Tbi swap build thread

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

The 6 cylinder engine mount towers in your ’70 C10 will not work. If you plan on using the G-van or any of the newer style exhaust manifolds you will need either 67-72 big block towers or use 73-87 2wd towers like I did on my ’72.

Engine mount towers. Stupid

[phase_one]

I have some block hugger headers but yes I'm trying to get the engine mounted to the truck and it is giving me trouble.

[79blazer]

I did a TBI swap on my Caprice a couple years ago. Donor vehicle was a 88 truck. I was fortunate to have the complete factory service manual, including complete wiring diagram book. I did reorganize wires, so that FI input/output were together, all other wiring separate.

After much research, I found that the ford E2000 Inline fuel pump works good. It is capable of much higher pressures than a stock TBI requires, yet it doesn't flow too much to where a 5/16 return line would cause over pressure. It runs cool, an doesn't draw too much amps. You can use quick connections, or clamp hoses to it. I doubled clamped. I bought two (one for spare) for $30 at a pick-and-pull I think. It was in many Ford vehicles, so it was easy to find. http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductG...rtnumber=E2000 One advantage is you wouldn't have to drop the tank to repair it, should it fail. Buy it used cheap (try to find a newer, cleaner one) or instantly, no shipping necessary.

The sock filter in the tank also acts like a baffle.

Disadvantage to some inline pumps (some times the e2000 too, according to my research) they may be difficult to prime. As in: if you run out of gas, it may be hard to get fuel pressure back. That is because they are better at pumping fuel, than drawing a vacuum.

There's pro's and con's to everything. I am glad I used a old harness, because I learned alot about fuel injection when I did it.

Man reading this thread brings back memories of when I did mine! Mine was a 7747 ECM too. For example a simple brass male/female 90 degree elbow from Homedepot works for the oil pressure sensor.

[cjracing15]

Well I have got a few update pics for ya. I have run all my wires, mounted the computer, I have even tested the fuel pump in the tank and ses light to see if it worked. Well as soon as I hooked the battery back up the fuel pump relay clicked on so first test done. Then I put a hose from the tank into a bucket and hooked the fuel pump wire and a ground wire. Then I hooked up the ses wire ( I am going to use the old choke light for the ses light because I will not need a choke light anymore). Well I took a deep breath with my dad watching the the bucket that I had the hose in and turn the key to the on position. To my delight the ses light came on like it was suppose to and dad said that the pump came on for about 3 sec's and shut off.

So my next project is to run the F.I. fuel lines and install the other tank and see what happens.

Here are a few pics that I took for every-one.

1st. pic Is the computer monted under the dash and the wires run to it.
2nd. pic Is the fuel pump relay mounted on the fire wall.
3rd pic is the fuel pump pump plate that I stole off of the suburban. Had to take off one side of the accs brackets to take the pump off.

The last two are of all the wires run on the engine and, I stuck the breather up there just to see how it would look. After I repaint it I think it will look stock, witch is what I am going for.

I am going to start on the fuel lines Monday and I will update with pics later next week.

Stay tune.

[DirtyLarry]

Cj,

That is coming together nicely!

[cjracing15]

Thanks my good man.

[rfmaster]

Nice progress.
FYI - do not forget to use EFI rated fuel hoses clamps when plumbing your system. Even though TBI system is rated for 13 to 15 PSI operating many pumps are capable of delivering 30+ when deadhead.

So, what's on your XMAS wish list??

//RF

[phase_one]

What fuel tanks are yall guys using? I got my engine out of a van and that tank is too large, but the fuel sending unit on it is new a was hoping to use the unit. Just wondering what you guys are doing?

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by rfmaster

Nice progress.
FYI - do not forget to use EFI rated fuel hoses clamps when plumbing your system. Even though TBI system is rated for 13 to 15 PSI operating many pumps are capable of delivering 30+ when deadhead.

So, what's on your XMAS wish list??

//RF

Thanks, Pick-up EFI hoses today but I am having a hard time finding the clamps for some reason. But the parts store I usually buy my parts from was closed today so I will check with them Friday.(I am sure they will have them) Also picked up a new pump to put in my tank this morning.
Thanks Jamie

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by phase_one

What fuel tanks are yall guys using? I got my engine out of a van and that tank is too large, but the fuel sending unit on it is new a was hoping to use the unit. Just wondering what you guys are doing?

I am using a used tank off of a 87 truck. you can use a frame mounted pump like some others have done on this thread. I am using the EFI tank because I have it and I want this to be a low buck swap.

[DirtyLarry]

Yep, me too. I am using a 1987 TBI fuel tank as well. The frame mounted pump didn’t work so well on my ’78 but on the ’72 it is working find so far.

Hey, Jamie… I have a few of those EFI hose clamps left over. The cheap Chinese hose claims I found at Autozone and Checker scared me as they were so flimsy so I wound up buy a box full from Napa. I’ll email you a few...

[rfmaster]

Originally Posted by DirtyLarry

I have a few of those EFI hose clamps left over. The cheap Chinese hose claims I found at Autozone and Checker scared me as they were so flimsy so I wound up buy a box full from Napa. I’ll email you a few...

I second this as well - worst yet the garbage Chinese made hose clamps are prone to rust through - I had several fail before. A while back I took the failed clamps to my failure analysis engineer for failure analysis. He told me that they used 'pot' steel and cheap cadmium plating to make it look shiny. Once the set screw striped off surface plating rust started immediately. It's a good thing we found in time during our annual maintenance cycle. End up getting some Ideal clamps - these are wider (5/16") than normal hose clamps and have beveled edges and solid clamping face that does not bite into the rubber hose. Look for them in specialty industrial supply places or online.
http://www.autobarn.net/iddifuincl.html
If you are really serious (or paranoia) - use marine grade 304SS clamps - but these are very expensive for automotive use and will last a long time!

//RF

[cjracing15]

I have had bad luck with the cheap clamps and DO NOT use them any more. I will hold off a few days untill I can get some real ones at the good parts house here in town. ( but thanks for the link for auto barn i will check them out.)
I hardly buy anything anywhere else in town unless it is after hours and I HAVE TO. I hate the cheap crap,.. you waste your time and money with it.

Larry if you can find out a way of E-Mailing those clamps go ahead and send them.

Thanks, Jamie

[cjracing15]

Well I got a little futher along today. I finnally got all the under hood wires and under the dash wires run.
I droped the stock tank and, it is a good thing I did it was just about to rust through. I changed out the old stock pump in my EFI tank with a new pump and, ran my lines from the tank to the switching valve. Also ran the lines along the frame up to the throtle body.

I pluged in my cluster and wired my Check engine light and turned on the ignition and presto all my lights worked.

All I like now is installing my EFI tank, wire the pump, change the orings for the throttle body gas lines, put my pullys back on the engine. Then fire that mother up!

Pics tomarrow.(I left the camera at dads shop)

[78 Chevyrado]

Lookin good! nice work!

[cjracing15]

Thanks .

[rfmaster]

Any further updates on your conversion (all done I suppose) ???

//RF

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by rfmaster

Any further updates on your conversion (all done I suppose) ???

//RF

Not done yet I have run into a little problem with it. I have had it running and it ran great but for some reason It has stopped gitting fuel to the injectors and since I have went backed to work I have not had any time to get back and check anything. It has a brand new pump in the tank so I don't know why it has quit but I HOPE to get back to it Sat. If I can stop having to running calls long enuff. I am a hvac thec for a rather large contractor for this area and we have been swamped with calls since I got back. (Globlal Warming my A**.) This is the coldest it has been around here in at least five years.

Anyway I will have an update when I get time to work on it. Thanks for asking. ,Jamie

[DirtyLarry]

Jamie, I was wondering about your project as well. Keep us posted. I bet whatever is wrong turns out to be something simple.

You're right it is cold here! I am in Nashville this week and I was surprised how cold it is here. I didn’t know TN got this damn cold. Good business for a HVAC tech though!

[cjracing15]

I will keep you guys posted I promise. Worked 13 &1/2 hours Friday, 9 on monday, 14 Tuesday, 9 Today. I didn't work this much last summer . It shoud slow down starting tomarow. It is going to be up in the high 50's.

I hope it is, I need a break. My hair is turning more gray by the hour at this rate .

[rfmaster]

Originally Posted by cjracing15

Not done yet I have run into a little problem with it. I have had it running and it ran great but for some reason It has stopped gitting fuel to the injectors and since I have went backed to work I have not had any time to get back and check anything. It has a brand new pump in the tank so I don't know why it has quit but I HOPE to get back to it Sat. If I can stop having to running calls long enuff. I am a hvac thec for a rather large contractor for this area and we have been swamped with calls since I got back. (Globlal Warming my A**.) This is the coldest it has been around here in at least five years.

Anyway I will have an update when I get time to work on it. Thanks for asking. ,Jamie

You can verify that FP is functioning couple of ways.

1) When you cycle ignition key from off to run ECM goes through a POST routine during which FP relay is energized for about 2-3 seconds (you shouls be able to hear it run) and subsequently turn off. If all other test check out SES goes from solid - blinks off and turns back on solid until engine starts (after cranking). During cranking FP should be energized.

It is rare, but 7747 ECM have been know to loose FP relay circuit driver transistor (2N2907 ) when FP relay is shorted to ground.

2)To verify if FP is functional you can force FP relay into a test operation via bypass, fuel system prime pig tail at the FP relay socket.

[cjracing15]

Originally Posted by rfmaster

You can verify that FP is functioning couple of ways.

1) When you cycle ignition key from off to run ECM goes through a POST routine during which FP relay is energized for about 2-3 seconds (you shouls be able to hear it run) and subsequently turn off. If all other test check out SES goes from solid - blinks off and turns back on solid until engine starts (after cranking). During cranking FP should be energized.

It is rare, but 7747 ECM have been know to loose FP relay circuit driver transistor (2N2907 ) when FP relay is shorted to ground.

2)To verify if FP is functional you can force FP relay into a test operation via bypass, fuel system prime pig tail at the FP relay socket.

Well the Fuel pump is running. I get gas up to the throtle body on the supply line but it just spits gas out the injector. I can pour gas in the tb and it will run untill it runs out of gas???

[rfmaster]

Gas to TB is good. If injectors are not spraying during cranking there are couple of possible problems.

1) Disconnect both injectors from harness. Check the +B (red and green???) injector wire - it should be +12 when ignition key is on and during cranking.

2) If you have +12V on red wire reconnect injectors, get a +12 volt low current test light (or fast DVM). Probe both injector pins (red and green and red and blue - colors are typical, but maybe different) - red should be a steady +12, while the other side should pulse on-off-on during cranking. No pulse indicates that's ECM is not pulling line low. There are couple of possibilities.


//RF

[bigtruck81]

could also use some injector noid lights.

[408cuda]

Hi guys. Found this site after extensively searching the web on TBI swaps and it seems like a great source of info. I am in the process of converting a friends 59 Chevy Apache pickup from a straight 6 to 350 TBI out of an 88 Chevy 2wd pickup. We are using the donor rigs wiring harness. Anyway, I have the mounts fabbed and engine in and and getting close to trying to wire it up. We stripped the harness and all sensors from the donor but the part I am having trouble understanding is what exactly I need to power up for wires from the harness? I plan to add a 6 lug fuse block just for this purpose. I have some wiring diagrams that are helpful, but don't know what wires I NEED hooked to the fuse block, or elsewhere? We are using the 5 speed manual from donor as well and since we are using the stock wiring do I need to do anything to work the VSS? . For a gas tank we were thinking of an 88 Blazer which dimensionally looks doable, and takes the same pump/wiring etc..

Thanks for your time,
Chad