Opinions on replacing a 454 with an ls.

[79c25]

Ok so I have been thinking about replacing my bbc with a ls engine but I'm lost on which one would be the best for daily driving with towing occasionally or losing the 3/4 ton capability. I already know that I want either a 4L80E or a NV4500 in it but I can't decide if the 5.3 would be fine or if I should go with a 6.0. I also know I can put a supercharger on the 5.3 and make a good amount of power but that's just more money out the door. Either way I will at least double the current MPG which will make my wife happy.

[Alex41]

I would suggest the Lq4 6.0 and 4L80e combo. They are readily available, easily customizable, and with the 4.0 plus bore size, accept the biggest heads GM makes. With the Lq4, you are only looking at around 9.2:1 compression so regular pump gas is an option but 93 is preferred. This leaves you room to add forced induction in the future

[79c25]

That's what I was thinking but I also will have a strict budget to stick to, I already have the ok to do the swap. Now just to find an engine and trans. I probably will try to find a 4X4 because I eventually want to do a 4X4 swap in the 3/4 ton, just because it already gets stuck on level ground when it's wet out

[BigRed76]

The 5.3 will definitely be better on fuel mileage, mine gets about 17-18 mpg (in a 1/2 ton) and I've never had it tuned. But I haven't ever really pulled anything with my 5.3 either so I have no input as to how well they pull and so on. Seeing how you have a 3/4 ton, I'd personally go with a 6.0.

[Wasted Income]

I'm about sick of building LS stuff, so my next project has a big block chevy in it. I don't care about mpg or towing or daily driving it though. I just want to make gobs of power, with gobs of boost, reliably. You can't beat a BBC for that.

For your situation, I'd go with a 6.0 LQ4 or LY6. The extra torque will help get that big ol 3/4 ton moving, and will also tow better.

Originally Posted by Alex41

I would suggest the Lq4 6.0 and 4L80e combo. They are readily available, easily customizable, and with the 4.0 plus bore size, accept the biggest heads GM makes. With the Lq4, you are only looking at around 9.2:1 compression so regular pump gas is an option but 93 is preferred. This leaves you room to add forced induction in the future

Who the hell runs premium in a stock, NA, LQ4???

[BR3W CITY]

Originally Posted by Wasted Income

I'm about sick of building LS stuff, so my next project has a big block chevy in it. I don't care about mpg or towing or daily driving it though. I just want to make gobs of power, with gobs of boost, reliably. You can't beat a BBC for that.

Sure I can, LS based big block If I can't beat em, I make em join me.

[79c25]

Vortec 8100 anyone? If only I had the money, 8.1 with an Allison or ZF6. I love the sound and power of a big block but I want an ls for reliability and my wife wants better economy our of it, plus I she have more power anyways.

[BR3W CITY]

The 8100's are still an oldschool big block with a fancy top end. They don't share the same architecture as the regular LS motors.

You can build a big block LS motor with the aftermarket blocks or the GMPP blocks.

[79c25]

I thought that the 8100 was ls based because I have heard from multiple sources that the top end won't fit an old school block and the timing was the same as a ls engine

[BR3W CITY]

Originally Posted by 79c25

I thought that the 8100 was ls based because I have heard from multiple sources that the top end won't fit an old school block and the timing was the same as a ls engine

It won't fit the old block dimensionally, but thats where the base was developed. It can't use LS top end stuff either, though you can swap injectors between the two if you have an truck with Dephi injectors.

And I know this from the source that owns the patent to the 8.1 since GM sold it 3-ish years ago.

That engine has now become a freaking beast of an 8.8 which is getting used in schoolbuses to replace diesel engines. They had it n/a and turbo, with the latter making well over 1k/lbft

[BigRed76]

The few people I know with 6.0's only get about 14 mpg, and I know one guy with a 8.1 and it gets 10 mpg all day long

[79c25]

10 is still better than 8 but I think that I will go with 14 my k5 gets 13.5 with the left and 33s so 14 for a tow pig in to bad. Now if was going to be just a tow pig and not a DD then I would put the 8.1 in or a diesel but when it's all said and done I'll be putting a 5.3 in the k5 and using it as a toy.

[79c25]

Originally Posted by BR3W CITY

It won't fit the old block dimensionally, but thats where the base was developed. It can't use LS top end stuff either, though you can swap injectors between the two if you have an truck with Dephi injectors.

And I know this from the source that owns the patent to the 8.1 since GM sold it 3-ish years ago.

That engine has now become a freaking beast of an 8.8 which is getting used in schoolbuses to replace diesel engines. They had it n/a and turbo, with the latter making well over 1k/lbft

Ah, I understand now, I was mislead on the whole thing.

[BR3W CITY]

No harm no foul. Trust me when the 8.1's first came out, everyone, myself included...wanted to know what you could do with the supposed "ls big block".

Once you dig into the way they are built tho, its just not the best platform to start with, and not nearly as "modern" as the others, however modern a pushrod motor can be

The 8.8 made a number of major overhauls, and uses a differently setup block which can be designed for forced induction. They can be run off of LP and other fuels, so they still have a proud home in industrial generator, pump, bus type applications.

You can start with a LSX base and build a big-block (in terms of cubic inches) LS-architecture motor, that runs LS manifolds and all that stuff.

[79c25]

Yeah I thought about the lsx 454 but that is one $$$$$ engine, even the price of the block isn't cheap that I've found, maybe when I win the lottery. In all honesty I will most likely drop a 6.0 in there and build it up as I go, just to tote a camper and other stuff. I know that my 454 will do what I want it to do but it needs a rebuild and it leaks oil almost as fast as I can put it in.

[BR3W CITY]

Block is just under $3k, which seems expensive until you start to shop the full aftermarket blocks. So many of them are starting with a GMPP base anyway.

[Wasted Income]

1) The "big block" LS engines aren't that great. If you want to just stay NA, I guess they are alright, but they are already thinning out the cylinder wall pretty well to get the cubes.
I have 2 local buds with ZOMGBIGBLOCK LS engines. One is an LS7 based 440", the other is an LS2 based ERL sleeved 454. They make good NA power, but are wound tight to do it. Also, I

With a REAL BBC, you are not limited to 500ish cubes...and the power/reliability comes with the cubes.

2) I've got the marinized vortec 8100 in my boat. It's a great engine...if you leave it stock. They have glass bottom ends, and do not like any sort of boost.
BUT, it will make 425 hp, at wide open throttle, all. day. long.

[BR3W CITY]

Thats why the 8.1-based engines are so popular for industrial usage still, power be 1k and can run a few grand ALL day long.

I'm not Sonny Leonard, I have no need for 700 cubes yet

[Wasted Income]

Originally Posted by BR3W CITY

I'm not Sonny Leonard, I have no need for 700 cubes yet

I'm not even talking about a mountain motor....just a nice mid-500 cube BBC.

By the time you spend the money on an LSX/LSNext/ERL/RHS/Motown/Warhawk block, all the forged goodies inside, a set of heads to support the cubes and RPM required, a ported FAST intake, etc.....you're really not much money away from a dart blocked BBC.

My neighbor has a Steve Schmidt 565 in his chevelle. 850 hp on pump gas, NA. The procharger F1X install should be done this spring, and it should be an easy 1200-1500 whp street car...and far more reliable than an LS that had the screws turned that tight.

[boynton]

I am setting up a LY6/6L80 for my truck right now. My dad has the same motor in his '09 3/4 ton and it runs well. I am a big fan of them. My dad put 300,000 on his last one and it only went through one transmission, water pump and alternator in that time. He hauls trailers all the time usually loaded with a car/building materials. He also hauls a 24' bumper pull travel trailer as well. These motors come in any 3/4 ton truck/van. They are a nice find if you can get one!

As far as LS motors being un reliable, I have a few friends making over 1,000 HP with stock bottom end 5.3. The LS motors are a beast and will go 200,000+ (stock configuration) miles easy. But then again nothing beats the sound of a big block. It all boils down to personal preference!

[Wasted Income]

Originally Posted by boynton

As far as LS motors being un reliable, I have a few friends making over 1,000 HP with stock bottom end 5.3. The LS motors are a beast and will go 200,000+ (stock configuration) miles easy. But then again nothing beats the sound of a big block. It all boils down to personal preference!

Check my sig. I know very well what the limits of a boosted junkyard LS are. Sure you can make 1000 hp with a SBE 5.3....but it won't live long.

I got sick of swapping junkyard LS shortblocks, so I put a forged bottom end LS in my rig. It runs great, and should be "reliable" up to around 1000 rwhp. Make no mistake, I love LS engines.

The beauty of the LS, is that you can make great power with a lot of stock parts. When you surpass that threshold, and start needing aftermarket heads, block, rotating assembly....you're almost the same money to build a big block. The BBC really pulls away when you start pouring cubic dollars into it. I've heard that boost is the replacement for displacement....but when you boost something with a lot of displacement, all bets are off



To the OP: If you're planning on building a cruiser, for daily driving and towing, an LS would probably be your best bet. If this truck is a weekend fun toy, I personally would swap it over to EFI, put an overdrive behind it, make some upgrades and go beat up on LS rigs. As time goes on, it will be more and more rare to see a big block on one of these trucks, since everybody is swapping to LS stuff now.

[79c25]

Originally Posted by Wasted Income

To the OP: If you're planning on building a cruiser, for daily driving and towing, an LS would probably be your best bet. If this truck is a weekend fun toy, I personally would swap it over to EFI, put an overdrive behind it, make some upgrades and go beat up on LS rigs. As time goes on, it will be more and more rare to see a big block on one of these trucks, since everybody is swapping to LS stuff now.

That's another thing that is holding me back, maybe for now i could just get a 4L80E and an aftermarket controller for it and rebuild the BB, I'm (well my wife ) mostly interested in fuel economy while being able to do its job. She want to have something that we can pull our horses or our 21ft camper to Michigan, Colorado, and North Dakota, and maybe out to Washington. I know the bb will do it just can't pass the pumps on the way.

[BR3W CITY]

Originally Posted by Wasted Income

By the time you spend the money on an LSX/LSNext/ERL/RHS/Motown/Warhawk block, all the forged goodies inside, a set of heads to support the cubes and RPM required, a ported FAST intake, etc.....you're really not much money away from a dart blocked BBC.
.

Maybe I'm the exception to this one. If I build anything BBC, I'm stuck with normal suppliers and paying near retail. If I build LS motors, I get handshake deals from a few of the bigs. Its still expensive as sh!t, otherwise I'd have a bowtie block in my truck already.

[boynton]

Originally Posted by Wasted Income

Check my sig. I know very well what the limits of a boosted junkyard LS are. Sure you can make 1000 hp with a SBE 5.3....but it won't live long.

I got sick of swapping junkyard LS shortblocks, so I put a forged bottom end LS in my rig. It runs great, and should be "reliable" up to around 1000 rwhp. Make no mistake, I love LS engines.

The beauty of the LS, is that you can make great power with a lot of stock parts. When you surpass that threshold, and start needing aftermarket heads, block, rotating assembly....you're almost the same money to build a big block. The BBC really pulls away when you start pouring cubic dollars into it. I've heard that boost is the replacement for displacement....but when you boost something with a lot of displacement, all bets are off



To the OP: If you're planning on building a cruiser, for daily driving and towing, an LS would probably be your best bet. If this truck is a weekend fun toy, I personally would swap it over to EFI, put an overdrive behind it, make some upgrades and go beat up on LS rigs. As time goes on, it will be more and more rare to see a big block on one of these trucks, since everybody is swapping to LS stuff now.

I was not trying to say you did not know I read through your sig before I posted. With what he is want in to do I dont think you can beat an iron block 6.0 all the power he would need plus the reliability and longevity he needs. BBCs are great as I mentioned, but you are looking at 100,000 miles...maybe the ls 6.0 will go forever doing what he wants and get much beater fuel mileage that he want, start in the cold the first time every time, and run great in heavy traffic while pulling a load. Again a BBC is awesome but my personal opinion again my opinion is a stock 6.0 especially a ly6 would be great. Drop it in wire it up set up the fuel system and go. No issues. I dont think the OP is after crazy HP unless I missed something. But as always it is open to the owners to do what they desire. I also agree if it was a weekend truck going to local car shows I would say BBC because as you mentioned they are disappearing and becoming rare. At the end of the day it will be awesome either way.

[79c25]

Originally Posted by boynton

I was not trying to say you did not know I read through your sig before I posted. With what he is want in to do I dont think you can beat an iron block 6.0 all the power he would need plus the reliability and longevity he needs. BBCs are great as I mentioned, but you are looking at 100,000 miles...maybe the ls 6.0 will go forever doing what he wants and get much beater fuel mileage that he want, start in the cold the first time every time, and run great in heavy traffic while pulling a load. Again a BBC is awesome but my personal opinion again my opinion is a stock 6.0 especially a ly6 would be great. Drop it in wire it up set up the fuel system and go. No issues. I dont think the OP is after crazy HP unless I missed something. But as always it is open to the owners to do what they desire. I also agree if it was a weekend truck going to local car shows I would say BBC because as you mentioned they are disappearing and becoming rare. At the end of the day it will be awesome either way.

I don't need 600+ horsepower just 350-500 is fine. Forced induction would be cool but I'll stick with a stock engine with maybe a ZO6 cam and an aftermarket intake, that plastic stock one just looks like garbage IMHO. The more and more I think about it I might go with a 6.0 and put a NV4500 behind it just for simplicity and I won't have to worry to much about the transmission while towing. Also I can do it in steps starting with the transmission the getting the engine and everything I need to install it even if I find a engine/trans combo with everything needed a side from the mounts. The truck I'm doing this to was originally a 350 and somewhere in its life it received the 454, so I'm not to worried about originality, just reliability and definitely able to start right up on the cold Wyoming mornings.