Bagged 65 c10. AKA the periwinkle pile

[greengrenade]

Hey all, im new to these trucks so im still learning a lot about this generation, i have a 59 apache, and a 31 model a project myself. Just sold a 62 belair that i bagged, interior, paint etc. This is my buddys 65 aka the periwinkle pile. Im doing all the fab work for him. Plans are accuair e level, tri 4 link rear, pancaked front crossmember with rack n pinion and drop spindles. Ss re7 bags on all 4 corners and some other odds and ends. Eventually its getting an lq9 and a t56 but were just bagging it now and gonna cruise it this season with the stock 230 3 speed combo. Heres a few pics of my 62 and my apache thats still in pieces and the start of this project

My 62 that i sold




My apache project


Ok say heres how the 65 started out. Clean little truck owned by an old farmer, 230, 3 on the tree. Decent little ride


Threw on a set of 20" detroit steelies, hubcaps still to come


Heres day one of the build. Got the bed off, all original rear suspension out and started cleaning the frame rails. Pics after the end of the first night





Second day we kept cleaning the frame rails and got one side of the step notch tacked up and ready to weld but i ran out of mig wire. Heres a few pics of the notch mocked up. Ill also add this was a thor bros notch and the fitment absolutely sucked





Since we ran out of wire sat night, sunday the welding store was closed, we decided to knock out the rear disc conversion on the 12 bolt. Pulled the c clips, axles out, reassembled with discs. The rear needs to be cleaned and stripped to prep for 4 link brackets. He bought the 4 wheel disc conversion kit from cpp with mast cyl and booster as well



Thats it so far. We will jump back on it this weekend

[creep]

Looks good!

[aggie91]

Nice truck to start with. let's see more!

[TJ's Chevy]

Subbed. Looking good.

[greengrenade]

Thanks guys, got a few quick questions. Does anyone have a picture or link to the no limit rack n pinion on a pancaked crossmember ? Also what are you guys on bags doing for front shock mounts ?

[aggie91]

Instead of doing the pancake on the cross member, look thru my Sunburn thread. We cut a notch in the frame rail to raise the rail into the frame and then ran No Limits rack set up. It was much less work then doing the pancake. It did raise the motor too, but it worked out well for us. I raised it 1.5", and we ran air bags in the front with 2.5" dropped spindles. We used Porterbuilt's front shock relocators.

[Coach529]

Looks like fun.....I am in!!

[greengrenade]

I want to avoid raising the engine n trans so i dont have to get into floor modifications. Especially since were planning to swap to the ls and 6 speed next year. I dont want to fab a trans tunnel etc and then find out it wont work with the ls next year

[aggie91]

Originally Posted by greengrenade

I want to avoid raising the engine n trans so i dont have to get into floor modifications. Especially since were planning to swap to the ls and 6 speed next year. I dont want to fab a trans tunnel etc and then find out it wont work with the ls next year

I understand that point. I have spoken with Rob about his rack kit on a sectioned (Pancaked) cross member and it can be done, the bracket in his kit my need to be reworked so that it is solid mounted to the cross member. It references off the front bottom lip of the cross member and that sets the height of the rack with the lower a-arms. That relation does not change with the sectioning. you might have to notch the bottom frame rail to clear the rack/tie rod ends since that space is less now with the sectioned cross member. I plan on doing something similar to what you are asking about, but I am no where near ready to do that....

[greengrenade]

Yea i saw how the bracket sets on that lower lip. Tie rod notches are no prob, just didnt want to get into raising the whole engine and trans. Do you have any way to get in touch with the guy from no limit ? is he a member on here or should i just email him ? Ive seen a few guys running there rack on a pancaked crossmember but no one got into technical info

[greengrenade]

Alright so were back at it this weekend. Started off with the step notches, these were thor bros notches and were horrible quality. Supposed to be 3/16 but only the side plates were 3/16, everything else was 10 ga. I ended up making my own plates for the under side of the notches. I also did 4 plug welds on the outside of each end of the notch




Cut out recesses on the back side of the notch for the bridge bar/shock mount






I then fabbed up boxing plates out of 3/16" about a foot long behind the notch and maybe a foot and a half long in front of it. Im also going to fish plate the inside of the step notch onto the boxing plate, do multiple plug welds and weld the perimeter of the fish plate





Then i ran out of welding gas lol. Im hoping i can find some gas tomorrow but i doubt it since its sunday. Heres a few mockups of the truck layed out. We also cut out the stock crossmember under the rear of the cab. Plan is to start fabbing up the 4 link crossmembers, link and bag brackets when we get welding gas

[[JP]]

Nice welding work!!!

[chad64chevy]

wow! nice truck to start with, an you guys are moving along quick! nice belair too

[greengrenade]

Can anyone give me a ball park front rear weight distribution for a c10 of this year ? Im gonna use the center of the camshaft as the center of gravity height, but id like to know a general idea of where the Weight distribution split is along the wheelbase, so i can find my center of gravity point to calculate the 4 link setup. Id like to set the 4 link up as well as possible to get it to hook decent at ride height, or as well as i can get it to hook for a truck on air. It wont be run on the track, but id like to put the power down as effecient as possible. If i can get a ballpark idea on my COG point i can setup my instant center at a point on the anti squat line and get my rear roll centre calculated as well. Or at least get it close enough to help it put the power down better

[greengrenade]

Curb weight for a 66 in stock trim is ~3,500 lbs. Between the boxing plates and notch id figure ~60 lbs, 4 link and burly crossmembers, all of our air ride components will be under the bed and im also fabbing a raised steel bed floor so im figuring 150-200 lbs heavier in the rear than stock, plus from what ive gathered the lq9/t56 combo is around 150-200 lbs heavier than the 230/3 speed combo. With the 20" steelies etc we should be close to 4,000 lbs but still have a weight split close to the stock spec. From the few auto x threads etc ive seen discussing weight distribution it seems 60/40 is a good guess. If anyone has any other input please chime in

[aggie91]

Originally Posted by greengrenade

Yea i saw how the bracket sets on that lower lip. Tie rod notches are no prob, just didnt want to get into raising the whole engine and trans. Do you have any way to get in touch with the guy from no limit ? is he a member on here or should i just email him ? Ive seen a few guys running there rack on a pancaked crossmember but no one got into technical info

Rob is a member here "robnolimit"

Here is his other contact info, I have spoken to him on the phone when I did not rack conversion. Very helpful.

No Limit Engineering
1001 Epco Dr
Dandridge, TN 37725

Tech Help Line: (865) 940-1503

[greengrenade]

Does anyone have any opinions on lower link angle from a side view ? I know general rule of thumb is level with the ground at ride height, but id like to kick them up a few degrees and change my instant center point slightly to get a better hook. How much can i angle them up without effecting roll steer ?


Also thanks for the no limit contact info 👌🏼

[greengrenade]

Got my fish plates done today, 5 plug welds on each one plus the perimeter welded. They turned out nice. Boxing plates are also fully welded in now. Frame should be plenty strong





Im setting my links on jackstands right now to get an idea of my angles. The most angle i can get is about 45 degrees between the 2 links which ive heard is a minimum. I could shorten them and get more angle but i dont wanna go to short and lose ride quality. Any thoughts ?

[greengrenade]

We changed the plans, decided on a parallel 4 link, ordered new upper bars, same length as the lowers and have a panhard bar on the way as well.

[greengrenade]

Well since we are waiting on new upper links for the rear we decided to start the front end. Got the front clip removed yesterday





Then we snatched the motor n trans out



Then disassembled the front suspension and removed the crossmember





Although the crossmember was cleaned in this pic, it was covered in almost a half inch of oil, dirt, mud and grime. The control arms werent much better. After all that we prepped and rattle bombed the firewall black






Now are you guys just redrilling all the mounting holes when you slide the crossmember forward 1" ? Are you filling the old holes or just letting them stay where they are ? Im still waiting to hear from rob from no limit about mounting his rack on a pancaked crossmember, i sent him a message and hope to hear back soon

[greengrenade]

I got in touch with no limit and they said the rack mount should work with a pancaked crossmember. After a quick mockup i quickly saw that wasnt the case at all. As you can see the upper bolt holes are no where close to usable



Also the front mounting hole in the center isnt usable, at least not to my liking. It wasnt on a flat part of the crossmember face, but more on the radius edge since we pancaked it, so i drilled a new hole lower



Now to address the mounting tabs i welded on new tabs to fit the sectioned crossmember




Cut the old tabs off and started to redrill new mounting holes.....




This was the almost finished product......




After this i decided i was gonna weld the bracket on instead of bolt it on. I also welded the large mounting stud on to the lower bracket from the back side so i wouldnt have to mess with threading a nut on behind the bracket between the crossmember. Seemed like a silly design. We are currently catching hell with the steering linkage, ive triple checked my measurements and it just isnt lining up, we also caught a little trouble with some of the hardware etc in the kit. Not trying to bash no limit just giving feedback. But heres the rack mounted up, seems super sturdy. Just trying to solve our linkage problem now

[62stepside longbox]

Nice work this thing is going to turn on a dime

[tinydb84]

Great progress. That is how a sectioned crossmember should be done!

[greengrenade]

Thanks guys

[greengrenade]

We slid the crossmember forward an inch as well to center the wheels in the wheelwell. I bought a new 1/2" chuck milwaukee drill because my old makita took a dump. Me and my buddy almost broke our wrist drilling all the new frame holes multiple times. That milwaukee is a savage, crazy torque haha