"Pinché Caliché" '57 StepSide/LSx/CrownVic

[t-tung]

Hey guys. Been lurking here a while and finally picked up a project of my own this past weekend. Plan is to get the 235 running, yank it and the 3-speed. Then in goes:
5.3 with some goodies
Built TH350 or 400 with manual valvebody
Crown vic front
8.8 rear
'99 1500 steering column
Going to get it low and tuck some 20x9 BMF Novakane's wrapped in either 285/50 TerraGrapplers or 285/55 BFG A/Ts or "gravel chunkers" as my grandpa would call them. Going with 17" Novakanes up front with respective tires in a smaller size.
Exterior wise, I'm just going to clear it after I rehang the doors and take care of a few holes. I'll probably CLR, clear and polish the engine compartment to show off the original dark blue color of the truck. For the bed, I plan on chopping the floor and wheel wells out of an 80's Chevy bed (or whatever bed I can get on the cheap), weld them in utilizing the wheel wells from the donor bed to make clearance for the bigger tires. Then have it Armadillo-lined.
Interior is my weakness. I've figured out what seat I'm going to get but I'll let that be a surprise. Just not sure what colors to go with inside. I've been kicking around the idea of sanding it all down and cold-bluing the whole thing and using some steel wool to give it some grain. I don't really want to paint it because black is so hard to get to look good.
Anyways it should be a fun project for my dad and I. Can't wait to get it done and tear down some caliche roads.

[Joe Pass]

Welcome...Sounds like you been thinking this through...Can't wait to see some pictures

[t-tung]

Yessir, I've had a lot of time to think about things while I was truckless. Now all it takes is a lot of time and a little money (or viceversa ). There's a lot of little stuff I can do to it right now to keep me busy while I left my project fund replenish.

[Kim57]

Welcome.
Sounds like a neat project.
Keep the pics coming on your progress.
Kim

[t-tung]

Thank you. I've been following your build for a little while now. Nice work. What are the measurements on those tires?? The ones I'm looking at are right around 32". Just wondering how high I'm going to have to cut to get them to fit once I do a spring-under with the 8.8.

[Kim57]

My rear tires are 29" tall.
Kim

[RockinKees]

Sounds like a great project!
Keep the pics coming!

[t-tung]

Well, the motor is alive! Runs strong too. It came with damn near everything replaced on the motor except the starter and the water pump. Bought a new battery, rough checked the timing to make sure it was in the ball-park, checked the oil, coil had power, new plugs and wires had spark, new fuel pump was pumping.... Everything was good except the intake bolts were finger tight. Took it and exhaust manifold off and used some extreme temp copper gasket sealant (for the time being) on them and bolted it back up. After 30 minutes of jacking with grounds, we determined the started is just flat wore out. Hooked up a tow rope to it, started down the road , dumped the clutch and it fired right up. Adjusted the idle and let it purr like a kitten for 10 minutes. It was a good feeling. It was the first time I'd ever heard one of these old motors run in person. Gotta love it. Now we get to yank it out.

Found out the yard I'm getting my 8.8 from has 4 running 5.3s. One has been pulled and has no ECU, the other 3 are still in the vehicles. The beautiful thing is, I'm probably going to be able to pick one up for less than half of what I was expecting to pay AND they'll be coming with trannies. I wasn't planning on jacking with an electronically controlled transmission but for the price I guess I'll just deal with the headache. I'll also be able to pull the steering column and pedal assembly.
Need to find a stock gas tank to fit between the framerails and possibly a radiator/fan combo to use. Any suggestions on what to keep a lookout for??

On another note, he's got a wrecked Saleen with a 6-speed in the yard with only 4X,XXX miles on it. Said I can have the whole car for $3K just not sure I want to deal with putting a Ford motor in this old truck. I don't know anything about them, wiring will be some one-off headache that few people (relatively) have done and......I'll never hear the end of it from all of my Ford buddies. Hell, the front and rearend are both going to be Ford, why not the engine and tranny too?? I don't know. I'm on the fence about it. Before I get either motor, I need to get a Crown Vic crossmember situated up front. What do y'all think?

[NEWFISHER]

Fords are for show... Chevys are for go.

[t-tung]

Originally Posted by NEWFISHER

Fords are for show... Chevys are for go.

I like your demeanor. The Saleen is an 06 model. I've been looking into it for the last five minutes and there's not much that impresses me. S281, 300hp...yada yada. If it's the supercharged done with 500ish HP I may be interested, but as of now I'd have to pass. The only other the appetizing about it would be if the front end isn't a pretzel, I could chop the frame at the firewall and make it fit. If it's the 300hp model though, I'm 92.667 percent out

On another note, the words "6-speed" has me thinking about an NV-4500. I know they're heavy bastards but has anybody done one with this swap. I know where there's one sitting in a bread truck that I almost swapped into my 350/YJ project.

[OneOffStroker]

The NV-4500 is a 5-speed, isn't it? and with a 5.xx first gear, it's basically a 4-speed now, since you can't really use first gear for more than pulling trees.

I have an NV-3500 for mine and it even has a 4.03 first gear, which would be useless with any decent rear end gear, but it will fit just right with my Jag IRS and its 2.88

Basically, if you want a 6-speed, you will need to pony up the big bucks for a t-56. Around here, they go for around $1200-ish. I constantly monitor the junkyards around here for a Camaro or Trans-Am with one, but all they ever get are auto cars. However, if the day comes, I may be able to score one for $150!!!

Anyways...you got a cool truck, with some great patina. Enjoy your time working on it.

[iowaboynca]

I'm curious on how you'll mate the crown vic front end. I'm thinking of doing this to a '63 F*&d unibody we have out at our ranch.

Good luck!

[t-tung]

Ah yes. You are right. Not sure why I was thinking it was a 6 speed. If I went with it, I'd definitely be running some 3.55's to make use of the granny gear. The equalizer is that I'll be running a 285/50r20 rear tire. It really soaks up some gear. At 70mph, I'd be turning 1952rpms. Even if I left the stock 3.73 gears in it, I'd be turning 2051rpms at 70mph in over-drive. Would be a great cruiser and still get off the line in a hurry. Here's a great gear/speed calculator I found some time ago when I was building my jeep. http://www.grimmjeeper.com/gears.html

Did a little work yesterday before dark. Got the bed all cleaned out and ready to go back in with the floor out of a donor bed. Located all of the major components today. Motor, trans (if I want it) & steering column out of a 2002 Tahoe, 8.8 3.73 rear end out of an 01 Exploder and front crossmember out of an 04 Mercury Marauder. He's also go a high milage, 2000 6.0L I'm thinking about taking the cable throttle body and pedal assembly out of. Does anybody know if it's a straight swap? I'd like a cable controlled throttle instead of the later electronic controlled one.

[t-tung]

Originally Posted by iowaboynca

I'm curious on how you'll mate the crown vic front end. I'm thinking of doing this to a '63 F*&d unibody we have out at our ranch.

Good luck!

As far as dimensions, it should fit the frame nicely with few modifications. I'm more worries about motor mounts and mating it to a chevy steering column. I'll cross that bridge when I get there I guess

[ricott]

Originally Posted by t-tung

A He's also go a high milage, 2000 6.0L I'm thinking about taking the cable throttle body and pedal assembly out of. Does anybody know if it's a straight swap? I'd like a cable controlled throttle instead of the later electronic controlled one.

To answer your Drive by wire/Drive by cable question, it is A very simple swap. All you really have to do is replace throttle bodies. You take the 3 bolts holding the throttle body off and slip on the Drive by Cable Throttle body. You will also need the correct wiring harness - the Drive by Wire connectors that plug into the computer are red and GREEN. the Drive by Cable Harness ends are Red and BLUE. If you are doing an auto, it is super easy to wire one of these up using a truck harness. Once you get it going, I can promise that you will NEVER go back to the earlier chevy engines. Good luck.

[t-tung]

Originally Posted by ricott

To answer your Drive by wire/Drive by cable question, it is A very simple swap. All you really have to do is replace throttle bodies. You take the 3 bolts holding the throttle body off and slip on the Drive by Cable Throttle body. You will also need the correct wiring harness - the Drive by Wire connectors that plug into the computer are red and GREEN. the Drive by Cable Harness ends are Red and BLUE. If you are doing an auto, it is super easy to wire one of these up using a truck harness. Once you get it going, I can promise that you will NEVER go back to the earlier chevy engines. Good luck.

Thank you sir. Sounds simple enough. Any suggestions on someone to tune the ECU/TCU if I go the 4L60E route? I'm pretty sure I can trim all of the unneeded wires, I just need someone to workover the computer.

[ricott]

Originally Posted by t-tung

Thank you sir. Sounds simple enough. Any suggestions on someone to tune the ECU/TCU if I go the 4L60E route? I'm pretty sure I can trim all of the unneeded wires, I just need someone to workover the computer.

If you get a truck pullout (engine/tranny/wiring harness/MAF and computer) all you need to do is send the computer off and have the "theft" and "Rear O2 sensors" turned off. There are several here or on the LS1 board that are good. The complete system thinks it is still in the truck it came from. When you start "mixing and matching" (for ex, LS1 intake or different injectors or hotter cam and headers or different MAF) is only when you need to have it tuned. If you buy the 6.0 drive by cable, make sure you get that computer. The computer for 2000-2002 (camaro, corvette,pick up) for all intents is the same (I use computer service number -last four digits - 0411), only the programming is different. I've done several, and it gets easier each time - but the first time is a learning curve for sure. If you plan to go this route, and want to discuss, you can PM me and we can talk. Hope this helps.

Ricky

[OneOffStroker]

I did a 5.3 swap into my '69 Suburban, and it was pretty easy. I used www.lt1swap.com for all the wiring harness modification info. I also sent my ECU to Brandan (lt1swap) to have him flash the theft and rear O2 sensors, plus configure the electric fan to come on from the ECU. It was very reasonable for price, and very quick turn around.

I took that motor out of the Burb and will be using it again in my '57...so that should let you know how pleased I was with it. However, this time it will get a pair of turbos and some other goodies.

Oh yeah, and when you get around to the fuel tank and whatnot, definitely use and in-tank pump. I used an inline external for quite some time and they are so noisy that you will be sorry you spent the money on it and will end up spending more to re-do it with an internal pump.

[t-tung]

Thanks for the info guys. Hopefully picking up the Marauder crossmember this weekend.
Ricott: Is it hard to get the drive by wire throttle to work? Somewhere I read it was a big headache for one reason or another with the ECU and they ended up just swapping a drive-by-cable TB on it. I guess I've got a few options here because he has a couple 5.3s already pulled with no ECU or wiring harness. I could just pull the TB, intake, wiring harness and ECU off of the 6.0L. I've got a buddy with a built 4L80E with a shiftkit I could probably pick up for 2-250$. It should plug right into 6.0L harness shouldn't it? I'm just not sure what year the 4L80 is. Decisions, decisions..... If the 6.0 had aluminum heads and didn't have 225,xxx miles on it, it would be a no brainer for me.

OneOff: I was on the fence about the pump. I was thinking about an insulated box to fit around it inside the frame rail if I ran an inline pump. You're probably right though, I'd end up doing it all over. What tank are you running in your 57? I was thinking about having a 15ga aluminum one made to go between the frame rails behind the axle. Not sure yet. I've been looking at LT1swap.com quite a bit. I'm sure that's who I'll be using to fix the computer. Just need to figure out what combo of motors, wiring harnesses and tranny will be the least headache. Supposedly he's got another rolled Tahoe coming in by the end of the week. Hopefully it'll have everything I need so I can just swap it all out in one piece

[t-tung]

Well...... it may not look like it but, it feels like we got a lot done this past weekend.
Pulled a 3.73 8.8 Ford that was given to me out of an Exploder.
Picked up a front end out of an 04 Grand Marquis for $450
Cut all the crap out of the bed and halphass cleaned it up
Pulled the front clip, motor, tranny, crossmember, front axle and everything else off of the frame.
Drilled aligning holes and mocked up the Marquis front end.
Cleaned everything off the firewall and out from underneath the dash.

It looks like the Ford "bridge" is going to fit nicely. There is quite a bit of space on the outside and on top of the frame but it shouldn't be a problem. I'm going to weld in some spacers that will extend don through the top of the frame and be welded to the inside of the bottom of the frame. It was hell trying to align the bridge with the frame but we got it as close as humanly possible without high-tech lasers and computers. I'm happy with it


On another note, I just realized they don't make the 20' wheels I want in a 5x4.5 bolt pattern. Soooo it's back to the drawing board. I'm looking at these AMR wheels in an 18" for the front which will be perfect because of the wider stance of the Marquis front end. The problem I'm having is that I need a 20x9 or 20x10 rear wheel that has 0 offset or slightly negative offset because of the narrower 8.8. Any ideas or suggestions on where I can find some or what brands to look at? As far as I now, the AMRs don't come with the offset I need.

I also locked down a deal on a whole 02 Tahoe that was rolled for $1000. Going to pull the motor and trans, steering column, pedal assembly, brake system and all this week hopefully if weather permits. A buddy of mine has a cam for me for cheap if I want it. I won't pretend to be a cam wizard so I'll let y'all tell me what you think. He says it'll be very streetable with the right converter, and sound good too. It's a Texas Speed 228R 228/228 .588"/.588" 112LSA cam. Says all I'll need is some new springs and hardened pushrods along with (probably) a 3200 stall converter. Plan is to get rid of the electronics on the 4L60E and put a Transgo Stage 3 full manual shift kit in it.

[RockinKees]

Looks like a very nice fit!

Can't help you with the cam.

[Kim57]

Nice progress.
Kim

[OneOffStroker]

That cam seems like a good deal if you don't have to pay for it. Cam selection should always be based on what you want to do with your vehicle, so if it is the RIGHT cam for your truck?? That depends on how you plan to drive it.

As far as removing the electronics from the trans...I don't really know if you can do that to a 4L60E. I would highly recommend that you don't if it is even possible. I feel that the only thing keeping those slush-boxes together is the electronics. It would basically become a 700-r4 without electronics, and those things implode with even the slightest mis-adjustment of the TV cable. That leads to rebuilding a trans, which leads one to wonder why they didn't just put a manual trans in it from the start.
Bottom line...get a 5 or 6-speed and enjoy the truck from the get-go.

[t-tung]

I hear ya on the cam. It won't be free but pretty cheap. The cheapest LS6 cam I've found locally is $180. This cam I can get for 200$. As for use, it won't be a daily driver. More like a weekend cruiser, short road trips (3 hours) to car shows, maybe a few trips to the track and a whole lot of terrorizing the local import/ricers that drive around annoying the hell out me.

As for the transmission, for the price in going to run it. I just like th idea of being able to shift it when I want, depending on the situation. I've been doing a lot of reading up on it and opinions seem to be split down the middle.....love it or think it's a bad idea/put a manual tranny in like you said. The NV4500 I'm wanting is going to cost me as much as the whole donor Tahoe. That's another grand if have to spend. Here's just one thread on the topic.... There are several http://ls1tech.com/forums/automatic-...alve-body.html
I'm going to have the local shop go through the tranny and make sure everything is Kosher before I go romping on it. In reality though, as little as I'm going to drive it, I'm not worried about long long term durability.....I may only put another 10,000 miles on it once it's done. If it gives Up the ghost then, I'll either shell out the $2k for a built phoenix tranny or swap in that nv4500. For right now I'm just going to get it on the road with what I've got. Just curious, what do those NV3500s run? I haven't looked. IIRC, they either came stock in some Wranglers or it was a very popular swap into them. I know they were leaps and bounds more reliable than the AX-5 that came behind the 4-banger in my YJ

[t-tung]

Not much to report other than getting the frame sleeved for the 4 thru-bolts. I think boxing it is going to be a SOB with the way the frame tapers slightly from back to front and dips down a little. Then the bottom "rail" of the frame is wider in places. I think I'm just going to take a straight edge and a torch and square everything up as much as possible. Going back in with 1/4" diamond plate because I have half a sheet left over from a bumper project from my jeep.
Currently, we're trying to get the tranny cross-member out. Every single rivet is fighting us tooth and nail. Gave up for the night.