Would you swap a 454 for 6.0 to pull with?

[Kinghat]

I am approaching the purchase of a 77 crew cab dually. It has a 454/400. Plans are to shorten the bed and frame, go to single wheel, lower it 3/5ish but still keep it 1 ton, and use it to pull with. My question is, would you guys leave the drivetrain alone, or switch to LSx and 4L80E?

Second question, if you found a whole donor truck, would you keep the LSx's stock tank from the donor? I see most everyone use Blazer tanks on their conversions with either in-tank or inline pumps, but wouldn't it be feasible to use the newer trucks tank?
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[MONTEZ]

If your gonna go thru that much trouble, I would consider a cummins swap. A friend of mine has a cummins in his c10 dually and pulls like a champ and get around 27 mpg doing it. I am not saying that the 6.0 is a weaker option, but the cummins would have better potential for bolt on upgrades.

As far as using the tank from the donor truck, it will be a pretty good job to make it work out due to fitment issues. If you go with the shorter bed I would try and find a short bed dual tank doner and use that bed and tanks. Preferably an 87 since it has the tanks with the sump for the in tank fuel pump. You will have to have the shorter tanks to make it fit right for the short bed swap.

That being said, a blazer tank might actually be the easiest option.

[glock35ipsc]

Having pulled similar weight trailers with both engines in stock form, it would be a 6.0 for me, hands down.

And I agree with MONTEZ.... find a pair of 16 gallon saddle tanks, if they are from an 87 that would be a bonus. Not only would you have the "baffled" tanks, you would probably get the sending units with them so you could use the in-tank pumps.

[mstrav1973]

I would stay big block. I also have done heavy towing with both motors. My 6.0 in a 3/4 ton 4-door is 5 mpg towing a 10,000 lb trailer and it dogs on the hills (with 285 tires which I know cost me some preformance). You will miss the torque of the BB pulling hills and it gets 7 mpg. I do like the better transmision with overdrive but not sure if its worth the work. As stated the diesel would be the ultimate for towing, mpg and all around match for a more modern 1-ton set-up but doubt its in the budget.

Matt

[glock35ipsc]

5 mpg? Wow, that is terrible! My 02 1500HD averaged 10-12 pulling, and it loved hills. 8 was the worst it ever got, but I was WAAAAAY overloaded!.

[Kinghat]

I may have to stick to a Blazer tank. I am actually going to cut a foot out of the length of a short-bed (making it 5.5 feet) and I am pretty sure the saddle tanks would be interfering with the rear suspension.

[Walts_restoration]

king, that was my plan for my ccsb if i ever find a body for the right price, just a single blazer tank. Only problem i can forsee is gas filler.

[Davidmichael]

IMO if your going to do a swap, definitely do a cumming swap. that would be the ideal motor for towing.

[Kinghat]

by the way, this is the rig.



and this is a photoshop someone did to show my bed length idea

[N2TRUX]

What are you towing? I know the trend is to shorten the CC's but the shorter it is the harder it is to tow.

[Kinghat]

nothing massive, just a trailer and maybe a camper someday. I did think about that, but I am willing to sacrifice some function for form. And, this would still be the same wheelbase as a LWB and most likely a few inches longer. I still haven't even bought the truck yet, but I have a 3/4 axle located to get to a single rear wheel. If I understand everything correctly, the spring hangers will have to be changed out to 3/4 too.

[N2TRUX]

Originally Posted by Kinghat

... If I understand everything correctly, the spring hangers will have to be changed out to 3/4 too.

Just wondering. Yes you will need springs, hangers, etc from the C20. The C30 spring is wider.

[phishninmn]

yes you are right the hangers need to be changed

[RandyP]

Looks weird without the wheel being centered in the bed. Just my opinion though, everyone has one. I know the modern crew cabs that have the little 5' bed are just about like your photoshop pictures, but I guess since I've never seen a square with a 5' bed it just looks weird.

But yet, the more I stare at it, it screams I AM SEXY!! LOVE ME!!

[iroc12valve]

Of those two choices I suggest BIG BLOCK all the way, granted the 6.0 could get better mileage empty, theres a reason that gm kept making the 8.1 until 2004. plus you could put $2000 into the big block and have a great Ride, you cant swap a stock 6.0 for that.

Keep in mind that the big block also only has 2 sensors oil press and water temp. the 6.0 has, well ... alot and they're all expensive

As far as a swap goes I'm for the Cummins 12v 100%, any other motor like 50% lol

[MONTEZ]

Originally Posted by iroc12valve

Of those two choices I suggest BIG BLOCK all the way, granted the 6.0 could get better mileage empty, theres a reason that gm kept making the 8.1 until 2004. plus you could put $2000 into the big block and have a great Ride, you cant swap a stock 6.0 for that.

Keep in mind that the big block also only has 2 sensors oil press and water temp. the 6.0 has, well ... alot and they're all expensive

As far as a swap goes I'm for the Cummins 12v 100%, any other motor like 50% lol

It's too bad that the new 8.1 will be based in the mark IV design. That's a step back. But a guess you can blame it on the economy, it all happened during the bail out when they had to scrap the new design and make something fast.

[D.FENS]

I considered keeping the 454 in my truck, but to swap out the TH400 for a 4L80E (including the standalone controller), freshen up the motor (150K on it now) and tune up the TBI system would cost more than a swap, and I can get some of the money back selling the stock motor / trans.

A friend's dad has a 2500HD with a 6.0, they use the truck to pull a 2-car bumper pull trailer. You definitely know the trailer is there, especially with two cars on it, but the truck doesn't seem to have a problem pulling it. Seems like he says the truck gets 12 - 13mpg with a full load.

What are you guys pulling that you NEED 2000ft/lbs of torque to do the job - Abrahms tanks, MRAPs? An older Kenworth or Freightliner rig might be a better choice for some of you.

[powerdriver 1958]

I have done some side by side 454 /6.0 comparison.Boy has an 06 ext cab 3/4 6.0 powered and pulled his mud truck.I used a one ton 454 tbi to pull my mudder , both auto trans.

6.0 beat the 454 in every way . His mileage was better , He pulled hills better.

[68 TT]

Stick with the 454 but put a 4L80E in there.

If you want more pulling power after you get it on the road then drop in a 4.25" stroke crank kit to make it a 496 and gain a bunch of torque.

A conversion to TBI on the 454 would make it run better and would also cover the electronic trans control at the same time. Look for a 94-95 vintage donor rig with the 16197427 PCM to control the engine & trans.

If you find the right donor Suburban you could get the trans, TBI setup, wire harness & PCM. For that matter you could just drop the whole engine / trans combo from the donor in there and it would run just like it did in the donor with no custom chip burning needed.

I see wrecked 92-95 Suburbans go for under $1000 so it is less than what you would have into the 4L80E trans and the stand alone controller for it. Any new body style HD 3/4-ton or 1-ton automatic truck or Suburban will have the 4L80E so it doesn't have to be a 454 powered rig.