Lose the death wiggle

[bMr]

You folks who tow definitely know what I'm talking about, where she gets to swaying and you're sawing at the wheel glancing at which ditch looks more appealing.

Moved a '50 Chevy Fleetline for a buddy recently and, WOW, what a difference the steering rebuild made. Red Head Steering boxes first crossed my radar on here somewhere but there wasn't any feedback on them; after having zero luck with the spray-n-pray "rebuilds" from the box stores on another truck, it seemed worth a shot. Tie rods, pitman and idler arms later and it is night and day.

I wasn't around to drive this thing when new but methinks it's as good as or better than. No more sawing at the wheel, tracks straight, actually provides this thing called 'feedback.' Who knew!

[LSUMurse]

Originally Posted by bMr

sawing at the wheel glancing at which ditch looks more appealing.

I saw an F150 go airborne going down an overpass too fast pulling a 6000 lb generator. The amount of "death wiggle" he had going before the trailer decided to make the truck a Boeing F150 was amazing.

Beautiful pic by the way. I love the barn in the background. This pic will make it onto my desktop rotation.

[bMr]

Thanks man!

[King Cary]

I learned about the death wiggle many years ago... My buddy and I were about 17 at the time and we had his grandfathers F-150 and we picked up this Monte Carlo and was towing it on a trailer and got a little too fast. By the time we got it under control again we both had to pull a couple of large chunks of seat cushion from our butts... We learned a great lesson... SLOW DOWN!!!

[Saclandman]

Had the death wiggle last month pulling my trailered 67 C20 with my Tahoe. 40 mph for 30 miles on the freeway. Huge pucker factor. Good times.

[taylorbg]

I just posted a question about this yesterday in the 4x4 section.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=631088

I was already planning on getting the redhead steering box to fix the play in the steering wheel. I like to compare it to driving on ice.

I read conflicting thoughts on weather or not that would help with the trailer sway problem I had this weekend. It worked for you? While in there should I just go ahead and replace the Tie rods, pitman and idler arms too? Or replace the box, then see how it works before replace those additional items?

Thanks guys.

[Cape Codder]

Years ago I was sent out to tow a wrecker that had a car in tow already. I had a conventional sling but the towed wrecker had one of those old cradle jobs with the straps hanging from a crossbar down to the wheel trays. When I got up to 50 all three started swaying back and forth like a snake going down the road. I got of the next exit and took the slow way home.

[FirstOwner69]

Trailer sway can usually be reduced or eliminated by running 10% to 15% (target 12%) of the gross trailer weight on the hitch. I'd check that before replacing expensive steering components unless you know the components are worn to the point of needing replacement. For the boat pictured above, I'd drop the hitch until the trailer is level. Then check the tongue weight (at that height) vs. the gross load (trailer plus boat, fuel and gear). If not near 12% you can move the trailer axles rearward. For that size boat and a dead weight hitch, it doesn't look like much weight on the back of the Suburban. I'd guess that boat, trailer and gear weigh at least 4500#-5000#. If so, weight on the hitch should be 550# to 600#.

[LSUMurse]

Originally Posted by FirstOwner69

Trailer sway can usually be reduced or eliminated by running 10% to 15% (target 12%) of the gross trailer weight on the hitch. I'd check that before replacing expensive steering components unless you know the components are worn to the point of needing replacement. For the boat pictured above, I'd drop the hitch until the trailer is level. Then check the tongue weight (at that height) vs. the gross load (trailer plus boat, fuel and gear). If not near 12% you can move the trailer axles rearward. For that size boat and a dead weight hitch, it doesn't look like much weight on the back of the Suburban. I'd guess that boat, trailer and gear weigh at least 4500#-5000#. If so, weight on the hitch should be 550# to 600#.

I didn't know all that. Thanks for posting. I pull a boat with mine and had it up to 65 mph with no problems, though it isn't near as big as the one in the pic (single axle trailer). I must be in the sweet spot.

[FirstOwner69]

Originally Posted by LSUMurse

I didn't know all that. Thanks for posting. I pull a boat with mine and had it up to 65 mph with no problems, though it isn't near as big as the one in the pic (single axle trailer). I must be in the sweet spot.

Yup, you must be properly balanced.

What I didn't state above is that cargo trailers, unlike boat trailers, don't have axles that can be moved fore and aft. So, the obvious solution for cargo trailers is to re-position the load forward on the trailer to increase tongue weight and reduce sway.

[Already Gone]

Timely thread for me. A friend of mine bought a 1970 Plymouth GTX and tomorrow we are going to pick it up with my 4 x 2 Cop Tahoe. We are going to be using a U Haul trailer like the one i the attached pics when I picked up his 1969 Dodge Coronet Super Bee a few years ago. I pulled the Bee on the trailer about 100 miles at 60/65 MPH with no sway or any other problems. I have about a 200 trip tomorrow and will post pics on this thread when done.

[Orange67]

My Dad and I learned the hard way about proper weight distribution. 85 Chev 3/4 ton 4x4 pulling a flat bed trailer with another 85 Chev 4x4 backwards (only way we could get it on, it had a snow plow) hitting I-15 NB, 35 mph, she started the sway, dad counter steered 5-6 times, we ended up facing the wrong way in the slow lane. Pucker factor- 10.5...

[slow-1]

Originally Posted by FirstOwner69

Trailer sway can usually be reduced or eliminated by running 10% to 15% (target 12%) of the gross trailer weight on the hitch. I'd check that before replacing expensive steering components unless you know the components are worn to the point of needing replacement. For the boat pictured above, I'd drop the hitch until the trailer is level. Then check the tongue weight (at that height) vs. the gross load (trailer plus boat, fuel and gear). If not near 12% you can move the trailer axles rearward. For that size boat and a dead weight hitch, it doesn't look like much weight on the back of the Suburban. I'd guess that boat, trailer and gear weigh at least 4500#-5000#. If so, weight on the hitch should be 550# to 600#.

Good advise, you can also adjust boats by moving the winch stand forward or backward to get the weight right...cars are easy, just drive it on the trailer til its right.

[FirstOwner69]

Originally Posted by slow-1

Good advise, you can also adjust boats by moving the winch stand forward or backward to get the weight right...cars are easy, just drive it on the trailer til its right.

True, but that adjustment is somewhat limited by how close you want the winch stand to the back of the vehicle and the location of, and ability to move, hull supports to properly support the the boat. Cars on trailers are actually pretty easy as you state, especially if you know the weight distribution of the car. A good starting point might be to center front doors over the trailer axles or slightly forward of the axles.

[haysonj]

Originally Posted by taylorbg

I just posted a question about this yesterday in the 4x4 section.

http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...d.php?t=631088

I was already planning on getting the redhead steering box to fix the play in the steering wheel. I like to compare it to driving on ice.

I read conflicting thoughts on weather or not that would help with the trailer sway problem I had this weekend. It worked for you? While in there should I just go ahead and replace the Tie rods, pitman and idler arms too? Or replace the box, then see how it works before replace those additional items?

Thanks guys.

Your trailer almost looks too short for the boat or the axles are too far forward. You have the entire weight of the engine and outdrive behind the axles so there can't be a lot of tongue weight. My boat weighes 5000 and look at where my axles are in relation to the boat.

[taylorbg]

Hmmm. That trailer is what came with the boat. I just bought it last September and the lake isn't far from me, so I don't have a lot of miles on the trailer. Plus it was in a slip until November, as that is where the previous owner kept it. Not sure how you go about having that checked out. Maybe a boat/trailer repair shot?

[slow-1]

Originally Posted by FirstOwner69

True, but that adjustment is somewhat limited by how close you want the winch stand to the back of the vehicle and the location of, and ability to move, hull supports to properly support the the boat.

Yep...there are 1000s of different boats on 1000s of different trailers...you have to hope you end up with a good combo.

I bought a new trailer for my 20 ft. boat a couple years back, I got one big enough for a 25 ft boat so I would have plenty of adjustment in it as I drag my boat to the Keys a couple times a year (1800 miles round trip).

[slow-1]

Originally Posted by taylorbg

Hmmm. That trailer is what came with the boat. I just bought it last September and the lake isn't far from me, so I don't have a lot of miles on the trailer. Plus it was in a slip until November, as that is where the previous owner kept it. Not sure how you go about having that checked out. Maybe a boat/trailer repair shot?

An easy way to see if you need to do some adjusting is to hook up the rig and put some weight up front in the boat, maybe a couple deep cycle batteries or anything heavy, then drag it down the road to see if its better.

[FirstOwner69]

Originally Posted by taylorbg

Hmmm. That trailer is what came with the boat. I just bought it last September and the lake isn't far from me, so I don't have a lot of miles on the trailer. Plus it was in a slip until November, as that is where the previous owner kept it. Not sure how you go about having that checked out. Maybe a boat/trailer repair shot?

First, be sure your trailer is close to level when hitched. If not get a ball mount with a drop that levels it.

Then...
If the bunks go within a few inches of the rear or the boat, your trailer length is probably fine. I can't really tell from your picture. If not, is there room to move the winch post forward as suggested in one of the previous posts? When the bunks are properly positioned, take the truck and boat with the usual gear in the boat to a truck scale. Unhook the trailer with the tongue jack on the scale (and truck off the scale) and get a gross weight of the boat and trailer. Then pull it forward so the tongue jack is off the scale and unhitch again with the jack at the same height as when hitched to the truck. Get the gross weight again. The difference in the 2 weights is your tongue weight or hitch weight. As I stated in post 8, the tongue weight should be about 10% to 15% of the gross weight. I wouldn't run less and would shoot for 12%-15%. If not, and if the bunks are properly positioned near the rear of the boat, you'll have to move the axles backward to increase tongue weight or forward to decrease it (doubtful). Also, once you get the tongue weight where you need it, check the deadweight hitch rating to be sure the hitch is adequate.

[darush01]

I once pulled a ford escort behind a rand on a trailer that was too short, (stupid stupid stupid) but I had to get it moved or lose it and anything over 30 mph was suicide I hauled that 10 miles that way and am ver fortunate my stupidity didn't cause a wreck. I blame my youth I was only 17 the car hung over about 2 foot

[67 chevelle]

Dont forget control arm bushings , they will cause this also , found that out the hard way

[quick60]

Sway usually means there is not enough weight on the tounge of the trailer. Moving the load forward till you see the rear of the tow vehicle start to settle a little usually fixes it.

[Already Gone]

Went about 200 miles one way yesterday and picked up this Barn Find 70 GTX that my friend bought and had been stting since 1999. Used the U-Haul transporter trailer and I had no wiggle issues at 60 MPH. Put the trailer and car on a weigh scale and it weighted 5300lbs. Front and back axles on the Tahoe added up 6200lbs. Biggest problem I had was getting from the barn to the main road in the mudI got stuck and a tractor had to pull me out.

[WIDESIDE72]

Originally Posted by quick60

Sway usually means there is not enough weight on the tounge of the trailer. Moving the load forward till you see the rear of the tow vehicle start to settle a little usually fixes it.

X2

A few years ago when gas went so high I quit driving a 1/2 ton truck for a daily driver. I decided since it was setting under the carport most of the time and I only used it for towing I would sell it and buy a 3/4 ton. This solved all of my issues.

[davepl]

Originally Posted by haysonj

Your trailer almost looks too short for the boat or the axles are too far forward. You have the entire weight of the engine and outdrive behind the axles so there can't be a lot of tongue weight. My boat weighes 5000 and look at where my axles are in relation to the boat.

Looks OK to me. It's about the same setup as mine and the trailer came from the factory specifically for that boat (23' SeaRay Sundeck, so same general type of boat too). And I've towed it through mountain passes and other interesting terrain without incident.

I wish I had a total weight. Then with a bathroom scale and a 2x4 you should be able to get a tongue weight.