heads with a similar situation without popping a freeze plug?

I'm gonna try to put a heating pad of sorts on the water pump this weekend and see if I can thaw it out. If I can, I'll get the truck into the garage for a good slow melt down. I can't start it now b/c the water pump is frozen and it would bust the serpentine belt.

Thought I'd look for some feedback - if nothing else to make me feel either worse or better. Also thought it may be relavent conversation for this time of the year.

[1bad67fleet]

Take the belt off and start it before it does crack!The freeze plugs almost never work-im in indiana and i see all kinds of autos like this.I cant understand why someone wouldnt use antifreeze when you can buy a gallon of it for 6.00 at the dollar store(full strength).Id say your lucky if it isnt smoked,and besides-plain water?Your engine has gotta be all rusted to heck on the insides

[CharlieBrown]

technically..they aint freeze plugs
they are cast plugs..a way to get the sand out when the block is cast


somewhere..someone thought they might pop out instead of a bock cracking

if it as solid as you say...good luck...prolly cracked in the lifer gally

[Kager67]

I would say you have 50/50 chance. The radiator will freeze first because there is alot less steel insulating it. It depends on how cold it actually got. I have seen blocks with pure water in them not break, down to 20 degrees or so. I will also say along with the other guys, never use only water in an engine, I have seen "freeze" plugs rust so bad they had pin holes in them(you can imagine what the rest of the motor looked like inside). Antifreeze not only transfers heat better than water, it is also a lubricant for your cooling system. Good luck.

Kage

[incoma]

Yeah, the 100% water was an emergency fix, and honestly I forgot about it until today. Its only been like that for 3 months or so. I"ll pop the belt off tomorrow and get the truck inside in the morning to survey the damage. Didn't think about popping the belt off. The battery should be strong enough to get it running for the few feet it needs to move.

[468BIGBLOCK]

YES, charlie brown is right. those things that people call (freeze plugs) are actually only used to get the sand core out of the block in the casting process in the foundry. general motors could care less if your engine freezes or not. good luck with this. i have thawed a engine out by removeing the belts and then starting the engine and letting it idle.

[incoma]

I moved it into the garage this morning when it was light, and let it sit all day. It has nearly thawed out. I started the engine (with the belt off again) and let it run for 3 minutes or so just to get some heat to it. It ran very smoothly - and quietly as the belt wasn't driving the noisy accessories. I checked the oil, and it was clean and wasn't milky.

It looks like my lower hose may have a leak, and the 17 year old radiator actually looks sound. I guess the test will be when I install the belt tomorrow night and start circulating water through the system. But just sitting, I'm not getting water in the oil.

I wish I could have gotten home earlier today to test this out.

[BobbyK]

Ya...we'll see what happens when the system is pressurized.

[El Jay]

CharlieBrown stole my thunder (& it problee dint even bother him)
Put the belt(s) back on & warm it up slow & hope for the best.

I hope everything works out for you.

[incoma]

Ran it for about 5 minutes tonight. No water in the oil. Looks like the radiator wasn't full of water, and that as it froze it expanded into the radiator. I think a longer drive may yield different results, but at this point I'm very optimistic.

The temp sender is sending crap to the gauge and the lower hose has expanded like most hoses do as they get old. So I'll replace the temp sender and lower hose this weekend...AND....put some antifreeze in it.

Now the engine seemed to be idling a bit high even after it warmed up. Is there any sensor for idle speed, or is that all computer controlled? I've got a TBI unit.

[Wootdog]

If you are going to replace one hose replace both. And put in the 50/50 mix after you drain out the water. you can buy it already pre mixed.
Kerry

[hvychve]

too high of an idle, I would think would be the least of your worries, I would check to see if you T.B.I gasket isnt sucked in or blown out, they are notorious for this and can cause hi idle conditions, yes it is computer controled , based on imput sensors to the E.C.M. and than outputed to the idle air control valve, this is a valve mouinted to your tbi unit and has a pintle that moves in and out to obtain correct idle , air leaks , etc, the best way to check is with a scan tool and monitor Iac counts , if they are high, than the computer is telling it to be high, if the counts are low and the idle is still high, the computer is telling iac to slow down and something else is causing high idle ... good luck on both problems, I hope to hear you didnt crack anything detromental.

[incoma]

Well, I'm not going to go to the casino or play the lottery for months. I think I used all of my luck with this engine.

I swapped the lower hose - nothing was wrong with the hose except for the normal wear. The upper hose is fairly new and didn't need to be swapped. I drained some water from the block when I took the temp sensor out, and it had a sligh green color to it - so evidently I did have some residual anti-freeze in the block, and that may have saved my butt.

I drove the truck for about 20 minutes, and didn't have any water in the transmission fluid or engine oil. I didn't pull any spark plugs to see if water was in the cylinders, but I couldn't hear any misfiring and the exhaust didn't have alot of steam in it so I think I may have lucked out.

And I did fill it back with 50/50 mix! I think the high idle the other day was because it was cold. Today it ran fine.